About this Obamacare thingy

[1861navy]

If the va is underfunded, and obamacare will cost the u.s. At least twice what we were told, and we are already trillions in debt how does spending more help, how is that beneficial? Its beneficial by killing what little healthcare we have left and bankrupting people who are already bankrupt, that kind of the point unfortunately.
And if people would eat healthier food, exercise, spend time outdoors/ with the family, and quit dumping chemicals down their throat, lay off the fast food and sodas, then take control of your own health we wouldn't have so many health problems anyway, and quite a lot of the health problems in this country would dissipate with time.

 

[spirit390]

This is for streak

You have butt chugged the koolaid. Do you really think a bureaucrat will be better/easier to deal with than a " paid doctors/nurses and give them bonuses to deny coverage". Everytime I was denied something thru my insurer they had an appeals process you have absolutely no appeals thru odumbocare Truly moronic! Ever try to appeal something at the DMV/BMV good luck with that. Ten year old needs a lung transplant or she is going to die and the parents only recourse go to court so not only do you have medical bills you have legal bills. And who was stopping this little girl from getting a transplant not the doctors, not the insurance company wait for it wait for it a bureaucrat (Parents of girl waiting for transplant ask Sebelius to intervene - CNN.com)
TRULY MORONIC
My only hope for people that are for this affordable care act is that they get the full affect of the law and in someway it affects them or one of their loved ones so they can see first hand what a disaster this pile of crap really is

 

[KittySlayer]

Old Glory

You didn't touch on my new found Bi-Sexuality?

I am not sure anyone wants to touch it.

Perhaps they will have a special closet in the back that you can demonstrate you have have found the light and are eligible to check the Bi Box. Just take a seat in here sir and wait for your application to come through that hole in the wall.

 

[Streak]

This is for streak

You have butt chugged the koolaid. Do you really think a bureaucrat will be better/easier to deal with than a " paid doctors/nurses and give them bonuses to deny coverage". Everytime I was denied something thru my insurer they had an appeals process you have absolutely no appeals thru odumbocare Truly moronic! Ever try to appeal something at the DMV/BMV good luck with that. Ten year old needs a lung transplant or she is going to die and the parents only recourse go to court so not only do you have medical bills you have legal bills. And who was stopping this little girl from getting a transplant not the doctors, not the insurance company wait for it wait for it a bureaucrat (Parents of girl waiting for transplant ask Sebelius to intervene - CNN.com)
TRULY MORONIC
My only hope for people that are for this affordable care act is that they get the full affect of the law and in someway it affects them or one of their loved ones so they can see first hand what a disaster this pile of crap really is

"Odumbocare" is, again, not a good solution. The fact is it's still PRIVATE insurance, Obamacare is essentially a requirement to have health insurance. I've found NOTHING in the law that states that Obamacare gives "beaurocrats" the ability to determine insurance payment standards (or more specifically to reject what an insurance would normally have paid for).

That little news article you submitted is some hyperbole and if you knew jack about organ transplants you'd know why that "rule" exists. They're trying to get Sarah an adult lung which carries with it a high chance of complications that are not seen in older, larger sized children. And why is this? It's an organ that is too big for her body. If you knew anything about organ transplants you'd know that they're not the easiest things to pull off and to make it work you have to take pills to kill your immune system, because otherwise your own body cells would destroy the very tissue keeping it alive.

Her heart, her blood vessels, and everything else are undeveloped -- even non-government affiliated doctors say that it's a bad idea and it strips away the chance that another child (say a 16 year old boy for example) whose body is a more compatible match could USE the organ. It's NOT perfect and it's as fair as it can be. What the parents were trying to do, and it's understandable, is to get their child to the top of a list and bypass other children who might be better candidates with a higher chance of organ acceptance.



But please, continue rambling on about butt chugging koolaid and calling me a moron instead of actually taking some time to learn about what is truly going on. There are plenty of reasons to dislike Obamacare -- I find it humorous that we allow for-profit companies whose bottom lines rely (in part) on denying coverage. I find it funny that you'll defend private insurance carriers when I know good people like a family member of mine who adopted 3 kids (that'd be me and my brothers) who has diabetes, owns her own business, and built a home for children whose own mother didn't want them.

