police should approch school violence, like a fireman does with a fire

[tradertator]

police should approach school violence, like a fireman does with a fire

I read this article tonight that a friend posted on a social media site, and really enjoyed it. It's a bit of a long read, but I I think it's worth it. Like most of you, I don't believe the solution to these violent acts is disarming the law abiding citizens of our great nation. Last I check, murder was illegal. Drugs and prostitution too, yet they are readily available if your willing to break the rules. Firearms would be the same way, only instead, controlled by a criminal element much like alcohol shortly after prohibition.

I can't help but to wonder if there might have been a different outcome, if the principle of Sandy Brook Elementary that stood up to this gunman unarmed had access to a firearm. It made a difference in the Pearl River, MS school shooting. It made a difference in the Oregon Mall shooting. When are we going to learn that Gun Free Zones create a safe haven for those hell bent on destruction?

Active shooters in schools: The enemy is denial

 

[j706]

I read this article tonight that a friend posted on a social media site, and really enjoyed it. It's a bit of a long read, but I I think it's worth it. Like most of you, I don't believe the solution to these violent acts is disarming the law abiding citizens of our great nation. Last I check, murder was illegal. Drugs and prostitution too, yet they are readily available if your willing to break the rules. Firearms would be the same way, only instead, controlled by a criminal element much like alcohol shortly after prohibition.

I can't help but to wonder if there might have been a different outcome, if the principle of Sandy Brook Elementary that stood up to this gunman unarmed had access to a firearm. It made a difference in the Pearl River, MS school shooting. It made a difference in the Oregon Mall shooting. When are we going to learn that Gun Free Zones create a safe haven for those hell bent on destruction?

Active shooters in schools: The enemy is denial

I attended one of the colonel's classes a few years ago. We were actually in the same army unit at the same time in the 1980's. I found some of my old orders that had his name on them. He was an officer and i was enlisted and do not recall having ever met him until his class.Nice guy and very intelligent with common sense. I attempted to share what I learned with my agency (that sent me). I got sent to sensitivity training for my trouble.....true story. Even police departments are in denial.

The man knows what he is talking about. However his teachings make some people very uncomfortable and pass it off as paranoia. Someday people will get tired of these slaughters and hopefully wake up.

 

[tradertator]

I couldn't agree more. Also, thanks for your service to our country and community. The denial that evil exist needs to be abolished, especially by our leaders in public safety. No amount of gun control, gun free zones, happy thoughts and unicorn farts are going to stop the monsters like the one we met last Friday. Connecticut has gun bans in place much like the ones our nations leaders are proposing to be reinstated, yet this shooting still happened. Many prohibited things like drugs, are readily available if only one is willing to wager the risk. Weapons would be no different. Why would we leave our most precious sheep (our children) in a building, and demand there be no sheep dog? His anology in that article about the Columbine library being a "fish bowl", sent chills up my spine.

I don't know what the solution is. Honoring concealed carry in schools is no doubt going to be met with extreme opposition. Many schools can barely afford to operate on their current budget, let alone afford an armed guard to be added to their payroll. Maybe the solution is sending school administrators through a training program similar to our Pre Basic 40 Hour Law Enforcement course, thus granting them the training, power and tools to stop a threat with deadly force. I can speak from personal experience, because I myself have went through it. I wasn't paid, and did it on my own time, locally through my police department. Minimally invasive, and didn't require much time out of my schedule.

 

[j706]

I couldn't agree more. Also, thanks for your service to our country and community. The denial that evil exist needs to be abolished, especially by our leaders in public safety. No amount of gun control, gun free zones, happy thoughts and unicorn farts are going to stop the monsters like the one we met last Friday. Connecticut has gun bans in place much like the ones our nations leaders are proposing to be reinstated, yet this shooting still happened. Many prohibited things like drugs, are readily available if only one is willing to wager the risk. Weapons would be no different. Why would we leave our most precious sheep (our children) in a building, and demand there be no sheep dog? His anology in that article about the Columbine library being a "fish bowl", sent chills up my spine.

I don't know what the solution is. Honoring concealed carry in schools is no doubt going to be met with extreme opposition. Many schools can barely afford to operate on their current budget, let alone afford an armed guard to be added to their payroll. Maybe the solution is sending school administrators through a training program similar to our Pre Basic 40 Hour Law Enforcement course, thus granting them the training, power and tools to stop a threat with deadly force. I can speak from personal experience, because I myself have went through it. I wasn't paid, and did it on my own time, locally through my police department. Minimally invasive, and didn't require much time out of my schedule.

