.357 vs .38+P in 2" barrel

[Steve]

Here's the quandry: I carry a S&W 60 .357 with a 2" barrel and I'm trying to decide what to carry in it caliber wise.

.357 mag: Plenty of punch, heavy recoil. Corbin, Black Talons, or Hydroshoks available

.38+P: Good punch, lighter recoil. Corbins or Hydroshoks available.

I've also heard that the .357 ballistics don't spec out to it's full potenial due to the short barrel.

What say ye?

 

[gunman41mag]

Here's the quandry: I carry a S&W 60 .357 with a 2" barrel and I'm trying to decide what to carry in it caliber wise.

.357 mag: Plenty of punch, heavy recoil. Corbin, Black Talons, or Hydroshoks available

.38+P: Good punch, lighter recoil. Corbins or Hydroshoks available.

I've also heard that the .357 ballistics don't spec out to it's full potenial due to the short barrel.

What say ye?

I've been told that the 357 MAG is still faster than the 38 SPL +P but is it worth all the recoil You are the one that needs to make that decision

 

[VERT]

IMO the power of the .357 is not worth the recoil. I have fired two different snubbies with magnum loads only to have the cylinder freeze up because the bullet moves forward in the case. .38 +P has a lot of bite with the proper loads. Check out the speer short barrel loads or the LSWCHPs from buffalo bore. Now this might not be a problem in the OPs model 60. Just make sure to test fire any ammo you choose to carry.

My snubby is .38 only but I can definately understand why a person would want .357. The ability to use a wider range of cartridges is a nice plus.

 

[BurninBrass]

If you had to use the revolver in a dark self-defense situation, my biggest concern would be muzzle flash. Nothing hurts followup shots quicker than blindness.

I use the Gold Dot 38+p Short Barrel load and the Winchester PDX 38+p. Both are potent with controllable recoil and relatively low muzzle flash.

 

[Iroquois]

I just love all this theorizin'. It's very simple, take the hot load to the range and shoot
it . If you can reliably hit a 6" circle at, say 15 yrds in double action, thats the winner!
If not try something less. A hit with a light .38 is better than a miss with a cannon.
All the discussion in the world won't tell you what a day at the range will... and who
doesn't need [want] a little more range time?

 

[Keith_Indy]

I just love all this theorizin'. It's very simple, take the hot load to the range and shoot
it . If you can reliably hit a 6" circle at, say 15 yrds in double action, thats the winner!
If not try something less. A hit with a light .38 is better than a miss with a cannon.
All the discussion in the world won't tell you what a day at the range will... and who
doesn't need [want] a little more range time?

Ditto on this.

Hits are what count. I don't feel under-gunned with .38 +P in my revolvers (all .38s) Speer 124gr +P loads are my choice of carry ammo.

 

[NIFT]

If you had to use the revolver in a dark self-defense situation, my biggest concern would be muzzle flash. Nothing hurts followup shots quicker than blindness.

I use the Gold Dot 38+p Short Barrel load and the Winchester PDX 38+p. Both are potent with controllable recoil and relatively low muzzle flash.

Per Dr. Gary Roberts:
"Currently, the Speer Gold Dot 135 gr +P JHP and Barnes 110 gr XPB all copper JHP (for ex. in the Corbon DPX loading) offer the most reliable expansion we have seen from a .38 sp 2” BUG; the Winchester 130 gr bonded +P JHP (RA38B) and Hornady 110 gr standard pressure and +P Critical Defense loads also offer good performance out of 2" barrel revolvers."

BUG's: .380 ACP vs. .38 Sp - M4Carbine.net Forums
About 2/3 the way down the post.

 

[cosermann]

Per Dr. Gary Roberts ...

Since we're quoting Roberts, he also says, "There is no reason to go with .357 mag in a J-frame, as the significantly larger muzzle blast and flash, and harsher recoil of the .357 Magnum does not result in substantially improved terminal performance compared to the more controllable .38 Special bullets when fired from 2” barrels." - FWIW

from - Best Choices for Self Defense Ammo

 

[kludge]

Ballistics by the inch

If you shoot it well, by all means use it.

 

[bobzilla]

.357 in a 2" bbl. When you caan't hit your target so blinding them, deafening them and lighting them on fire with the muzzle flash are the next best option.