This same woman came down with a brain tumor which took one of the best surgeons in the US to fly to Indy and an 18 hour surgery to literally save her life. She was summarily denied further coverage based off of genetic factors that she couldn't control. Before Obamacare she couldn't get insurance at all -- Obamacare did something good and that was knock out pre-existing conditions. Her diabetes wasn't cured with the brain surgery and she'll continue to need long-term checkups. She can't have insurance right now until the provisions on pre-existing conditions and the exchange system takes hold (it's too expensive otherwise).

This law has affected me PERSONALLY, so please don't think I'm talking out of my ass. What I'd LOVE to see happen is a insurance system much like the UK's with a National Health insurance combined with private optional insurance and both public/private healthcare providers with private hospitals required to accept the public insurance in the event of a life threatening emergency.

But all of this is moot. The lot of you are pissed off at me because I pointed out that attempting to repeal the ******* law for the 42nd time is ludicrous. Albert Einstein once said that insanity is "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." My point that a lot of you seem so offended on is that it costs taxpayers real money to waste time trying to repeal something that everyone already knows isn't getting repealed. Maybe you can get it defunded, but I doubt it...but go ahead and bang your heads on that wall for 42 more times.

Or...OR...OR we can all sit down at the table and work it out, figure out a BETTER solution that is more acceptable to EVERYONE. This is a Democracy and it's stupid, selfish, and unamerican to think you're going to get things your way 100% of the time. Maybe I'm just tired of all of the political bull**** in-fighting, but I'm pretty sure with the millions of Americans (many of which are intelligent) we CAN come up with a solution. What happened with Obamacare was that neither side wanted to sit down and talk it through and to be fair I watched the politics and I saw the comments by Republicans. There was never any intent to find any middle ground and the Democrats did some bull**** to get it passed without Republicans getting any further say.

Neither side did their job and all of the monkeys on their shoulders are too busy flinging **** to come up with a better solution. I suppose that's what pisses me off the most.

 

[Baditude]

My 2 cents: I have already seen dramatic increases in my insurance premiums, I know people whose hours are being cut from full time to part time and pert time jobs are drying up.
I also know that even if you don't have health insurance (I think that its dumb not to), the hospitals can not turn you away. How has Obamacare addressed this? Sure you can be fined for not having it, but its cheaper than buying it at present rates if you are single young and healthy. Those that can't afford it now, will not be able to afford it later and will still use the system from free health care. Don't even get me started on the illegals

I think Obamacare is good in theory, but the bastardized version we have is full of political agenda costing businesses much more to comply and confusing everyone. If the law is so good, then why are there so many exceptions to unions etc.. and congress has their own plan?

 

[Streak]

My 2 cents: I have already seen dramatic increases in my insurance premiums, I know people whose hours are being cut from full time to part time and pert time jobs are drying up.
I also know that even if you don't have health insurance (I think that its dumb not to), the hospitals can not turn you away. How has Obamacare addressed this? Sure you can be fined for not having it, but its cheaper than buying it at present rates if you are single young and healthy. Those that can't afford it now, will not be able to afford it later and will still use the system from free health care. Don't even get me started on the illegals

I think Obamacare is good in theory, but the bastardized version we have is full of political agenda costing businesses much more to comply and confusing everyone. If the law is so good, then why are there so many exceptions to unions etc.. and congress has their own plan?

Your premiums were going up before Obamacare...I fail to see how greed would be affected at all.

And yes you can go to the hospitals, they can also force you into bankruptcy, garnish your wages, make you lose your house/car/etc, and destroy your credit (which is a hard, hard thing to overcome). Obamacare is making it easier for people to get health insurance and many of these people couldn't get it because of "pre-existing" conditions. The illegals aren't affected all that much by Obamacare. Medicaid doesn't cover them and I don't see what it matters if they buy private insurance.

