Addiction

[indygunguy]

It's quite easy to sit here and say you'd do this or you wouldn't do that. It's quite another to put your money where you mouth is. I can assure you that being present at more OD's than I can remember, I've NEVER thought, "Just let this person die." I've never just stood by and let "Nature take it's course." Have ANY of you stood over a dying person and just watched them die? I have watched helplessly as they took their last breath, waiting for EMS, their injuries were beyond what I could address. Addict or victim, if I can help, I will. I've seen enough death for 10 lifetimes, I'm not going to contribute more, if I can help it. In the end, we are what we do.

Good perspective. Thank you for posting this.

 

[Brad69]

My god Denny you a a drama master you are not the only person in the world world that has witnessed death.

Nobody wants people to be left out in the cold to die but when you narcan the same person over and over it’s not helping that person to survive, it’s IMO delaying death.
Modern medical services has enabled drug overdoses to be a recoverable situation that a few years ago would have been final. A comprehensive treatment program would be ideal but who’s gonna pay for that?

 

[mmpsteve]

And another passing thought...
It's become pretty obvious to the world at large that something is being done to children to kill their minds.
The percentages in the population are going up and up.
And the public is looking away. What is it that would make them do such a thing?

Reading, and analysiss of Ayn Rand's 'Atlas Shrugged' should be manditory. It is what we're witnessing now, and she said it so well.

.

 

[Denny347]

My god Denny you a a drama master you are not the only person in the world world that has witnessed death.

Nobody wants people to be left out in the cold to die but when you narcan the same person over and over it’s not helping that person to survive, it’s IMO delaying death.
Modern medical services has enabled drug overdoses to be a recoverable situation that a few years ago would have been final. A comprehensive treatment program would be ideal but who’s gonna pay for that?

Never claimed I had the market cornered. Many here are proposing just that...refusing medical care. Johann Hari has given great examples of how to fight this. However, few Americans could make such a cultural shift to make it work. Decriminalizing ALL drugs and treating addiction as a medical issue is seen as "being soft" and inviting chaos. Until we do that, our "War on drugs" is the equivalent of digging a hole in water. It never stops or gets better.

 

[Brad69]

I agree
Decriminalize drugs, then tax them just like cigarettes or alcohol then enforce the tax it appears that works. This would kill the underground economy and a portion of taxes raised would be used to set up treatment centers. The remaining taxes can be used for tax enforcement and education. Will the drug problem go away ? I think not we will always have addictive people, but the reduction in crime that is a spinoff for the drug trade will be reduced.
The plus side is the drug’s taxes will pay for the effect it has on the economy. Unlike now we as a society pay for the effect of the drugs with no return. I would predict that drug use would gain a stigma like cigarettes and reduce?

 

[ATOMonkey]

I am an addict. Here is the reason for it in the most summarized way possible. Before I was an addict, I felt bad about myself. Using makes me feel good. Done.

Correcting the "I feel bad about myself part," fixes the need to use to feel good.

I had to admit that I was an addict, I had to be honest about what I was feeling and why I was feeling it. I had to be open-minded about how others saw me and what I was actually doing. I had to be willing to change. I had to accept that I was responsible for how I felt and what I did.

Denial is a strong emotion. You can deny that you have a problem by blaming people or circumstances for the way you feel. You can deny that what you're doing is wrong. You can deny that what you're doing isn't any worse than what someone else is doing.

You can get depressed if you follow that rabbit hole and think that no one really cares what happens to you anyway...

Addiction is the symptom of a mental health disorder.

 

[Spear Dane]

Reading, and analysiss of Ayn Rand's 'Atlas Shrugged' should be manditory. It is what we're witnessing now, and she said it so well.

.

QFT QFT QFT

 

[ATOMonkey]

I firmly believe there is a supernatural component to mental health issues like depression. I think there is a supernatural force telling us we're not good enough, and we're not likable, and we're not lovable, all to the contrary of what we actually experience in our lives.

When we believe these lies about us, and it can be easy to do when you're having a bad day, you feel bad, and you use to stop feeling bad and now you're in a cycle.

I believe the force is supernatural, because there is sooooooooooo much evidence that we are good enough, and we are likable, and we are lovable. A rational person would never have those thoughts on their own. It's only through counseling that we can see how irrational we are, and can begin to correct that. And then be aware that there are supernatural forces that are going to try to attack us when we are vulnerable.

 

[sht4brnz]

A lot of severe and basic consequences have been removed from present life. There seems to be a safety net for every bad decision or indecision. This isn't a bad thing, as humans are inherently good at making mistakes. Examples could include everything from Narcan to welfare.
The bad is when the 'helping hand' intention of the idea becomes abused to the point it becomes a mainstay of a lifestyle. The choice or decision becomes easy to make, escpecially when efforts aren't required for the reward.
Where would this society be if natural selection didn't play an active role in the evolution of things.
Life is merit based. Got to give to get.

 

[MCgrease08]

https://fox59.com/2019/03/07/court-...o-concept-of-time-appeared-to-be-intoxicated/

It appears the mom who allegedly left her baby in the cold to die this week was a drunk. Her addiction cost her baby's life. The husband and other family members reportedly knew she had a problem and still left the infant in her care.

This is the type of thing that really burns me up.

