Absolute vs lower 1/3 cowitness

[Ruger_Ronin]

What is your personal preference and why?

What are some (arguable) points of yay/nay for either based on your experience?

I have had positive results thus far with absolute, but want to hear from the counterpoint.

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[Bigtanker]

I went absolute. Due to my astigmatism, I use the rear sight to make my dot clear. I didn't like it with the lower 1/3.

 

[VERT]

Using an absolute cowitness with a set of front and rear flip up BUIS. When I was using an AimPoint with a fixed front sight it was 1/3 co-witness.

The advantage of 1/3 co-witness is the optic is less obstructed by the iron sights.

Honestly it is a personal preference. No real right or wrong answer.

 

[Anima mundi]

Lower 1/3 is nice on an AR for a more upright shooting stance or if you're like me and have a long giraffe neck. Some people say it's a little faster to get on top of during presentation, too. If large attachments on the top rail position are a concern then a higher optic will also help you to clear those but that's more of a niche consideration.

Depending on the gun and its intended usage you could really go either way.

 

[rhino]

I prefer an absolute co-witness. That way my head position is consistent regardless of whether I am using the dot or the irons.

 

[Robert Richardson]

I prefer an absolute co-witness. That way my head position is consistent regardless of whether I am using the dot or the irons.

This ^. Plus you can tell real quick if your red dot has been knocked out of alignment.

 

[T.Lex]

Yeah, another one for absolute. Just makes more sense to me.

 

[JollyMon]

I like lower 1/3 and absolute. There are benefits to both. The lower 1/3 rationale for me is one of those niche reasons. I like to shoot with nods and the higher optic allows one to get in behind if trying to use a red dot (hence why some are actually putting risers to bring the red dot up even higher then lower third).... but like I said it’s niche.

Absolute is just for consistency.

But it really comes to personal preference.

 

[churchmouse]

I prefer an absolute co-witness. That way my head position is consistent regardless of whether I am using the dot or the irons.

This.....Absolutely.

 

[Ruger_Ronin]

Thanks gentleman. I never intended on changing my setup (absolute), just wanted to gather data. Whats to learn if questions are not asked....

 

[Ruger_Ronin]

Ok so now I'm confused...let me start by saying forgive my ignorance. Hopefully someone can help me understand...

Am I to understand this cowitness business only applies when the rear sight is not in play?

With rear sights up I turn on the HWS, the dot sits on top of the post like a dumdum sucker -Absolute. I like.

Rear sights down, my view in window is more like a 1/3. Mind you my model Eotech (517) has side buttons, and a 7mm built in riser forcing me into a 1/3. (I learned this about 30 mins ago, source Eotech.

Sights: A2 front, MBUS pro flip in the rear. Eotech 517, vortex vmx-3 magnifier.

Why does it all appear to be absolute cowitness with rear sights up only? I guess I have to mount the magnifier with shim for 1/3 to be in line with hws? My face hurts from over thinking this.

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[T.Lex]

And that ^^^^ is when my non-operator eyes glaze over.

I hope someone can answer that, because now I'm interested in an answer that I didn't even know to ask!

 

[VERT]

With a riser the eotech should be 1/3 cowitness or similar. You will still be able to see the dot through both sights. It will all line up. It’s just the dot is lower in the viewing window.

I had an AimPoint Pro 1/3 cowitness or similar with fixed A2 front sight. It worked well and could see the dot line up with the MBUS rear. I moved that sight to my 9mm PCC and tried an absolute cowitness with a Vortex Sparc AR. I did not like it with the fixed front sight. The front sight was in the way, but that is just personal preference. Just last week I pulled the Sparc and mounted a fixed DD A1.5. If I put a red dot back on this gun I will go back to the 1/3 cowitness AimPoint and simply look over the fixed sights.

My second AR I am using another Sparc AR absolute cowitness with MBUS Pro front and rear. I really like this setup best!!!

So for me it really boils down to fixed vs flip up sights. And a persona individual opinion about how busy they want their sight picture to be. Again no right or wrong. Either way when looking through the iron sights the dot will align. With a red dot mounted higher you can look over the sights or the front sight will be more out of the way.

David you can come over and play with my rifles.

 

[Ruger_Ronin]

With a riser the eotech should be 1/3 cowitness or similar. You will still be able to see the dot through both sights. It will all line up. It’s just the dot is lower in the viewing window.

I had an AimPoint Pro 1/3 cowitness or similar with fixed A2 front sight. It worked well and could see the dot line up with the MBUS rear. I moved that sight to my 9mm PCC and tried an absolute cowitness with a Vortex Sparc AR. I did not like it with the fixed front sight. The front sight was in the way, but that is just personal preference. Just last week I pulled the Sparc and mounted a fixed DD A1.5. If I put a red dot back on this gun I will go back to the 1/3 cowitness AimPoint and simply look over the fixed sights.

My second AR I am using another Sparc AR absolute cowitness with MBUS Pro front and rear. I really like this setup best!!!

So for me it really boils down to fixed vs flip up sights. And a persona individual opinion about how busy they want their sight picture to be. Again no right or wrong. Either way when looking through the iron sights the dot will align. With a red dot mounted higher you can look over the sights or the front sight will be more out of the way.

David you can come over and play with my rifles.

I came to BTB yesterday but alas, no "El Presidente". Bought a field repair kit to shove in the ole' pistol grip.

Back to the subject, I just wanted to make sense of some info on the matter. I don't shoot enough for it to be a large concern. Here she be this far...

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[42769vette]

I prefer lower 1/3rd. The reason is the backup iron's are just that a backup plan. I never was my backup plan in the way of my primary.

That said, its not a deal breaker either way.

 

[SmileDocHill]

Death, Taxes, and my red dot.

 

[churchmouse]

Just picked up a PCC. Added a Strikefire I had in reserve. The available front sights come up just short of center on the optic. We will see how this all plays out.

 

[Ggreen]

Lower 1/3 seems faster for dynamic shooting (moving etc...) when mounted on an ar15. Especially on the presentation from low ready/belt ready to firing position. My timer seems to back this up. I do feel like it looses it's speed advantage when you start shooting seated or prone and makes for some awkward necking. I also don't feel like I always have to have a buried in cheek weld on lower 1/3, poor form i'm sure but after the "beep" things start moving quickly. Lower 1/3 seems to let me float my cheek a little for shots while on the move to the next position, seems to let me keep the rifle a bit more stable as opposed to the instability of my body while taking steps.

 

[Robert Richardson]

Sounds like a lot of guys are using a red dot like a scope. I red dot Is for fast target acquisition so you're not even going to look at your backup iron sights. Both eyes open, put you red dot on the target, wherever it is in the tube and pull the trigger. I could care less what it looks like in the tube.
You can cover the exit side of the red dot and with both eye open still be able to use it just fine. The key is both eyes open. Precision shooting is better done with the iron sights anyway.

 

[bwframe]

Just picked up a PCC. Added a Strikefire I had in reserve. The available front sights come up just short of center on the optic. We will see how this all plays out.

I have Troy BUIS on all of my rifles. They don't have enough adjustment to zero on my 9mm PCC, nor do they make it to the zero'd red dot. The PCC is not for defense, competition and training only, so it now goes without BUIS.

I prefer a cowitness on the 5.56 guns. Quite handy to verify zero after dragging the rifle around, replacing RD batteries or swapping to a magnified optic and back.