M16-A1/A2 Hybrid Questions

[ZurokSlayer7X9]

So for years I've wanted to build an M16-A1 clone after I had my favorite airsoft gun (which was a DPMS branded m16-A1) broke when my cousin fell on top of it in the snow. Now that I know a little bit about ARs, I've decided I'd rather have and M16-A2 with the triangle handguard of the A1. So far I have an original handguard with the triangle front ring and barrel nut as well as the gas tube. Before I start getting the upper assembly parts, specifically the barrel, I'd like to be a little more certain that what I'm doing will work. Keep in mind, this is not meant to be a pure clone, but more of a Frankenstein of an M16-A2.

First is I do not plan on getting a pencil barrel, but a modern heavier profile barrel. I measured the barrel hole with calipers, and it gives me a +0.75" hole. Do I need a pencil barrel or could I use a heavier barrel that supports a 0.75" gas block?

Second is there any pitfalls with my plan here on using A1 handguards on an A2 build?

 

[Fallschirmjaeger]

Here’s a link to AR15.com in which someone did a build that sounds like what you are trying to do. Does this help?

My 2 A1 builds - AR15.COM

Firearm Discussion and Resources from AR-15, AK-47, Handguns and more! Buy, Sell, and Trade your Firearms and Gear.

www.ar15.com

 

[ZurokSlayer7X9]

Here’s a link to AR15.com in which someone did a build that sounds like what you are trying to do. Does this help?

My 2 A1 builds - AR15.COM

Firearm Discussion and Resources from AR-15, AK-47, Handguns and more! Buy, Sell, and Trade your Firearms and Gear.

www.ar15.com

It definitely answers by barrel question. Now when the "Front Sight Base" is mentioned, is that simply the front sight post and gas block?

 

[DDadams]

It definitely answers by barrel question. Now when the "Front Sight Base" is mentioned, is that simply the front sight post and gas block?

Yes, the front sight is the gas block

 

[Kalashalite]

This is barely relevant to your post, but you got me thinking about it so here ya go.

So for the past few years I've had an obsession with Retro AR building. I have handled every commonly encountered variant of the M16 clone from the XM16-M16A4. (Semi-automatic ones only, sadly)

This has led me to the conclusion that the PERFECT M16 Rifle (carbines aside) is as follows:

M16A1 Buttstock
M16A1 Pistol Grip
M16A2 Charging Handle
C7 Upper Receiver
M16A2 Rear Sight Aperature
M16A2 Round Handguards
M16A2 Front Sight Post
M16A2 Birdcage
20" Pencil Profile 1-9 Twist (If Pencil Profile is not available, Lightweight is good too) Basically an M16A1 barrel with A2 twist rate for shooting bullets heavier than 55gr. If you only plan on shooting 55gr, 1-12 is better.

What you get is a lightweight rifle with simple battle sights, shell deflector for your lefty buddies, upgraded round handguards (the triangles are fragile), upgraded charging handle, forward assist, a birdcage that kicks up less dust, perfect length of pull for most shooters around the 6' tall mark, a more comfortable grip in my opinion....etc.

Sadly, this is not quite a historical clone but the closest official Colt product would be the Colt 711, a full auto export model that the U.S. never adopted. It is pictured here:

Also pictured, is a reddit user's personal rifle (Not my image) who I complimented because he and I saw eye to eye:

 

[Kalashalite]

Also I believe the barrel profile you are looking for is going to be what they call Gov't Profile, it's the barrel for the M16A2 which has a .75"

I get mine from Del-Ton and they have been very good quality and price.

