Should I load 147 grain bullet ?

[amboy49]

Shot an IDPA shoot today. So far I've been loading a 115 gr. copper clad bullet in front of 6.0 grains of Power Pistol and have no complaints about the load. However, I noticed one of the shooters in my group was shooting a 147 gr. bullet. I asked him why and he stated he shoots a heavier bullet at a slower speed and it cuts down on recoil thus allowing him to get the sights back on target quicker. He indicated he was using Titegroup powder - I think he said 3.0 grains (but wouldn't swear to it.)

Questions include:

Do the principles of physics apply (?) - shooting a heavier bullet results in lower recoil ?
Are most IDPA and USPSA 9mm shooters shooting a heavy bullet to try to lessen recoil ?
Are there rules about minimum bullet velocity (I'm not planning on shooting any major shoots (nor have I) so my cartridges have not been chronographed at any of the local shoots I've attended.
Will I also gain a little advantage shooting the steel targets with a heavier bullet ? i.e. more knock down power

I'm ready to try to improve my scores and have been trying to "master" the trigger press, movement between target shooting positions, magazine changes, draw stroke, etc. Will shooting a heavier bullet be another way to try to improve my overall performance ?


Thanks in advance.

 

[Snizz1911]

Even being an engineer I'm going to stray from your technical questions, at least for right now I don't want to think that hard.

However I'll give you my non technical opinion. Yes, 147 grain projectile feels significantly softer then a 115 grain projectile to me. Many will describe it as more of a push back recoil the getting the muzzle snap with a 115 grain.

My competition load is similar to the guy you spoke with, a little more powder though. I cannot speak to anything IDPA as I've never competed in it, but in USPSA the min power factor for minor scoring is 125. My load combo puts me at around 890-900 Fps which puts me in the 130 power factor ballpark.

 

[rvb]

3.0 of TG might be a little light for PF depending on bullet and gun, but yes, the general rule of thumb is a heavy bullet w a fast powder will get the least muzzle lift and recoil. 147s w/ N310 was the nicest load I ever shot. I've gone through bazillions of 147 JHPs over 3.4gr TG. Gets 132PF from a G19, 137 from a G34, and 133 from a Beretta 92.

Another minor benefit is having a subsonic round. Quieter.

i think the 147s do a little better on steel. I have seen my loads knock down steel that 115s didn't. It might also be that I don't load right at the min PF.

some folks don't like the loads because of the slide speed, etc. it really is a preference thing.

When I shot a lot I'd also load 115s for cheaper practice. The difference never made a difference on the timer. It made a difference in how fast the sight lifted and how easy it was to call the shot.

You need to make 125 PF. Doesn't matter if its a major or a local match. So for a 147 gr bullet that's over 851 fps (but that's cutting it close, around 900 would be better).



-rvb

 

[downrange72]

It is a preference thing. I shoot 147s. I feel the recoil is softer. It is definitely more of a push than a flip.

Try a few rounds if somebody will let you. I think you will like it. Most people I know shoot 124 or 147

 

[kevinsr98]

I have tried 124,125, 130 and 147's (all lead, or lead molly coated). By far the best shooting and lowest recoil has been the 130 and 147's. However I use Clays. Which is slower than other powders. But it does not take much. 2.8 gr with a 147 LFN shoots a powerfactor of 129.

Very soft shooting. But I had to replace my factory recoil spring so it would cycle reliably. Good luck.

 

[Grelber]

. it really is a preference thing.

It is a preference thing.

I like the 115's being a little bit cheaper and I like the powder charge filling more of the case for safety's sake, but I tend to shoot what ever weight of bullet my gun seems most likely to send in a straight line, all else being equal I'll go with cheap and more margin for safety.

 

[sv40sw45]

I have tried 124,125, 130 and 147's (all lead, or lead molly coated). By far the best shooting and lowest recoil has been the 130 and 147's. However I use Clays. Which is slower than other powders. But it does not take much. 2.8 gr with a 147 LFN shoots a powerfactor of 129.

