.40 cal bastard child?

[db1959]

I love my .40's too, plus if needed you can run a 9mm through 'em.

 

[Que]

I love my .40's too, plus if needed you can run a 9mm through 'em.

Best answer in the entire thread!

 

[mrortega]

I bought a G26 because I thought the snap of the 27 was a little strong. The 26 with 124+P Gold Dots turned out to be ever bit as snappy as the 180 gr .40. So with the same felt recoil I decided I'd rather put a heavier round into a BGs chest. I sold the 26 with no regrets.

 

[mrortega]

Best answer in the entire thread!

I can vouch for that! Don't lay your 26 and 27 next to each other on the shooting bench. I mixed up the mags and put the 26 mag into the 27. the gun didn't blow up but you definitely can't "fire-form" a 9mm case into a .40 case.

 

[cmamath13]

Shoot what you want. Carry what you want. Makes no matter to me.

For those wanting to get into the game for the first time, I personally steer people away from the .40 due to the higher chances for a "newby" not liking the recoil characteristics, then not wanting to practice / not like the gun / etc. (Same reason why I think it's foolish to recommend an airweight .38 revolver as an only gun for a new shooter)

I recently shot about 50rds through a brand new 3rd Gen G22. Hated every single shot. A few years ago, I shot a mag through either a G22 converted to .357 Sig or a G31 (don't know, didn't look close enough) And I had a blast.

I personally think that the M&P FS 9mm and the G17 are real honey pies. The M&P9c is quite nice, too. Never shot a G23, 27, or 26. Don't remember shooting my G19 enough to really have much of an opinion.

No caliber war on my end. I'm aware that, in general, they all suck.

But I know that I'm not giving up anything by carrying a puny 9mm.

-J-

 

[BehindBlueI's]

^THIS^ while statistically modern ammunion is suppose to "perform" in the real world it's murphy's Law that happens.

I tried to attach this to another topic but here is an afteraction report by the FBI on a shooting incident by a municipal PD in PA. the Officers used 40 cal amoung other rounds.

I recommend clicking on the black box and reading the whole story.

(WARNING IT HAS PICS)

FBI Ballistics Brief: Officer Involved Shooting Photos | Public Intelligence

I wonder if that's legitimately from the FBI. I mean, you can see the x-rays and if the bullets had penetrated deeper into his throat or the one that's level with the bottom of his heart it would show on the x-ray. Especially the one in his throat looks like its keyholed. The statements just don't seem to go with the pictures.

"It is impossible for .40 S&W 180 gr. JHP
ammunition to expand with only 1 in. or less
penetration in a human body."

Its not. This is where ballistic gel tests go awry. The first thing a bullet hits isn't always in direct contact with the gel. I've recovered fully expanded rounds that barely grazed a human body at all, but had hit an intermediate barrier first.

There is plenty of inaccurate information
regarding ballistics/terminal performance
disseminated on web forums, even those which are
dedicated as LE only.

Concur.

Shot placement is everything in a gunfight
and always the key to stopping a threat
effectively

BS. Shot placement obviously matters, but as the x-rays show even perfect shot placement, absent sufficient penetration, isn't a guarantee of anything. Bullets also don't always go straight in the body. Again, look at the x-rays. The one in his throat, unless it keyholed for some unknown reason, didn't get there by a straight line. Another X-ray shows two perfectly in line with the spine. If they had penetrated the spine, mechanically he's down. The top one is sideways, it surely didn't go in that way. The bottom one looks like it did go straight in, but the one next to it is surely deflected down as its mushroomed nicely but facing his feet. This is pretty typical. WE AREN'T MADE OF BALLISTIC GEL AND BULLETS DEFLECT AROUND INSIDE OF THE HUMAN BODY SOMETIMES.

The .40 S&W ammunition did not fail in this
incident.

How so? This isn't a critique of the caliber as any caliber will have its failures in some incidents, but it certainly appears it failed to stop in this incident. How do you define failure if it didn't?

Again, the .40 is a round I trust, but it certainly didn't have the desired affect in that encounter.

 

[in625shooter]

I wonder if that's legitimately from the FBI. I mean, you can see the x-rays and if the bullets had penetrated deeper into his throat or the one that's level with the bottom of his heart it would show on the x-ray. Especially the one in his throat looks like its keyholed. The statements just don't seem to go with the pictures.

"It is impossible for .40 S&W 180 gr. JHP
ammunition to expand with only 1 in. or less
penetration in a human body."

Its not. This is where ballistic gel tests go awry. The first thing a bullet hits isn't always in direct contact with the gel. I've recovered fully expanded rounds that barely grazed a human body at all, but had hit an intermediate barrier first.

There is plenty of inaccurate information
regarding ballistics/terminal performance
disseminated on web forums, even those which are
dedicated as LE only.

Concur.

Shot placement is everything in a gunfight
and always the key to stopping a threat
effectively

BS. Shot placement obviously matters, but as the x-rays show even perfect shot placement, absent sufficient penetration, isn't a guarantee of anything. Bullets also don't always go straight in the body. Again, look at the x-rays. The one in his throat, unless it keyholed for some unknown reason, didn't get there by a straight line. Another X-ray shows two perfectly in line with the spine. If they had penetrated the spine, mechanically he's down. The top one is sideways, it surely didn't go in that way. The bottom one looks like it did go straight in, but the one next to it is surely deflected down as its mushroomed nicely but facing his feet. This is pretty typical. WE AREN'T MADE OF BALLISTIC GEL AND BULLETS DEFLECT AROUND INSIDE OF THE HUMAN BODY SOMETIMES.

The .40 S&W ammunition did not fail in this
incident.

How so? This isn't a critique of the caliber as any caliber will have its failures in some incidents, but it certainly appears it failed to stop in this incident. How do you define failure if it didn't?

Again, the .40 is a round I trust, but it certainly didn't have the desired affect in that encounter.

It's a legitamit study. We recieved it several years ago from DOJ sources but this particular one is availible to the general public now which is the only reason I posted the link.

My point for posting is to show like I stated Murphy's Law is more of an indicator than anything. Yes you do your research and try to pick the best performer but until real shootings start getting researched no one really knows. We have all seen one shot stops with a 9mm and some multiple 45 hits and the perp is walking around like nothing and vis versa.

Like has been stated all standard service handgun rounds are weak stoppers and there is no 100% guarentee.

I am limited to 9mm work wise and I am Ok with that. If you like a 40 or 45 thats fine as well because when you factor in everything in actual shootings they all sort of average out. Sure there are cases where some work great and then where the same didn't work at all as advertised but when you average everything JHP to JHP it's pretty close.