Any talk of Indiana 2A Sanctuary counties or cities yet?

[Dead Duck]

I was a Beer Bong Champ in college.


Actually....
I had already started the 12ver and I said I would like to finish it off.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

I was a Beer Bong Champ in college.


Actually....
I had already started the 12ver and I said I would like to finish it off.

Ah! That makes sense.

 

[KLB]

OK, so I have been reading and watching the development of 2A Sanctuary Cities. Here is the only problem as I see it. Please help me understand how this could not be used against us?

We have pre-emption in Indiana. Many states have similar preemption laws. Part of the benefit of the preemption statutes are that local municipalities, towns, cities, counties, etc., cannot regulate the ownership, sale, transfer or use of firearms. Here is where it get's tricky. Let's say you now declare a 2A sanctuary and claim that your municipality, town, county, etc., is now "exempt" from state regulation, does that not now invalidate the protections we wanted under pre-emption?

Perhaps a liberal town or county decided to declare itself a 2A sanctuary so that it can further restrict firearms?

Please I am NOT against 2A Sanctuary, just concerned about the ramifications.

How can you extrapolate "we are not going to enforce anti-2A laws" to "we are going to make and enforce laws that are unlawful"?

 

[brotherbill3]

Just in

SB 436 (reportedly a possible response to rogue marion Co Prosecutor Curry's non pursuit of Marijuana charges) would have a major undoing of the movement ...

it allow an AG to appoint a special prosecutor to place charges if a local prosecutor fails. and could be used to undo the movement - it is a MAJOR shift of power from individuals and localities to the "smaller central" state offices..

 

[bwframe]

I'm concerned about a "sanctuary" to save you from the law of the land. Again, that is copying the liberal's actions that we despise.

The president is at a rally right now talking about sanctuary cities and the problem with them.

 

[KLB]

I'm concerned about a "sanctuary" to save you from the law of the land. Again, that is copying the liberal's actions that we despise.

The president is at a rally right now talking about sanctuary cities and the problem with them.

I agree with you on this. I also think SB436 needs to die a horrible death.

 

[rsklar]

As I understand it, the State is not a republic of counties and counties and municipalities have no sovereignty. Our nation IS a republic and the 2a sanctuary movement is the States way of saying we did not cede this authority to the federal government.

True, but in this case we are talking about a County stating that it will not recognize a State Law. This is what is happening in VA for example.

 

[chevyguy]

So, in Pulaski County at a commissioner meeting a couple of weeks ago the 2nd Amendment Sanctuary Ordinance was given to the commissioners and to the county attorney for review to be voted on the 3rd of February. And they seemed very receptive as well as the Sheriff . Well today it has come to my attention that the county attorney does not recommend passing then sanctuary ordinance, he says it will allow murderers just released from jail to buy a gun and it will take away all the gun laws. Now the sheriff is against it. Plus now the time that was allotted for that vote is not on the agenda for the 3rd of February.

 

[HoughMade]

Just in

SB 436 (reportedly a possible response to rogue marion Co Prosecutor Curry's non pursuit of Marijuana charges) would have a major undoing of the movement ...

it allow an AG to appoint a special prosecutor to place charges if a local prosecutor fails. and could be used to undo the movement - it is a MAJOR shift of power from individuals and localities to the "smaller central" state offices..

That law has nothing to do with the "movement", but I'm not convinced it's wise, nonetheless.

Anyhoo...

I'll just come out and say it- a sanctuary county movement in Indiana is pure alarmist nonsense.

 

[Dead Duck]

So, in Pulaski County at a commissioner meeting a couple of weeks ago the 2nd Amendment Sanctuary Ordinance was given to the commissioners and to the county attorney for review to be voted on the 3rd of February. And they seemed very receptive as well as the Sheriff . Well today it has come to my attention that the county attorney does not recommend passing then sanctuary ordinance, he says it will allow murderers just released from jail to buy a gun and it will take away all the gun laws. Now the sheriff is against it. Plus now the time that was allotted for that vote is not on the agenda for the 3rd of February.

"allow murderers just released from jail to buy a gun"

I could read that 100 time and I still won't ever get what he's talking about.
And he's a cop?

Laws on the books have NEVER stopped anyone from buying a gun..... except law abiding citizens. Park behind any 7/11 in the USA. BOOM... Gun.

 

[HoughMade]

"allow murderers just released from jail to buy a gun"

I could read that 100 time and I still won't ever get what he's talking about.
And he's a cop?

To the extent he said anything like this, the concern is that if one believes that the 2d Amendment means absolutely no restrictions on guns, and the pledge of being a "sanctuary county" is that they will not enforce any gun laws because they are all unconstitutional....

How is he wrong?