Your Congress comment is actually a myth

Congress MUST use the exchanges or a program approved by law. Obamacare doesn't give insurance, it will give subsidies and those are denied to illegal immigrants (specifically by the law). Obamacare set up exchanges, not insurance plans. It setup groups and is not acting as a carrier or an administrator to the plans. It's not a National Healthcare plan by any means.

I agree that Obamacare was hit too hard with the politics and doesn't actually solve what it intended to solve (lack of coverage of Americans).

 

[spirit390]

Huh that's funny her doctors that were treating her at the time(course they would not know more than a goverment paid doctor) said she was developed enough to take the lung transplant. Hows she doing now Local Girl With Double Lung Transplant Comes Home
Yeah i can see that a democratic idealog would love to have a UK style universal health coverage where the poor get mediocre care and the rich can pay to have the highest quality care. Yeah that sounds really all american to me comrade.

I look forward to the day you realize that this bill was a piece of crap passed without any republican vote in the house and passed in the middle of night with new rules in the senate with no republican votes with special carve out for certain senators(lousiana purchase or corn husker kickback ring a bell) and signed by a president the next day when he promised that you would have 5 days to read the bill online.
Maybe you can explain how your imperial leader can disregard the laws implentation of the employer mandate until after the 2014 election. If it is so great why would they want to hold off. Oh well

 

[spirit390]

Your Congress comment is actually a myth

Congress MUST use the exchanges or a program approved by law. Obamacare doesn't give insurance, it will give subsidies and those are denied to illegal immigrants (specifically by the law). Obamacare set up exchanges, not insurance plans. It setup groups and is not acting as a carrier or an administrator to the plans. It's not a National Healthcare plan by any means.

I agree that Obamacare was hit too hard with the politics and doesn't actually solve what it intended to solve (lack of coverage of Americans).[/QUOTE]

Wrong again don't have the time to look it up now but he order office of management and budget to subsidize those underpaid congressmen,senators and stafff to get 70% of their premiums paid for. Oh well wish they had to suffer like us.

 

[spirit390]

Found it
Obama Gives Congress Obamacare Relief -- Illegally
Tough when your driving with spotty cell coverage

 

[spirit390]

http://blog.heritage.org/category/obamacare/
This is some interesting reading from a reliable source for those that know little about the affordable care act.
It is probly not for the cheerleaders or water carriers of this 2700+ page bill with 10,700+ pages of regulation that get their marching orders from the ofa it may break thier lil ole hearts to find out how bad it is for them and this country.

 

[Streak]

Your Congress comment is actually a myth

Congress MUST use the exchanges or a program approved by law. Obamacare doesn't give insurance, it will give subsidies and those are denied to illegal immigrants (specifically by the law). Obamacare set up exchanges, not insurance plans. It setup groups and is not acting as a carrier or an administrator to the plans. It's not a National Healthcare plan by any means.

I agree that Obamacare was hit too hard with the politics and doesn't actually solve what it intended to solve (lack of coverage of Americans).

Wrong again don't have the time to look it up now but he order office of management and budget to subsidize those underpaid congressmen,senators and stafff to get 70% of their premiums paid for. Oh well wish they had to suffer like us.[/QUOTE]

So if you don't have time to look it up now, why the hell should I believe you? If you're pissed off about compensation and benefits that's fine -- that's not something Obamacare had anything to do with. If anything else it got them off the "golden egg" plan that was only available to the few and have to get insurance the same route that the rest of us have to. Any additional discounts then come from the companies trying to sweeten in the Congressmen and Obamacare has nothing to do with that.

Huh that's funny her doctors that were treating her at the time(course they would not know more than a goverment paid doctor) said she was developed enough to take the lung transplant. Hows she doing now Local Girl With Double Lung Transplant Comes Home
Yeah i can see that a democratic idealog would love to have a UK style universal health coverage where the poor get mediocre care and the rich can pay to have the highest quality care. Yeah that sounds really all american to me comrade.

