A Black Box For Your Car Plus a Bonus Tax

[Bennettjh]

As I have said so many times...the only thing Gov. exists for is to fleece the sheeple. We have more than enough laws. Just enforce them. We have more than enough regulations. Eliminate half or more of them.
The reason for the congress to exist is long past being needed. They can meet a few times a year to regulate the budget and so forth and then get lost for a while. We need them less every day.

Exactly! The longer they sit around, the more they come up with.

 

[buckstopshere]

Assuming all they would do is track miles driven not where/when etc. Of course, this could be some simply by an odometer reading.
Simple fact is that the fuel tax is used to maintain roads/bridges that everyone uses. Electrics and hybrids use these, but do not pay the accompanying tax.

Commercial vehicles have paid excise tax to each State the vehicle is operated in based on the miles reported to have been driven for years. (This is why truck fuel is exempt from tax at the pump) The system works to ensure that the States get the correct funds. These days many companies use electronic log books that keep these records. Owner operators and smaller outfits still do it manually and file hand written reports.

Would you rather the fuel taxes be abolished and have to report your mileage on every trip like Commercial Carriers do?

Absolutely not. The solution isn't more taxes no matter where it's applied. It would be easier and much more cost effective to just tax hybrids and electronic cars at the time of registration and renewal. But that would be equally stupid.

The idea that California (or any state) isn't collecting enough taxes to support the roads and highways is laughable. How about the state governments make some choices to defund or lower the budget in another area and allocate those dollars to the roads. How about that speed train that has gone no where but sucked out millions in tax payer dollars. Probably could've gotten some roadways fixed.

The real issue is how the money is being spent. The black box is either a distraction meant to enrage people so the idea of raising the gas tax is more acceptable or the .gov is trying to restrict freedom of movement. I'm betting they would be happy with either so might as well do both.

 

[Designer99]

You guys got it all wrong. Flo told me it was so I could get a discount on my car insurance!
How It Works: Snapshot Discount, Usage-Based Insurance ? Progressive

 

[buckstopshere]

You guys got it all wrong. Flo told me it was so I could get a discount on my car insurance!
How It Works: Snapshot Discount, Usage-Based Insurance ? Progressive

Progressive. So bold to put it right out there in front with the name of their company.

 

[BigMatt]

I searched the article and found no other reference to Libertarians, let alone a specific Libertarian.

I find it hard to believe any Libertarian would be for something that so blatantly skirts our rights to privacy.

I wonder what Ron Paul would say about this.

 

[Destro]

I am shocked that the Libertarians would advocate for this. Why do they hate Privacy?

Libbo's are only concerned about THEIR privacy

 

[Destro]

I searched the article and found no other reference to Libertarians, let alone a specific Libertarian.

I find it hard to believe any Libertarian would be for something that so blatantly skirts our rights to privacy.

I wonder what Ron Paul would say about this.

There's even a quote in there from the VP of the Reason Foundation, look harder

 

[IndyDave1776]

Assuming all they would do is track miles driven not where/when etc. Of course, this could be some simply by an odometer reading.
Simple fact is that the fuel tax is used to maintain roads/bridges that everyone uses. Electrics and hybrids use these, but do not pay the accompanying tax.

Commercial vehicles have paid excise tax to each State the vehicle is operated in based on the miles reported to have been driven for years. (This is why truck fuel is exempt from tax at the pump) The system works to ensure that the States get the correct funds. These days many companies use electronic log books that keep these records. Owner operators and smaller outfits still do it manually and file hand written reports.

Would you rather the fuel taxes be abolished and have to report your mileage on every trip like Commercial Carriers do?

This is all true. One must also keep in mind that those operating commercial vehicles are subject to having their records audited on either 24 or 48 hours' notice (OK, I'm having a little bit of a senior moment in spite of not being all that senior) in which an auditor can take as long as he wants, often several days, combing through the records looking for any errors or inconsistencies with the authority to issue fines in addition to reparations for underpayment (although I have never heard of one issuing a refund if the error goes the other way).