 

[spec4]

Decades ago when this all started to spread I supported the death penalty for dealers. Guess I still do. Think they use it in Singapore or Thailand. I've seen my cousin lose a clean cut 19 year old step son and a neighbor lose their 24 year old grandson. No reason for it and no way I know to prevent it. My cousin wasn't even aware of it until the boy died.

Sis in law's grandson almost died on an OD but actually got rehabbed and now has a real job. If not the death penalty, now unrealistic in the USA, maybe mandatory life for dealers.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

I've seen alcoholism up close and personal. I've seen drug addiction up close and personal. Lost DoggyMama's oldest on July 22, 2017 to drug addiction. Almost lost her younger daughter to it about a year later when she was 6 months pregnant in our driveway (I and a neighbor performed CPR on her until EMTs go there to take over). Addicts are wired differently. I see people poo-pooing the idea that it's a disease as opposed to a choice. I want to punch those people in the face because they don't know what the **** they are talking about. The decision to start using IS a choice. What happens after that is NOT a choice. The choice to fight it is a choice. It's not an easy fight, but it is a fight nonetheless. NOBODY starts out thinking, "I think I'll become an alcoholic/drug addict."

OP, you have my sympathy.

 

[churchmouse]

It's quite easy to sit here and say you'd do this or you wouldn't do that. It's quite another to put your money where you mouth is. I can assure you that being present at more OD's than I can remember, I've NEVER thought, "Just let this person die." I've never just stood by and let "Nature take it's course." Have ANY of you stood over a dying person and just watched them die? I have watched helplessly as they took their last breath, waiting for EMS, their injuries were beyond what I could address. Addict or victim, if I can help, I will. I've seen enough death for 10 lifetimes, I'm not going to contribute more, if I can help it. In the end, we are what we do.

Yes I have Denny. But there was nothing I or anybody else could do about and God knows we tried.

So yes. More than once but far less than you have. I understand. I just see the futility in this.

 

[churchmouse]

Decades ago when this all started to spread I supported the death penalty for dealers. Guess I still do. Think they use it in Singapore or Thailand. I've seen my cousin lose a clean cut 19 year old step son and a neighbor lose their 24 year old grandson. No reason for it and no way I know to prevent it. My cousin wasn't even aware of it until the boy died.

Sis in law's grandson almost died on an OD but actually got rehabbed and now has a real job. If not the death penalty, now unrealistic in the USA, maybe mandatory life for dealers.

If there is n active seeking market some will step up to service tat market. Even under the weight of such sentencing. They are near death constantly from rivals and thieves all day every day. So that is not the answer. The answer is stopping the users. Nothing much scares a dead set user. Not jail. Not death. Nothing.

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

So, what do you all think? Is it just impossible for some people to fight it? Yes Is it nature Yes or nurture? Yes Is addiction an illness? Yes

IMHO

 

[PistolBob]

I have no first hand experience with anyone addicted to drugs...thankfully....but I sometimes wonder if they keep chasing the hearse because they don't think it will ever happen to them. Like the TV ad says..."No one ever wakes up and thinks, I want to be a junkie."

It's a real tragic thing.

 

[Bennettjh]

I only know one "personally". IMHO, she does drugs and whatever goes along with it to not have to work or have responsibilities. Sleep all day(or not), run all night, nobody expects anything out of you because you're a nefarious character, extremely unreliable, and do drugs.

Had numerous opportunities to better herself, didn't. Too much work.

 

[hoosierdoc]

I disagree with people who say addiction isn’t a disease. Not sure how you can watch someone kill themselves slowly with heroin and think it’s a choice

 

[PistolBob]

I disagree with people who say addiction isn’t a disease. Not sure how you can watch someone kill themselves slowly with heroin and think it’s a choice

It's a choice...a bad one. You're the doc, just a layman here....but I see addiction to booze, cigs, drugs...all the result of bad choices. Not a disease. I see a disease as something you get against your will, like pancreatic cancers, childhood brain tumors, ALS etc . Although herpes, and other STD's might also be considered the result of bad choices. Flunking a Wasserman Test is better than never being loved at all...right? At least it's treatable.

 

[churchmouse]

I disagree with people who say addiction isnÂ’t a disease. Not sure how you can watch someone kill themselves slowly with heroin and think itÂ’s a choice

I am on board with this being a mental issue. But in that we are all bit addictive by nature. The siren call of Crown Royal on the Rocks with a splash of water Was just one of mine. Jack Daniels the same way before that. But the J.D. brought out the cave man that dwells in all of us. Much misery resulted. Once realized I left my favorite bourbon behind. Eventually the Crown Royal took enough of toll on me that it was left behind. Finally adult Beveridge's completely.

I know this is nothing like Heroin and that level of drugs but it is a decision. I decided to take that 1st drink. Once I saw the damage/cost I decided to stop. Decisions. My brother chose not to stop and drank himself to death. Literally. How was I able to step away and him not even consider it. Is the trigger an obvious one.

In that we are by nature addictive I focused on other passions that were as hard to shake as the alcohol. Legal pursuits for sure. but addictive as hell. But when the time came to stop............Yes. Now it is Firearms and yes, I am addicted. Call it what you like. But we all make decisions. The info is in your face. In your hand with the stroke of your finger. This decision is OK.....that one is not going to end well for you no matter what. This is the confusion. At least for me. You know that grill is hot and will burn you so why do you keep touching it....???