I can't help but wonder if we cannot afford to not fund it. I mean how many of these things do we have to hear about before we throw the politically correct crap out of the way. I know...let us pull some cash from some of the entitlements.

Just like the Col. preaches the real common sense solution to the problem makes people feel uneasy. People don't like to feel uneasy. As a result they will pretend that bad things won't ever happen to them. I call that a form of political correctness. As we all know there isn't one politically correct thing in the midst of a mass shooting. The ones that find themselves in the middle of one with no means of defense could care less about political correctness ( at least at those final moments). Anybody wanna bet? I would also wager that some of the deceased teacher's and staff at this last slaughter were themselves the PC anti gun lefty types. They never thought it would ever happen to them.

NOTE: In no way am I bashing the deceased. However I do know how a very large majority of those in the education field think.

 

[techres]

Great article. The one thing I never thought of was using a CO fire extinguisher like a smoke grenade to screen motion (for attack or withdrawal). Also, the use of firehouses as delay weapons also is a good last ditch idea.

 

[Indy317]

I attended one of the colonel's classes a few years ago. We were actually in the same army unit at the same time in the 1980's. I found some of my old orders that had his name on them. He was an officer and i was enlisted and do not recall having ever met him until his class.Nice guy and very intelligent with common sense. I attempted to share what I learned with my agency (that sent me). I got sent to sensitivity training for my trouble.....true story. Even police departments are in denial.

The man knows what he is talking about. However his teachings make some people very uncomfortable and pass it off as paranoia. Someday people will get tired of these slaughters and hopefully wake up.

I went to his class as well. Agencies that have their heads in the sand just don't get it. Usually those agencies are being ran by retired-on-duty dinosaurs who are stuck in a bygone era. They don't want to deal with buying rifles, another batch of thousands of rounds of costly ammo, training, policy writing, etc.. Everything he suggest is doable. He is absolutely correct that a driving factor in building construction is building safety: How many smoke detectors, sprinkler systems, wiring for detectors and pull stations, materials used, how wide hallways have to be, how many fire exists must exist, etc.. We spend all that money for primarily fire safety, but balk at the idea of spending anything near that for shooter safety.

 

[j706]

I went to his class as well. Agencies that have their heads in the sand just don't get it. Usually those agencies are being ran by retired-on-duty dinosaurs who are stuck in a bygone era. They don't want to deal with buying rifles, another batch of thousands of rounds of costly ammo, training, policy writing, etc.. Everything he suggest is doable. He is absolutely correct that a driving factor in building construction is building safety: How many smoke detectors, sprinkler systems, wiring for detectors and pull stations, materials used, how wide hallways have to be, how many fire exists must exist, etc.. We spend all that money for primarily fire safety, but balk at the idea of spending anything near that for shooter safety.

It is a constant struggle to get ammunition for meaningful training. Matter of fact it is a constant struggle to get training lined up on the schedule. But I am one persistent PITA when it comes down to it. I got put in the position to make it happen and that is what I intend to do until they boot me out. It must be working as we got a four fold increase on 2013's range budget.

For anyone under fire you would give anything for a couple of 20.00 smoke grenades. I am afraid if I approached the admin with that suggestion I would probably get committed.

 

[glockednlocked]

Very Very interesting. Some like minded folks that are worthy of respect saying things like that.... hmm maybe I am not just a cranky crackpot

 

[AJMD429]

If buildings with defective sprinkler systems which were owned by managers who prohibited fire extinguishers there, kept being burned down by arsons, would it be more effective to have endless debates on which kinds of matches or cigarette lighters were 'acceptable' or who should be allowed to buy them, or would it be better to simply make sure the prohibition on fire extinguishers there was repealed...???

Our schools clearly have 'defective security systems', yet their owners have banned 'psychopathic killer extinguishers'.

 

[rapaport]

By being armed and well equiped to "keep up" with the criminals would actually be helping out the police. The Police are over worked with having to juggled between insidents. If a criminal act is happening it would take at least a few minutes for the police to arrive. While we are waiting for the police the criminal is sqweezing off as many rounds as possible. The criminal is wanting to kill as many as possible as fast as they can. If someone was armed it would drastically reduce the amount of shooting of innocent people.