I look forward to the day you realize that this bill was a piece of crap passed without any republican vote in the house and passed in the middle of night with new rules in the senate with no republican votes with special carve out for certain senators(lousiana purchase or corn husker kickback ring a bell) and signed by a president the next day when he promised that you would have 5 days to read the bill online.
Maybe you can explain how your imperial leader can disregard the laws implentation of the employer mandate until after the 2014 election. If it is so great why would they want to hold off. Oh well

They were treating her, that's true. When they give you medicine and other things that's a treatment -- not a cure. If I break my leg and I get a bad doctor who gives me aspirin he's providing treatment -- just not the right kind. Also there's absolutely nothing in that article that says where she got her lungs -- hell for all we know they could've been from another child (it's sad, but things like this do happen). It could have been that the person the lungs were going to no longer needed them and they didn't have time to go elsewhere with them. We don't know the circumstances surrounding this and I agree with the doner program's doctors and hope that some politician didn't override the rules.

And at the end of the day NONE of this had jack all to do with Obamacare. These are rules that were put in place a long time ago to ensure the efficient, fair, distribution of organs to the best possible candidates.

Found it
Obama Gives Congress Obamacare Relief -- Illegally
Tough when your driving with spotty cell coverage

Politico's story showed Congress asking for continued subsidization. They're still going through the state's exchanges and that's even what your blog said. This doesn't disprove my saying that Congress HAS to use Obamacare, which was exactly what you were claiming. You've not proven yourself right on that point.

 

[printcraft]

Why are they delaying implementing it until after the 2014 elections? Inquiring minds want to know.

It's because it will be so ****ing awesome right? Yeah, don't bother answering, everybody knows it will be ****ing awesome.

 

[Streak]

Why are they delaying implementing it until after the 2014 elections? Inquiring minds want to know.

It's because it will be so ****ing awesome right? Yeah, don't bother answering, everybody knows it will be ****ing awesome.

What the **** are you talking about? They've been rolling out with it for a while...it was designed to be rolled out in stages so that businesses could adjust. It's also been heavily delayed by the Republicans at Congress and their doing everything from attempting to delay funding to stopping appointments. Hell you've got states like Missouri who banned their state officials from implementing the law so long as it doesn't break Federal law.

You act like it's some conspiracy theory and it's just idiot politicians playing games and refusing to do what is required by the damned law.

In fact October 1st (unless something was changed) is the date that you can start to apply to the state exchanges. The item you're talking about is the employer mandate. The other item I'm aware of is the premium cap on employer plans to allow time for employers to implement the new accounting rules and/or systems.



If you're going to bull****, make sure you bull**** about something that isn't easily looked up on the internet. Your "inquiring mind" can pull up Google like anyone else can and do some ****ing reading.



Here I'll do what you should've done...lemme know when you've gotten through this.

 

[spirit390]

Well with the little girls lung transplant you are absololutely right it has nothing to do with obama care but it is a prelude of things to come dealing with bueracrats. So I gave you credit for being right okay broken clock gets credit for being right twice a day unless it is a military clock. Coming home from seeing my son in d.c. I posted while eating at a mickey d's and then the wife had to look up and post from the laptop on the road sorry I don't care if you believe me or not. But if you read my follow up post(sorry she's a slow searcher) they are giving people in congress,senate and staffer's $5000/individual and $11,000 per family of offset that they take to those exchanges. Now an individual or family in the productive world doesn't get jack in subcidies so obama exempted them from feeling the screwing from the legislation that bears his name. But in the world of me being honest and full disclosure things have changed since I got home and doing some reading I found this so if you want you can read along with me and we will get educated together
Obamacare Rules for Congress May Be Delayed | National Review Online
Now go back to your ofa buddies and tell them you beat up all those bad conservatives on that gunsite

 

[spirit390]

Oh yeah 10 years of taxes 6 years of coverage that should work out real well

 

[Streak]