The reality is that when people talk about "sanctuary counties", they pick and choose what gun laws they will enforce, on some basis I cannot discern, and it is not a refusal to enforce any gun law. They just don't enforce the ones they don't like.

This seems reasonable...

 

[Dead Duck]

Well I see why they are doing this in states that have crappy laws. I would think that states with OK laws -Like us- are wanting to do this so they won't put any bad laws onto what we already have.

What... we need to really define the term.... "sanctuary counties"

 

[chevyguy]

[SUB]r[/SUB]Dead Duck just for clarification, it was the county attorney that said the absurdities, the sheriff after that was said is now against the 2A ordinance. And apparently the commissioners are scared away too.

 

[Dead Duck]

Dead Duck just for clarification, it wad the county attorney that said the absurdities the, the sheriff after that was said is now against the 2A ordinance. And apparently the commissioners are scared away too.

Oh... well crap.

I think the idea of this movement is great but I DO now understand how it can be completely interpreted incorrectly than it was originally meant to be. Especially since the dems are using their illegal alien sanctuary city status incorrectly.

I just want my constitutional rights continuously constitutionalized correctly dammit!

 

[chevyguy]

You said it, interpreted. That is very relative. Yes me too

 

[rsklar]

How can you extrapolate "we are not going to enforce anti-2A laws" to "we are going to make and enforce laws that are unlawful"?

OK, so let's look at sanctuary cities in the form of immigration laws. Cities and States have declared themselves to be exempt from Federal Laws that they feel violate the rights of certain people within their locations. By making this declaration they have decided to defy the Federal Laws and render them invalid within their jurisdiction. (State Government or Local Government ignores Federal Laws).

A 2A Sanctuary jurisdiction is essentially doing the same but against a State Law that they feel violated the rights of people within their jurisdiction. You pass a state law that on Universal BG Checks, we declare that is not valid, so we do not enforce it. (Local government ignores state government).

Now Enter preemption. A State law we like. We want to rely on preemption over the desire of local government to pass laws or regulations that impact our gun rights.

But Hey, we are a 2A Sanctuary County. We decide which laws we will and will not follow.

Now comes liberal Anti-2A City (we shall use a fictitious city and call it Fake City). So Fake City decides to declare Sanctuary from laws they feel are dangerous to their citizens and refuse to recognize preemption and instead adopts all kinds of restrictions in direct violation.

What I am saying is that declaring a Sanctuary jurisdiction could potentially be used for evil. If jurisdictions are given the legal ability to decide what laws they will, or will not, follow it can go in both directions.

Bob

 

[KLB]

OK, so let's look at sanctuary cities in the form of immigration laws. Cities and States have declared themselves to be exempt from Federal Laws that they feel violate the rights of certain people within their locations. By making this declaration they have decided to defy the Federal Laws and render them invalid within their jurisdiction. (State Government or Local Government ignores Federal Laws).

A 2A Sanctuary jurisdiction is essentially doing the same but against a State Law that they feel violated the rights of people within their jurisdiction. You pass a state law that on Universal BG Checks, we declare that is not valid, so we do not enforce it. (Local government ignores state government).

Now Enter preemption. A State law we like. We want to rely on preemption over the desire of local government to pass laws or regulations that impact our gun rights.

But Hey, we are a 2A Sanctuary County. We decide which laws we will and will not follow.

Now comes liberal Anti-2A City (we shall use a fictitious city and call it Fake City). So Fake City decides to declare Sanctuary from laws they feel are dangerous to their citizens and refuse to recognize preemption and instead adopts all kinds of restrictions in direct violation.

What I am saying is that declaring a Sanctuary jurisdiction could potentially be used for evil. If jurisdictions are given the legal ability to decide what laws they will, or will not, follow it can go in both directions.

Bob

They have not said they are exempt from those laws. They've said they will not help enforce them. That is an important distinction. They couldn't even enforce the laws if they wanted to. All they could do is assist the Feds in doing so.

How do you think they will enforce these bogus laws? House people in their county jail? Ignore the courts that tell them they are full of and can't enforce their laws?

There is no relationship between choosing to not enforce a law, and trying to enforce illegal laws.

 

[Phase2]

But Hey, we are a 2A Sanctuary County. We decide which laws we will and will not follow.

Complying with laws that directly violate our highest laws (the Constitution) is a "I was just following orders" mentality.

 

[HoughMade]

On "sanctuary counties"...can anyone explain for me what laws they will enforce and what laws they won't enforce and what the difference is between them under the 2nd Amendment?

 

[chevyguy]

Back to Pulaski County, the people in favor of the sanctuary movement are back on the agenda after being abruptly taken off to get our side out. Monday Feb 3 at 6PM county highway garage in Winamac.