muzleloader FFL transfer?

[Delmar]

A friend of mine is sending me a .50 CVA muzzleloader, for the cost of shipping. Is it true that FFL transfer is not required on a black powder gun? If so can he ship the gun directly to my home address!

here is the rifle
https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._primers_dried_up_completly-4.html#post445050

 

[hotfarmboy1]

That is correct no FFL needed. You can buy them from cabelas and such by mail and they can ship directly to you.

 

[RelicHound]

as far as I know he can send it straight to your home..no transfer needed.

 

[Delmar]

That is awesome!

 

[2cool9031]

Yep....bought one from Gander Mountain...and they shipped it right to the door.

 

[Indyvet]

Yep. What everyone else said. Muzzeloaders are exempt and you are good to go.

 

[GJ1981]

Muzzeloaders are exempt

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here, but since when are inline muzzleloaders exempt? All the sites I've seen require an FFL for purchase. I know traditional ML's are exempt but I have always known inline's to go on a 4473...has this changed?

 

[Mgderf]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here, but since when are inline muzzleloaders exempt? All the sites I've seen require an FFL for purchase. I know traditional ML's are exempt but I have always known inline's to go on a 4473...has this changed?

The ONLY muzzle loaders I know of that need transfers are ones that may be interchangeable to other calibers, ie... Thompson Center Contender/ Encore can be purchased as a muzzle loader, HOWEVER, they can be changed to a center fire rifle, or even handgun by simply changing a barrel.
THESE require an FFL transfer. "Traditional Muzzle loaders" do NOT need a transfer. EVEN in-lines!

 

[Indyvet]

I went through the regulation books I have and what Mgderf said is true. Any other muzzleloader black powder firearm does not require a 4473. You can go into any establishment that sells black powder rifles, pay for it and walk out the door. I am not sure or clear on the shipping of it though. That would be my question. I know that the post office requires a form to be filled out and it has to be filled out and shipped by an ffl. I am not sure for ups. It may just have to be declared and I do believe that it has to be overnighted.

 

[Doug]

Yes, all the above is true because of FEDERAL law. No transfer paperwork is required by Indiana state law.
HOWEVER, as far as I know, they are still considered firearms by state law. You could not, for example, legally carry a black powder handgun without a LTCH.

Correct me if I am wrong...

Doug

 

[Indyvet]

I also read that if you are a convicted violent felon or have any other disqualifying reason that you can not own a firearm that if you are caught with a black powder gun you can be in the same amount of trouble as if caught with a regular firearm. Not 100% on this but I can see the reasoning behind it.

 

[pftraining_in]

ANNOUNCEMENT 98-7

MUZZLE LOADING WEAPONS THAT USE A MODERN IGNITION SYSTEM

On November 6, 1997, the Director signed Industry Circular No. 98-2. It read as follows:

All Federal firearms licensees and others concerned.

Purpose. The purpose of this circular is to clarify the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) position regarding the classification of muzzle loading weapons that use modern primers for ignition.
ATF has recently received a number of inquiries regarding whether “in line” muzzle loading weapons that have been designated or redesigned to use modern firearm primers are classified as firearms under the Gun Control Act. An “in line” muzzle loading weapon is a muzzle loading firearm designed such that the firing mechanism (striker) is located directly behind the barrel. The striker moves forward in line with the bore of the weapon.

Background. Section 921 (a) (3) (A), Title 18, U.S.C., defines the term firearm to include any weapon (including a starter gun) which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive. The frame or receiver of any such weapon is also a firearm as defined. However, antique firearms are excluded from this definition.
Section 921 (a) (16), Title 18, U.S.C., defines the term antique firearm as:

(A) any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and


(B) any replica of any firearm described in subparagraph (A) if such replica


(i)is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or
(ii) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

Section 921 (a) (17) (A), Title 18, U.S.C., defines the term ammunition to include cartridge cases, primers, bullets and propellant powder designed for use in any firearms.
Discussion. The cited definitions make it clear that weapons actually manufactured in or before 1898 are not subject to regulation as firearms. Further, modern replicas of antique firearms using an antique form of ignition such as matchlock, flintlock, or percussion cap are also not subject to regulation as firearms.
However, muzzle loading weapons with “in line” firing mechanisms designed or redesigned to use modern conventional firearm primers do not meet the definition of antique firearms and are subject to regulation as a firearm. Primers are not an antique ignition system and are ammunition for firearms subject to regulation.
Inquiries. Inquiries concerning this circular should refer to its number and be addressed to: Chief, Firearms Technology Branch, Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, 650 Massachusetts Avenue, NW., Washington, DC 20226.

Quarterly Bulletin

 

[Remington1100]

I used to have a black powder .44 pistol and i asked numerous police officers and dnr officers if i had to have a ltch to carry it and they said as long as there were no caps on it, it could be completely loaded and still be legal.

 

[pftraining_in]

I used to have a black powder .44 pistol and i asked numerous police officers and dnr officers if i had to have a ltch to carry it and they said as long as there were no caps on it, it could be completely loaded and still be legal.

That is correct as far as Indiana law in concerned, however Federal law states that a black powder pistol is still a pistol.

 

[xHwyLT]

A friend of mine is sending me a .50 CVA muzzleloader, for the cost of shipping. Is it true that FFL transfer is not required on a black powder gun? If so can he ship the gun directly to my home address!

here is the rifle
https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo..._primers_dried_up_completly-4.html#post445050

The answer depends on the state or city you reside in. If you are unfortunate enough to reside in the state of NJ or the City of NY, among others, then you need an FFL. I found it real easy to check Gander Mountains shipping restrictions to see where an FFL may be required. If they won't ship it to you, you probably need an FFL for your location.

 

[zipper89]

Thompson center encore is the only black powder that needs to be ffl. the rest can be shipped directly 2 your house