Same Scam - Different Decade

[Bill of Rights]

We can't know this. If the Two Party system is all we've ever had, how can you know that our system of Two Party works best if we've never tried multiple party?

I think it would be best to be rid of ALL Parties period. It would force people to actually think before they voted.

How would you suggest we go about doing this?

The problem is that many people are more interested in the competition, in being able to say that they voted for the winner, than they are in being able to say they voted for the guy who best represents them. We're competitive by nature- we like to win. Pity the real loser in this election never appeared on any ballot. (That would be "The American People", BTW.)


The sad part is if the one guy (who the polls say has 38% of the voters) says he's going to bury you in up to your eyeballs and the other (who the polls say has 50% of the voters) says he's going to bury you in , but only up to your shoulders, no matter which one gets your vote, you're going to get crapped on. In other words, the only way to even have a chance to truly win is to vote for the person who says they're going to put an end to all the , even if they only have polls saying they have 8% of the voters.

Or you can just stand in line waiting for your ration of . But at least you voted for the guy who won!
Blessings,
Bill

 

[patton487]

And the day after the election (today), the FED announced a plan to buy $600 billion in US bonds over the next 6 months.
No change, just more debt. There is nothing new other than a few new faces in DC. When they arrive, my bet is that they'll be "told" how things work there.

Exactly!! Those true patriots who don't "play ball" will find themselves with no support for their next election. Those who do go along will move up in D.C.

 

[chraland51]

Remember a few years ago when the price of gas was going through the roof???? Everyone in Washington was pledging to do something to relieve the problem and make us less dependent upon foreign oil (except for the bammer who was saying that gas should go to over $5/gallon, but not so rapidly and no one was listening to what he was saying). Well along comes the recession. The price of a barrel of oil dropped off the cliff and gas prices dropped back down to about a tolerable $2.50/gallon. What has been done by our fearless leaders to prevent this from happening again and making us less dependent upon foreign oil. Abslutely nothing as far as I can see. In fact, the situation is probably worse. No more drilling is being allowed. Drilling in the Gulf has been stopped for the time-being. No new refineries are planned while the current ones just continue to age. No one seemed to notice that a hurricane in the right place could shut them all down for an extended length of time causing gas supplies to quickly dwindle and the price to shoot right up. Americans have short memories. As long as our gas is below $3.00/gallon we are happy. China and India are walking in the front doors of devloping nations while our government sits on its thumbs and watches. China got billions of dollars worth of work maintaining the oil industry in Iraq because Chuckie Shumer was worried about environmental regulations which prevented any of our companies from getting the work even though we we in that country trying to establish a democracy. Are we stupid or what? China is slowly working its way into many countries in Africa while we sit idly by and just watch. Our ruling class is not worth a tinker's dam for those of you who still remember what that means. This election will not solve anything except to give us a very temporary feeling that we stopped the bammer for a while. It will quickly go back to business as usual in Washington and gas prices will once again soar to over $4/gallon and we will all cry out again for some crumbs from the elite people in Washington. Just my two cents.

 

[patton487]

Who are these master pupeteers? This sounds errily similar to how ones life can be manipulated. I know, sounds crazy but call it what you will.

Got any names to go with these mysterious puppeteers?

I could give you a couple dozen names of one worlders and banksters that are influential and have more power than anyone we voted to Congress. It's right there for anyone who wants to know. Do your homework.

But lets cut all the crap.....

When you get right down to it, it is the one who has been given temporary authority over this world. But that's not a discussion for here. Don't want to get any ones panties in a bunch...

 

[dross]

The problem is that many people are more interested in the competition, in being able to say that they voted for the winner, than they are in being able to say they voted for the guy who best represents them. We're competitive by nature- we like to win. Pity the real loser in this election never appeared on any ballot. (That would be "The American People", BTW.)


Blessings,
Bill

Perhaps some people who vote party over person are so frivolous as to want to be on the winning side. That's certainly not why I do it.