Well with the little girls lung transplant you are absololutely right it has nothing to do with obama care but it is a prelude of things to come dealing with bueracrats. So I gave you credit for being right okay broken clock gets credit for being right twice a day unless it is a military clock. Coming home from seeing my son in d.c. I posted while eating at a mickey d's and then the wife had to look up and post from the laptop on the road sorry I don't care if you believe me or not. But if you read my follow up post(sorry she's a slow searcher) they are giving people in congress,senate and staffer's $5000/individual and $11,000 per family of offset that they take to those exchanges. Now an individual or family in the productive world doesn't get jack in subcidies so obama exempted them from feeling the screwing from the legislation that bears his name. But in the world of me being honest and full disclosure things have changed since I got home and doing some reading I found this so if you want you can read along with me and we will get educated together
Obamacare Rules for Congress May Be Delayed | National Review Online
Now go back to your ofa buddies and tell them you beat up all those bad conservatives on that gunsite

Obamacare provides subsidies for individuals based on incomes. I don't even know what OFA is and my point isn't to beat up conservatives. But I am tired of the misinformation on both sides and I will give out facts as best as I know them. I don't rely on blogs or people with vendettas to source my information. I wish more people were the same.

 

[cardio1]

Streak:
So glad you are looking forward to this. As the private insurance premiums increase, more and more folks will move to the exchanges. Then when they don't work well, only one answer will remain: one government payor.
To see how that will work for you, review these 3 articles in a country that has had the advanced Obamacare plan for 60 years
1. Patients facing eight-hour waits in ambulances outside A&E departments - Telegraph
2. 'Shocking' NHS fatality figures - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk
3. 13,000 died needlessly at 14 worst NHS trusts - Telegraph

 

[mdmayo]

...I am tired of the misinformation on both sides ... I don't rely on blogs or people with vendettas to source my information. I wish more people were the same.

^^This^^

 

[printcraft]

What the **** are you talking about? They've been rolling out with it for a while...it was designed to be rolled out in stages so that businesses could adjust. It's also been heavily delayed by the Republicans at Congress and their doing everything from attempting to delay funding to stopping appointments. Hell you've got states like Missouri who banned their state officials from implementing the law so long as it doesn't break Federal law.

You act like it's some conspiracy theory and it's just idiot politicians playing games and refusing to do what is required by the damned law.

In fact October 1st (unless something was changed) is the date that you can start to apply to the state exchanges. The item you're talking about is the employer mandate. The other item I'm aware of is the premium cap on employer plans to allow time for employers to implement the new accounting rules and/or systems.



If you're going to bull****, make sure you bull**** about something that isn't easily looked up on the internet. Your "inquiring mind" can pull up Google like anyone else can and do some ****ing reading.



Here I'll do what you should've done...lemme know when you've gotten through this.

Like I said don't ****ing bother because we all know it will be awesome.

Keep on chuggin there brother.

Really, if you have such a hard on for European socialist medical "care" feel free to get the hell out of my country and head on over.
Single payer government healthcare is the end goal, you are either lying or willfully ignorant of that fact, hell your boy obama said that was the goal.

I have to be forced to be in this ****? Who the **** do you think you are to make that demand? Take your big heart and small brain and GTFO.

 

[Streak]

Streak:
So glad you are looking forward to this. As the private insurance premiums increase, more and more folks will move to the exchanges. Then when they don't work well, only one answer will remain: one government payor.
To see how that will work for you, review these 3 articles in a country that has had the advanced Obamacare plan for 60 years
1. Patients facing eight-hour waits in ambulances outside A&E departments - Telegraph
2. 'Shocking' NHS fatality figures - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk
3. 13,000 died needlessly at 14 worst NHS trusts - Telegraph

Streak:
So glad you are looking forward to this. As the private insurance premiums increase, more and more folks will move to the exchanges. Then when they don't work well, only one answer will remain: one government payor.
To see how that will work for you, review these 3 articles in a country that has had the advanced Obamacare plan for 60 years
1. Patients facing eight-hour waits in ambulances outside A&E departments - Telegraph
2. 'Shocking' NHS fatality figures - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk
3. 13,000 died needlessly at 14 worst NHS trusts - Telegraph

If they don't work with exchanges then they won't work with private healthcare -- because that's what an exchange is, a group of people getting together to buy insurance from private carriers at a discount (much as large companies do now).