 

[INP8riot]

https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-pa-15-16-mid-length-5-56-nato-1-7-nitride-a2-ept-dissipator-rifle.html

Harrington & Richardson BLEM M16A2 Rifle w/ 20" Hammer Forged FN Barrel, Gray

Caliber: 5.56 NATOBarrel Length: 20"Barrel Profile: A2Barrel Finish: ParkerizedChrome Lining: YesMuzzle Thread: 1/2" x 28Twist: 1:7Barrel Extension: M4Gas System Length: RifleDiameter at Gas Block: .750"Gas Block Type: Rifle Height Front Sight BaseMuzzle Device: A2 Flash HiderReceiver Material...

palmettostatearmory.com

 

[Kalashalite]

H&R is certainly the best value for a strict clone already-built rifle. But I do find it strange that they are made with Harrington & Richardson markings on the A2 builds, that's not really a historical thing. It makes much more sense on the A1's but even that was limited during the Nam era. The FN barrel is NICE though, that's a big deal.

A guy could build a rifle just like that, minus the expensive finish, FN barrel and cloned lower for closer to $600-$800 range. PSA also makes a U.S. Property marked M16A2 lower in a black anodize for like $50 which I have used in the past. That's by far the best value for getting close to a clone.

 

[ZurokSlayer7X9]

I appreciate the responses so far. Didn't feel like going through the process of getting a jig and drilling a new barrel for an FSB, so I got a completed A2/A1 upper from a show. It has a modern A1 upper receiver (has forward assist and deflector, but A1 sights) with a heavy profile national match stainless steel barrel that came with the round A2 hand guards, which I've switched to my A1 hand guards. I may still get an A2 upper receiver at some point in the future, but this will do for now. Would like to get a St. Cloud Minnesota DPMS lower receiver to really complete my original design now.

 

[ZurokSlayer7X9]

H&R is certainly the best value for a strict clone already-built rifle. But I do find it strange that they are made with Harrington & Richardson markings on the A2 builds, that's not really a historical thing. It makes much more sense on the A1's but even that was limited during the Nam era. The FN barrel is NICE though, that's a big deal.

A guy could build a rifle just like that, minus the expensive finish, FN barrel and cloned lower for closer to $600-$800 range. PSA also makes a U.S. Property marked M16A2 lower in a black anodize for like $50 which I have used in the past. That's by far the best value for getting close to a clone.

I have to agree with this sentiment. That's an awesome barrel, but I have to agree you don't have to pay $1300 if you are willing to build it yourself. This build is by far not a purist clone, but more of me trying to relive my childhood by building something that resembles that airsoft gun in my OP as much as possible (except for me desiring an A2 upper receiver).

 

[YoungMilsurpGuy]

I would say i'd you are spending more then a Grand, get a Fulton Armory upper.

I built some bastardized OG m16 604rifle that I put A2 Handguards on so it looks like a mixmaster air force/Royal Hong Kong Constabulary Rifle

Their criterion barrels are just money, with this gun even with the thin barrel and 55 grain ammo it outshoots me and I won 1 or two CMP matches with it down in texas

 

[Kalashalite]

I would say i'd you are spending more then a Grand, get a Fulton Armory upper.

I built some bastardized OG m16 604rifle that I put A2 Handguards on so it looks like a mixmaster air force/Royal Hong Kong Constabulary Rifle

Their criterion barrels are just money, with this gun even with the thin barrel and 55 grain ammo it outshoots me and I won 1 or two CMP matches with it down in texas

That is such a sweet rifle dude!

Not a rifle...but here's my current carbine, also in an Air Force theme, kind of a GAU-5 at home build, 11.5" lightweight 1-9 w/ 5.5" p&w feaux moderator, just on an Anderson for now. I'm obsessed with the light weight and handiness of it.

 

[YoungMilsurpGuy]

That is such a sweet rifle dude!

Not a rifle...but here's my current carbine, also in an Air Force theme, kind of a GAU-5 at home build, 11.5" lightweight 1-9 w/ 5.5" p&w feaux moderator, just on an Anderson for now. I'm obsessed with the light weight and handiness of it.