As I've said many times, it's better for gun rights to vote for an anti-gun Republican than for a pro-gun Democrat. You either understand that or you don't. I've written it many times, and somehow or other it gets regurgitated as a mindless strategy, or some kind of strange loyalty to Republicans.

The fact remains, the Republicans are more pro-gun than Democrats. More Rs than Ds, means that the committee chairmanships and committee majorities will all be Rs, as well as the leadership who decides what reaches the floor and what doesn't. So that anti-gun R will help create a majority that will be more pro gun. His one little vote (which he may vote against his beliefs due to party discipline) is much, much less important than the more pro gun party having the majority.

The same would go for a Democrat whose main issue was abortion. That Democrat is smarter to vote straight ticket Dem, if that's his main issue.

I have several main issues, but in almost all of them the Republicans are a better choice than the Democrats, even though not the best possible choice. Since I don't have the option to get the best possible choice, I throw my weight behind the best AVAILABLE choice.

Certainly anyone may disagree with the strategy. But to call it mindless, or to invent all these silly and frivolous reasons for it while ignoring the best reason for it, which I just gave, is raising straw men, and not very convincing ones at that.

 

[XMil]

I used to be a big proponent of third-party voting, but I have come to the conclusion (guided there by the wisdom of others) that taking over an existing party from within is the most workable solution. Slowly but steadily replace all these incumbent Republicans with true conservatives. They already have the massive machine in place, all that needs to be done is to slowly change out the software.

This is basically what the other side has done. This ain't your grand-dad's Democrat party. JFK was a raging conservative compared to these modern "progressives" and he would fit in the modern Democratic party about as well as Newt Gingrich.

IMHO opinion, the primaries, which are historically poorly voted in, is the place to start by getting good candidates on the ballot. I think a lot of people had to hold their nose to vote for Coats, and he could have been flushed out in the primary if more average people got involved in the primary. Don't support, with money or otherwise the Republican party, use your resources on individual candidates.

Take down from within. Slow and steady. Keep you eye on the long term game. Permanent change rarely takes place overnight. This is the method, China, Islam and Democrats have used, and it is working for them.

 

[E5RANGER375]

People sure have a short memory. Remember in the 90's when Clinton was in office? The republican tidal wave? Newt Gingritch? Contract with America?

Then what? Nothing. I submit to you that the true power is behind the scenes manipulating both Dems and Reps. When they push their agenda too far and the American people are fed up they back off a little. Here comes an election and an opportunity for everyone to vent their anger.

But we are being scammed, the game is fixed. So we put in a castrated Republican majority now. Does it feel good to really stick it to the liberals? "We sure showed them!"

That's exactly the point. Now everyone will calm down and go back to their routines. And the master puppeteers will go back to working on the ultimate goal. I don't call it "new" world order anymore. Nothing new about it. It is and will eventually be a one world order.

I am afraid it can not be stopped, delayed maybe, but not stopped....

couldnt agree more. im sure we will get the same ole same ole from the republicans once they get sworn in and feel the orra of power come over their bodies. yes the dems and reps are on the same page to destroy the constitution. I think the dems just do it faster and more brasingly. this is the first election that I walked away with a clean concience and didnt compromise. I voted libertarian.

 

[SavageEagle]

Not because I have some weird affection for the Republicans, but because in a two party system such as we have and as someone pointed out above, have had since the beginning, that's the only way to vote to advance your own interests.

I'm pretty sure I'm not trying to advance my own beliefs on anyone. I'm trying to MAINTAIN what our Country was founded on. See, that's the whole problem. People are trying to advance their beliefs. Government has no place in this. Government has specific functions and you and everyone who "advance their beliefs" through government seem to have forgotten this.

Beyond that, with you logic, it makes no sense. You would vote for someone who doesn't hold your beliefs, just because they belong to a group you like. Makes absolutely NO sense whatsoever.