This is a prime example of what happens when those who are not directly affected sit back either in oblivious bliss or ignore what is being done to their neighbors. Now, we have a decades-old precedent for this type of taxation which has stood without effective challenge and we are not going to cry foul when it is applied to everyone?

I am not advocating such a tax, but we collectively have established for ourselves a very weak position for debate.

 

[1775usmarine]

All I could keep singing was Taxman by The Beatles when I read that article.

 

[Leo]

I have an old 6 cylinder, stick shift, breaker points ignition, hand choke one barrel carb, pickup stashed in a friends barn. That may be the vehicle for the next phase of life.

 

[BigMatt]

There's even a quote in there from the VP of the Reason Foundation, look harder

The Reason Foundation is not affiliated with any political party.

 

[SecondhandSnake]

The idea that California (or any state) isn't collecting enough taxes to support the roads and highways is laughable. How about the state governments make some choices to defund or lower the budget in another area and allocate those dollars to the roads.

That's one thing I never understood in NY. Taxes everywhere you look, high on fuel, and the old joke of all the welcome signs saying "Welcome to NY: toll booth 1mi" and yet their roads were in awful shape. It's certainly not for lack of revenue...

 

[Destro]

The Reason Foundation is not affiliated with any political party.

from the website:


Is Reason libertarian?Yes. Reason Foundation's mission is to advance a free society by developing, applying, and promoting libertarian principles, including individual liberty, free markets, and the rule of law.

 

[Lex Concord]

I know GM has (and I assume the other manufacturers have) had "black boxes" in their vehicles for years. A friend of mine worked on their development when he worked for Delco. At least the ones he worked on only recorded the last few seconds of your drive so that in the event of a crash, they could see how fast you were going, when/if you had applied the brake, if you had your seat belt on, etc.

I find this paragraph from the article interesting:



I just can't understand how some folks, eh-hmm, will, so willingly, accept the .gov monitoring their lives.

I'm always amused at how some folks will, so willingly accept Reason (or any other single source) as apparently speaking for all or even most libertarians.

Reason has, more than once, been a cheerleader for government interference where none belongs. I got one sample issue years ago and said "no thanks" to the opportunity for a subscription as they, in my eyes, tend toward statism with rather uncomfortable frequency.

 

[Lex Concord]

Progressive. So bold to put it right out there in front with the name of their company.

It is bold, and I commend them for their market innovation. Plugging Progressive's black box into your car (on the surface, at least) appears to be strictly a voluntary sharing of your driving information for the opportunity of getting a better rate. So long as they and they alone hold the data, and don't share, it shouldn't be an issue.

It's where such things become involuntary (i.e. .gov inserts itself) that things can get ugly.

 

[Lex Concord]

Libbo's are only concerned about THEIR privacy

And Republicans are only concerned with what goes on behind closed doors, and Democrats only with wrecking the Constitution.

 

[ZombieApocolypse]

Libbo's are only concerned about THEIR privacy

Funny how one will believe anything the liberal media says, if it supports ones ideals huh?

There's even a quote in there from the VP of the Reason Foundation, look harder

Sorry im new to this, what do they have to do with Libertarians?

 

[Destro]

Funny how one will believe anything the liberal media says, if it supports ones ideals huh?




Sorry im new to this, what do they have to do with Libertarians?

You do realize im not talking about liberals right?

and Let me google that for you

 

[buckstopshere]

It is bold, and I commend them for their market innovation. Plugging Progressive's black box into your car (on the surface, at least) appears to be strictly a voluntary sharing of your driving information for the opportunity of getting a better rate. So long as they and they alone hold the data, and don't share, it shouldn't be an issue.

It's where such things become involuntary (i.e. .gov inserts itself) that things can get ugly.

I agree on the progressive snap shot. If you want it as an option, by all means. I won't support that company not because of the snap shot but rather where they give political support.

 

[Designer99]

and Let me google that for you

Psst, Internet ninja tip: Run your LMGTFY link through a link shortener like bit.ly so it doesn't show the title when you post it. That way you can insure that the yahoo who opens it is fully shamed for their lack of research skills.

Carry on.