Very soft shooting. But I had to replace my factory recoil spring so it would cycle reliably. Good luck.

Ditto on the Clays!!! My pet load for Production Glock 34.

 

[indygunguy]

I use moly-coated 147's with either AA#5 or Solo1000... both are VERY soft shooting. I'm a big fan of 147gr bullets.

 

[amboy49]

I would like to try some 147 gr. bullets based on the replies given above- perhaps at an IDPA shoot this Sunday. Even if I can find them I know I couldn't order and get them here in time to reload for this weekend. Would like to know if anyone has any 147 gr. bullets they'd like to either sell or trade for 115 gr. ( either lead or copper clad ) or 124 gr. copper clad. I have both Power Pistol and Titegroup powder to use. I thought I would try the Titegroup since I think it is a little slower burning powder and will provide less recoil and a quieter report.

Please either p.m. or reply on this thread. I live in Zionsville - would be willing to travel the Indianapolis area. I'd need to effect the trade/sale by Thursday of this week ( in order to allow myself enough time to reset my reloader for the correct recipe and crank out a couple of hundred rounds)

Thanks in advance.

 

[amboy49]

Picked up 500 147 gr. cast lead 15 BRN bullets at Profire today. They suggested a powder load as follows:

Titegroup. 2.5 to 2.8 grains which should produce 870 - 943 fps.

Power Pistol 4.1 to 4.6 grains producing 940 - 1,000 fps.

These bullets are described as "sub-sonic.". Noise reduction is not my goal. I'm trying to obtain a softer shooting load with less muzzle flip for shooting IDPA and USPSA events.

Other reloading charts indicate a starting Power Pistol powder charge of 5.5 for cast lead. Are the sub-sonic bullets that much different when it comes to powder or is it a matter of either speed or bullet deformation that results in the different powder weights ?

Thanks in advance

 

[Rob377]

titegroup and lead is a smokey, nasty mess. It's faster than PP, which is typically a good thing when looking for mousefart loads. But it's also VERY hot-burning, which cooks off the lube used on raw lead bullets and creates the nasty smokey mess.

 

[rvb]

titegroup and lead is a smokey, nasty mess. It's faster than PP, which is typically a good thing when looking for mousefart loads. But it's also VERY hot-burning, which cooks off the lube used on raw lead bullets and creates the nasty smokey mess.

I think it's a great combo! (might keep the mosquitos away!)

Even if you don't like the load for smoke reasons, a few hundred to see if you like the feel wont hurt anything.

Picked up 500 147 gr. cast lead 15 BRN bullets at Profire today. They suggested a powder load as follows:

Titegroup. 2.5 to 2.8 grains which should produce 870 - 943 fps.

Power Pistol 4.1 to 4.6 grains producing 940 - 1,000 fps.

These bullets are described as "sub-sonic.". Noise reduction is not my goal. I'm trying to obtain a softer shooting load with less muzzle flip for shooting IDPA and USPSA events.

Other reloading charts indicate a starting Power Pistol powder charge of 5.5 for cast lead. Are the sub-sonic bullets that much different when it comes to powder or is it a matter of either speed or bullet deformation that results in the different powder weights ?

2.8 of TG seems light, even for cast, but it might be ok. Do you have a chrono, or access to one? You really need 870 fps average to be safe.


"subsonic" just means slower than the speed of sound. most 147s from a 9mm are, but that's up to how fast you drive it. Not having the crack from the bullet breaking the sound barrier will be quieter. Quieter doesn't technically help recoil, but noise can be a factor in flinching (and subconsciously could make a gun seem to recoil more I suppose).

-rvb

 

[Craig T]

up until lately all I have loaded was 147 gr plated on 3.2gr of tite group... great load! I say until lately due to shortages of them... now I am loading a lot of 124 gr