Thinks about it. The two party system isn't some built in construct, it happened almost immediately. Our system naturally devolves to a two party model.

If you think multiple party systems are inherently better, study any number of the ones that exist around the world. All that happens is groups of parties band together to form coalitions, very similar to what happens here within each of the two major parties.

None have been tried in a Constitutional Republic so we have no models to base a multiple party system off of. If you can show me one, by all means, please point me in the right direction.

No parties, you say? A rose by any other name, or for that matter, a rose without a name, would still smell as sweet. Groups of like minded people would still form together in coalitions.

You long for a world that doesn't exist.

I long for a world that doesn't exist? So did our Founders. People today have no will, no backbone, and no imagination.

How would you suggest we go about doing this?

I'm not smart enough to answer this question. I wish I were, but I know my limitations.

The problem is that many people are more interested in the competition, in being able to say that they voted for the winner, than they are in being able to say they voted for the guy who best represents them. We're competitive by nature- we like to win. Pity the real loser in this election never appeared on any ballot. (That would be "The American People", BTW.)

And that's the sad part. Everyone throws principle out the window because they only care either about voting against someone or voting for who they think has the best chance. It's sad. Very, very sad.

The sad part is if the one guy (who the polls say has 38% of the voters) says he's going to bury you in up to your eyeballs and the other (who the polls say has 50% of the voters) says he's going to bury you in , but only up to your shoulders, no matter which one gets your vote, you're going to get crapped on. In other words, the only way to even have a chance to truly win is to vote for the person who says they're going to put an end to all the , even if they only have polls saying they have 8% of the voters.

I tried so hard to convince people of this. However, well, refer to the above part.

Or you can just stand in line waiting for your ration of . But at least you voted for the guy who won!
Blessings,
Bill

Yea, no, I voted principle this time around. I voted for those who hadn't been in office and held my beliefs about small, Constitutional Government. If there wasn't someone running that held those principles, I didn't vote in that race. I held true to "Vote them all out!" when everyone else only said they would.

I thought I was disappointed in the TEA Party during the Primary.... Now I see they are all talk and no walk. I have officially lost faith in the TEA Parties.

 

[dross]

I long for a world that doesn't exist? So did our Founders. People today have no will, no backbone, and no imagination.



Yea, no, I voted principle this time around. I voted for those who hadn't been in office and held my beliefs about small, Constitutional Government. If there wasn't someone running that held those principles, I didn't vote in that race. I held true to "Vote them all out!" when everyone else only said they would.

I thought I was disappointed in the TEA Party during the Primary.... Now I see they are all talk and no walk. I have officially lost faith in the TEA Parties.

Kid, I like your brass. You often don't bother to read carefully, and you often miss or ignore the point, but I dig the fire.

Go back and read what I've written, carefully. We're on the same side. You're just the young buck who wants to go out and scalp everyone, and I'm the old cheif who advises a measured approach. A conflict that has existed around campfires and war councils since we were all applying for mammoth permits.

Slow your roll, young brother. We're on the same side, we really are.

Also remember I can kick your ass.

 

[SavageEagle]

Ok, I'll just walk away... this time.

 

[SavageEagle]

I will say that I'm just pissed. I'm sick of how things turned out. Sick of the lies by ALL of them. Sick of being powerless to do anything about it. And really pissed that my kids' kids will still be fighting the same fight only with more BS to deal with than us.

That is unless the whole world crumbles first.

 

[SemperFiUSMC]

I will say that I'm just pissed. I'm sick of how things turned out. Sick of the lies by ALL of them. Sick of being powerless to do anything about it. And really pissed that my kids' kids will still be fighting the same fight only with more BS to deal with than us.

That is unless the whole world crumbles first.

OK you're pissed. Where does being pissed off get you? Is it making you feel better? No. Is it helping the relationships you have with other people in your life? No. Is it changing anything? No. Is it helping anything? No. It's causing you to spiral into a lonely world where there is you and your best friend anger. I don't know you but I'll bet all the money in my pocket that's where you are right now. How do I know that? I've been there.