 

[CoyoteCreekGuns]

Hands down, go with .357 but be sure to get the right ammo (i.e. short barreled) like Buffalo Bore 19G/20:

Item 19G/20-125gr. Jacketed Hollow Point bullet @ 1,225 fps from a 2.5 inch S&W mod. 66 barrel. Designed to mushroom violently, yet hold together and penetrate deeply-roughly 12 to 14 inches in human tissue.
S&W mod. 340PD 1-7/8 inch barrel - 1,109 fps (341 ft. lbs.)
S&W mod. 66 2-1/2-inch barrels -1,225 fps (416 ft. lbs.)
S&W mod. 65 3-inch barrels - 1,322 fps (485 ft. lbs.)
S&W Mt. Gun 4-inch barrel - 1,445 fps (579 ft. lbs.)
Colt Python 6-inch barrel - 1,388 fps (535 ft. lbs.)


For complete details check it out here: Tactical Short Barrel Lower Recoil Low Flash 357 Magnum Pistol & Handgun Ammunition

 

[NIFT]

Since we're quoting Roberts, he also says, "There is no reason to go with .357 mag in a J-frame, as the significantly larger muzzle blast and flash, and harsher recoil of the .357 Magnum does not result in substantially improved terminal performance compared to the more controllable .38 Special bullets when fired from 2” barrels." - FWIW

from - Best Choices for Self Defense Ammo

Yup, that too!

It has been demonstrated, repeatedly, by reputable testing agencies such as the FBI and Doc Roberts that neither muzzle energy, nor muzzle blast, nor muzzle flash, are wounding mechanisms.

Of course, shot placement--a training issue--trumps all, but training and ammunition selection are independent: neither changes with changes in the other. That independence, that training doesn't change ammunition and ammunition doesn't change training, is a fact lost on many people.

 

[JB75]

speer gold dot short barrel ammo designed at a slower velocity to impart the most impact force with the best accuracy from a snubby

 

[iwork4pepsi]

There are not many bears or elephants around here in Northern Indiana, so I carry Speer Gold Dot 38 spc +P in my S&W airweight. I have no problem quickly putting all 5 rounds in a tight shot group at 10 yds using double action. The only problem I foresee is that some of my rounds may go through the same hole I put in the bad guy from my 1st shot....

 

[NIFT]

I have no problem quickly putting all 5 rounds in a tight shot group at 10 yds using double action. The only problem I foresee is that some of my rounds may go through the same hole I put in the bad guy from my 1st shot....

Hmmm...

"The hen is the wisest of all the animal creation because she never cackles until after the egg has been laid."
Abraham Lincoln, Januiary, 1863

 

[BE Mike]

I just chrono'd some Speer Gold Dot 135 gr. JHP ammo. The .38 spl. out of my S&W 642 chrono'd 880-890 fps. The .357 mag. chrono'd 1380 fps out of my 3" S&W model 60-10. If you can handle the recoil, I'd go with the .357 Gold Dot with 135 gr. bullet. IMHO, recoil sensitivity is mostly a mental thing and can be overcome with determined practice, as long as, the shooter is able to maintain a consistent grip on the firearm.

 

[VERT]

I just chrono'd some Speer Gold Dot 135 gr. JHP ammo. The .38 spl. out of my S&W 642 chrono'd 880-890 fps. The .357 mag. chrono'd 1380 fps out of my 3" S&W model 60-10. If you can handle the recoil, I'd go with the .357 Gold Dot with 135 gr. bullet. IMHO, recoil sensitivity is mostly a mental thing and can be overcome with determined practice, as long as, the shooter is able to maintain a consistent grip on the firearm.

Nice comparison! But still a 2" vs 3" barrel. I would love to see different bullets in the same gun and the same load in both guns. Is it the cartridge or the barrel length. Either way the 3" .357 as a system is more powerful.

 

[BE Mike]

That same day, I did chrony my 135 grain Gold Dot reloads in my 3" S&W model 60-10. The .357 mag. reloads clocked at 1222 fps and the .38 SPL reloads clocked at 894 fps. I used the recommended load of Alliant Power Pistol powder for both loads. I'd go with the .357 mag. for personal protection over the .38 SPL when given the option. That being said, I carry a 642 in .38 SPL daily.

 

[ben992]

If you ever had to use it, you would be happy to have .357s in there--and you would never feel the recoil.

 

[X ring]

.38+P for more contolled follow up shots.