Some information on exchanges here

You're attacking the NHS? I'm not going to pretend to know everyone in the UK, but by and large the acceptance rate for the UK NHS is far higher than those who hate it. As for the "shocking" waits...what's worse, waiting 80 hours or not going at all? Because that's one of the biggest issues with America's healthcare system, people simply don't go to get checked out or get medical treatment. They either die or something serious happens and they're dying and HAVE to be seen. What was a cheap, quick, and fixable medical condition became an expensive procedure that the patient doesn't/can't pay on. That cost goes to those of us with insurance which causes premiums to go up.

So if you can't think about it in a compassionate way, you can certainly see the financial logic. You're paying far more for this than if everyone had some kind of health insurance. Again I'm not personally looking forward to Obamacare...it doesn't solve the problem adequately. I am a BIG fan of the NHS system because it allows for both private and public healthcare models.

But you know what...don't take my word for it. Read through the comments from the UKers on those articles. Most are approaching this with either "this article is BS" or they're looking for different options within the NHS. Literally the calls to "privatize" their healthcare are from a small, non-growing minority. And why is that? Because at the end of the day, if you have a medical condition you're not sitting back and weighing the options between getting checked out and paying rent/eating.


And before we go any further down the eating/paying route, let me point something out: not all of the uninsured, "poor" are lazy deadbeats. I worked two part-time jobs and neither company was hiring full timers. I worked at least 40 hours / week and made what came out to be ~$15/hr (averaged out between the two jobs). I got sick with a cold that went deep into my chest. I let it stew there for a month taking cough suppressants for 2 weeks straight (by the way...don't do this if you have a cough until you talk to your doctor...this mistake is what caused the big issue). Within a month I found it hard to simply walk upstairs, ran fevers nearly constantly (small ones), and felt miserable. I finally decided to eat the money and go to an urgent care facility (redimed if anyone has heard of it).

The doctor there put this thing on my finger and measured the amount of oxygen in my blood. It had dropped to ~87% and after listening to my lungs with his stethoscope he wanted me to go straight to the ER. I had a pretty bad case of pneumonia and it bad enough that he thought I should be staying in a hospital. I nearly broke down with anxiety in the office and literally begged him, like a ****ing loser, to do ANYTHING else to allow me to be treated there. I didn't have the money for the ER visit. He put me on this vapor machine that was laced with steroids and whatever else was in the misty **** that I inhaled. I was put on strong antibiotics which caused stomach issues (eating yogurt is a good way to cure those btw) and I was ordered to stay home for 4 days.

The total cost for all of this, after getting some waived, was over $400. What stuck with me the most out of all of that was this: I could've saved myself so much time and money by simply going -- but I didn't want to pay the $100 for the office visit ($100 = average cost of doctor's office visit) and the $50 for the antibiotics they would've issued me and that I had to feel real fear and beg a doctor to take a subpar treatment for something that literally kills people.

There's nothing like nearly crying in a doctors office because you can't afford the medical treatment being recommended...there's nothing like the feeling of helplessness and dread knowing that if something can't be done I could either die or put myself back into a financial hole that I was working my ass off to crawl out of. And I did crawl out of that hole and I'll never go back. My opinion on healthcare isn't shaped by what Glenn Beck or Bill Mahr or Steven Colbert say. It's shaped because I went through something that was horrible and I truly believe that no American should have to suffer like that.

Things are much different for me and I work for a hospital and I've went through a lot to get where I am today. People on here think I'm some lazy ass liberal and I'm not -- I'm a guy who went through a real rough patch in life. Some of it was my fault and some of it couldn't be helped. I came out with a different world view from when I went in and a lot of suffering doesn't need to happen. I'm not advocating giving people free TVs or steak and lobster dinners or cars. I'm advocating giving them access an insurance that lowers the price of healthcare to a level they can reasonably afford. I'm advocating for a healthcare system that allows those of us with more money to buy extra insurance and go to private hospitals where you can **** in gold bed pans and have topless nurses motorboat you back to health -- if that's what you want.

What we have now isn't working and it's truly the laughing stock of the world. Ask around.