Start looking for the good things, and build on them. Wins come in baby steps, not grand leaps and bounds. Accept that there are things that you believe that you can't achieve. Accept that there are core beliefs that you have that aren't shared by others. Direct your energy toward education without a condesending attitude and presentation. And then rinse and repeat. It's a lifetime endeavor. Utopia doesn't arrive overnight with no effort.

Seriously, chill. You'll feel better.

 

[SavageEagle]

OK you're pissed. Where does being pissed off get you? Is it making you feel better? No. Is it helping the relationships you have with other people in your life? No. Is it changing anything? No. Is it helping anything? No. It's causing you to spiral into a lonely world where there is you and your best friend anger. I don't know you but I'll bet all the money in my pocket that's where you are right now. How do I know that? I've been there.

Start looking for the good things, and build on them. Wins come in baby steps, not grand leaps and bounds. Accept that there are things that you believe that you can't achieve. Accept that there are core beliefs that you have that aren't shared by others. Direct your energy toward education without a condesending attitude and presentation. And then rinse and repeat. It's a lifetime endeavor. Utopia doesn't arrive overnight with no effort.

Seriously, chill. You'll feel better.

Well, you got one thing right. You certainly don't know me. I'm actually a pretty happy guy. I don't mope around all sad, depressed, and pissed off. Actually, if you walked up to me RIGHT NOW, or any other time (except when the wife is pissed) you'd never know just how upset I am at times.

I'm not spiraling. I'm not depressed. My relationships aren't suffering. I don't yell at people I think are idiots.

This is an internet forum. This is a place I can vent my anger and frustration. I'm sorry some people can't handle it.

 

[SavageEagle]

Although, I do appreciate the concern.

 

[Blue Tile Spook]

I will say that I'm just pissed. I'm sick of how things turned out. Sick of the lies by ALL of them. Sick of being powerless to do anything about it. And really pissed that my kids' kids will still be fighting the same fight only with more BS to deal with than us.

That is unless the whole world crumbles first.

Ryan, I understand what you are saying and why you are saying it. My first impulse in finding a mess is to clean it up, not step over it or pretend that it doesn't exist.

As someone else wrote, "I admire your fire."

 

[spec4]

That's the same as saying "Oh, well, the Gun Ban has been in place for a hundred years. Why mess with it?".

Thankls for responding to my post. Don't know what gun ban has been in effect for 100 years, but I do know that a multi party system makes us similar to Italy, England, etc. And look how good they're doing! IMO the Republicans and Democrats should be called Conservatives and Socialists. My leaning is definitely Libertarian, but I know they will not be able to make a difference in my lifetime. I choose to stick with the Tea Party and GOP. I am new to this forum but hope that the members respect that we may have different opinions on certain issues, but we are all Americans.

 

[beararms1776]

"I believe that the healthcare bill that was enacted by the current Congress will kill jobs in America, ruin the best healthcare system in the world, and bankrupt our country," Boehner, an Ohio Republican, told a news conference. "That means we have to do everything we can to try to repeal this bill and replace it with common sense reforms to bring down the cost of health care."

Boehner vows to repeal Obama healthcare reforms | Reuters

I didn't see anything wrong with HC before O's HC plan. Did you?

 

[Blue Tile Spook]

Yes, I do think that there were/are problems in the healthcare field, but this "solution" won't/doesn't address what is/was wrong.

The U.S. healthcare system isn't perfect, but it is a lot better than those I have experienced or read about around the world.

 

[beararms1776]

Yeah, it wasn't perfect but it wasn't that bad. Some people just think healthcare should be totally free. They're just as greedy as the big g

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

Aside from a minority of Politicians..... Can anyone show me any real difference between Dems and Repubs?


Didnt think so. Until I start seeing some real "right wing extremist" getting they're agenda pushed, I continue to wait for the fall of America