.358 AR

[Scotmak]

I read a couple of posts about someone putting together a AR using a .358 legal for deer hunting here in Indiana. I would very much like to do the same thing. If anyone has any information on how to go about doing this I would very much appreciate the guidance and advise. Thanks.

 

[42769vette]

contact bfg firarms. they are a advertiser here and can answer all your questions.

 

[Scotmak]

Thanks vette, I believe that name was mentioned in the thread I read. I sent them two emails and never got a response.

 

[42769vette]

he has a normal job and will get back to you this evening. i think his website lists a phone number

 

[melensdad]

There are 2 358 caliber AR rounds of which I am aware. Both can be had from BFG Cartridge.

The 35 Gremlin (358 Gremlin) is a 6.5 Grendel necked up to 358 caliber and has ballistics similar to the 35 Remington. LINK => 358 Gremlin, the 9x39 USA


The 358 BFG (358 WSSM) is a WSSM case necked up to 358, then slightly shortened to make it comply with Indiana length laws. It offers longer range than the Gremlin due to the added powder capacity of the fat WSSM case.
LINK => BFG Design - 358 BFG WSSM


If you are interested in either, contact Bryan at BFG => BFG Design, Wildcat Cartridge Design, Custom Barrels, Brass, Bullets and Dies.

 

[Scotmak]

When I said I sent two emails, this was weeks ago. I will give him another shout. Thanks guys! Have either or you had a opportunity to shoot any of these rounds?

 

[melensdad]

I've not shot either of those, I've shot some of the bullets in other calibers he's provided me and I have a custom AR upper that he built and used for development and testing. He's full of information, if you can get in touch with him.

I'd suggest sending him a PM through INGO and also an Email through his website. He is often out of town.

 

[Scotmak]

Awesome! So you trust him and he can provide a quality product. Sounds like the person I need to talk to.

 

[CountryBoy19]

Awesome! So you trust him and he can provide a quality product. Sounds like the person I need to talk to.

Absolutely, as mentioned, he is a site sponsor, and many members have had him do work for them if I'm not mistaken.

I haven't done any direct business with him, but he is very knowledgeable and his posts are always very accurate and full of good info.

 

[42769vette]

i cant tell you how long he has spent on the phone talking to me about his products. i know one person who was extreamly pleased with his 458bfg.

im hoping to do some business with him in the next few days

 

[melensdad]

Awesome! So you trust him and he can provide a quality product. Sounds like the person I need to talk to.

Yes you can trust him.

Yes he has a quality product.

Yes he is someone you should talk to.

I've had a couple dealings with him, he and I are pretty local to each other, and we've even had the opportunity to sit and talk while smoking a good cigar. He's genuinely a very nice guy, he is also packed full of both practical + theoretical ballistics information.

If it was me and if I was building a 358 caliber AR15 gun, I'd be using the smaller 6.5 Grendel case rather than the larger capacity WSSM case. The Grendel case allows for much easier parts sourcing while the WSSM case pretty much limits you to some fairly proprietary parts from only 1 supplier. Yes the 358 WSSM case would push the bullet faster and offer more practical range, but this is Indiana and the deer in my back yard are all reasonably short range shots. The 35 Gremlin would offer, at least for the deer I commonly see, more than enough lethal/ethical range, out to roughly 200 yards. Recoil would also be lower with the 35 Gremlin.

 

[fireball168]

Thanks for the kind words guys.

My apologies if I missed an email.

Its getting to the point here lately where I'll get 20-50 emails a day from folks who can "maximize my web presence" and/or honked off PETA supporters. I'm sure some "real" folks are getting missed, and that isn't a good thing for anybody.

To your question - all three of the .358's that CAN or COULD be currently offered in an AR have some of their own distinct concerns.

The .358 Gremlin(6.5 Grendel/7.62x39 brass) and 357 Herrett/BFG(6.8 SPC brass) have their issues with feeding from the magazines. Ideally, we'd have a magazine front rib that was at or near .060" protrusion. The best bet at the moment are PRI 6.8 magazines, although some of the incorrectly formed 6.5 Grendel magazines that AA has will work fairly decent. Neither feed well enough that I'd feel comfortably hunting something that could bite back with them. C-Products has been promising dedicated magazines for nearly two years, still have yet to receive one. Talking with PRI now about a run of dedicated ones as well.

The 358 BFG-WSSM can only be put together on an AR-15 using the Olympic Arms WSSM parts. Unfortunately, I'm not on their "good" list - so they won't sell me the parts. Buying a $700+ complete upper receiver, trashing the original barrel for the extension and fitting a barrel turns into real money, really quick. For the same money, you can have a nice bolt or single shot rifle, with optics - not even considering the cost of the lower. It can be done, but I think it is a hassle and way too much money for the quality of the upper components and the reduction in brass life. A good cottage industry could be created in making a high strength upper/bolt carrier/bolt and barrel extension for various wildcats.

Rant off. Hope that helped answer some of your questions. Feel free to contact me here, or through the website.

Bryan at bfgcartridges.com

 

[CountryBoy19]

The 358 BFG-WSSM can only be put together on an AR-15 using the Olympic Arms WSSM parts. Unfortunately, I'm not on their "good" list - so they won't sell me the parts.

Hmmm.... seems to me that we need to make a statement.

INGOers unite, lets all let Olympic know what we think about this problem.

 

[fireball168]

I appreciate the offer but some folks have undoubtedly worked hard to get where they are with Olympic.

This fellow offers a version of the 358 WSSM on the Olympic WSSM Upper.

http://www.dtechsuperstore.com/

I've never seen one of his products in person, have no idea what the chamber dimensions are, nor have I read any reports from his 358 users, so take it for what you will.

From what I've read of his on various forums, we have some different philisophical views on the WSSM cartridges - but that is what makes the world go round, or so I'm told.

 

[melensdad]

The 358 BFG-WSSM can only be put together on an AR-15 using the Olympic Arms WSSM parts. Unfortunately, I'm not on their "good" list - so they won't sell me the parts. . .

I've got a single contact well up the management team inside Oly and it won't do you any good. Oly sells to only 2 established companies that I know of and from what I can tell have no desire to expand their component sales.

 

[Scotmak]

So what do you guys think I would have wrapped up in building a complete AR. I would obviously like to have the best in performance rather then the highest velocity and longest shots. I'm really pretty new to rifles, always hunted with my trusty shot guns. I do want to put some more fun into hunting though. So in your personal experiences what round would be the most reliable in the field with a custom AR?

 

[worksalot]

It seems like this caliber has been sitting idle for awhile. It certainly interests me if anyone has some good info.