One of the best rifles i want to build is a colt 733 SBR like the Heat/Blood Diamond/black hawk down delta rifle because im a sucker for cold war/1990s
drip

Hell im even thinking of going deer hunting with a PTR-91

 

[Kalashalite]

One of the best rifles i want to build is a colt 733 SBR like the Heat/Blood Diamond/black hawk down delta rifle because im a sucker for cold war/1990s
drip

Hell im even thinking of going deer hunting with a PTR-91

Yes same here, my eventual homestead carbine of choice will be a mocked up Blood Diamond type build, with an illuminated reticle micro-prism, white light and rattle can paint job.


The PTR-91 GI is very high on my list of must haves. Semi-related: I got my first deer with my M1 Garand. I don't think I'll use anything but military rifles in the future, it's just too fun.

 

[BrettonJudy7]

So for years I've wanted to build an M16-A1 clone after I had my favorite airsoft gun (which was a DPMS branded m16-A1) broke when my cousin fell on top of it in the snow. Now that I know a little bit about ARs, I've decided I'd rather have and M16-A2 with the triangle handguard of the A1. So far I have an original handguard with the triangle front ring and barrel nut as well as the gas tube. Before I start getting the upper assembly parts, specifically the barrel, I'd like to be a little more certain that what I'm doing will work. Keep in mind, this is not meant to be a pure clone, but more of a Frankenstein of an M16-A2.

First is I do not plan on getting a pencil barrel, but a modern heavier profile barrel. I measured the barrel hole with calipers, and it gives me a +0.75" hole. Do I need a pencil barrel or could I use a heavier barrel that supports a 0.75" gas block?

Second is there any pitfalls with my plan here on using A1 handguards on an A2 build?

So when you say "m16-A2" do you mean you want the A2 upper, and A2 style barrel, with everything else being A1?

I have a Windham Weaponry "A1-ish". It has a C7 upper, but it also has a heavy barrel like an A2.

 

[Kalashalite]

So when you say "m16-A2" do you mean you want the A2 upper, and A2 style barrel, with everything else being A1?

I have a Windham Weaponry "A1-ish". It has a C7 upper, but it also has a heavy barrel like an A2.

Nice duckbill flash hider!

 

[BrettonJudy7]

Nice duckbill flash hider!

It's a nice little "A1" touch.

 

[ZurokSlayer7X9]

So when you say "m16-A2" do you mean you want the A2 upper, and A2 style barrel, with everything else being A1?

I have a Windham Weaponry "A1-ish". It has a C7 upper, but it also has a heavy barrel like an A2.

My OP was more geared towards me getting parts as I went along and assembling the upper myself when I had everything. I just wanted to ensure my design would work before I started to order anything, because I had little experience with anything other than flat tops and low profile gas blocks. The original intent was to effectively build an A2, with only the handguard being A1. Since then I've acquired an upper that pretty much matches the pictures you provided, except with a regular bird cage flash hider, nickel boron BCG, and stainless steel national match barrel. Still would like to change the A1 upper receiver to an A2 as I originally intended, but in the process of installing a new furnace so new gun parts are out of the question for a while.

 

[BrettonJudy7]

My OP was more geared towards me getting parts as I went along and assembling the upper myself when I had everything. I just wanted to ensure my design would work before I started to order anything, because I had little experience with anything other than flat tops and low profile gas blocks. The original intent was to effectively build an A2, with only the handguard being A1. Since then I've acquired an upper that pretty much matches the pictures you provided, except with a regular bird cage flash hider, nickel boron BCG, and stainless steel national match barrel. Still would like to change the A1 upper receiver to an A2 as I originally intended, but in the process of installing a new furnace so new gun parts are out of the question for a while.

I feel that. I've got a stripped A2 upper sitting in my closet that I'm waiting until after Christmas to build out.

Yeah essentially you just need to make sure you get an fsb that matches your barrel size, and the correct delta ring for the triangle handguards as well.

Sounds you got it figured out though.
I love all things carry handle, so I'd love to see it when you get it finished.