AR Pistol Questions

[Reggywill]

~What qualifies an AR Pistol?
~Does the lower HAVE to be marked PISTOL to be legal?
~Are there restrictions on what type of buffer tube is legal? (Ex. 6-Position tube without the stock be legal?)

I'm sure this is somewhere else on here but I couldn't find much by doing a search.

I have a virgin stripped lower that I want to make into a pistol and want to make sure I don't break any laws before I take it to the range. I don't want to find out the hard way I made an illegal SBR instead of a pistol.

 

[inccwchris]

The lower does not have to be marked but you do have to use a specially made pistol buffer tube. The tube can not have any possibility of having a stock put on it.

Seen here. AR-15/M16 PISTOL BUFFER TUBE | Brownells

Also once it is a pistol, it is ALWAYS a pistol unless you do an SBR. The lowers are not specifically made one way or the other, but a rifle can be turned into a pistol but a pistol can not legally become a rifle. Keep in mind, you will be using a very short barrel in order to make the pistol function, anything longer than say about 10 inches will have problems running correctly. I do not know if it has to be shorter than a certain length to be considered a pistol, someone else will have to answer that. Make sure you have the pistol tube on it and you are good to go.

 

[Light]

The lower does not have to be marked but you do have to use a specially made pistol buffer tube. The tube can not have any possibility of having a stock put on it.

Seen here. AR-15/M16 PISTOL BUFFER TUBE | Brownells

Also once it is a pistol, it is ALWAYS a pistol unless you do an SBR. The lowers are not specifically made one way or the other, but a rifle can be turned into a pistol but a pistol can not legally become a rifle. Make sure you have the pistol tube on it and you are good to go.

So if someone were to completely strip it down, sell the upper and the buffer tube, and turn the lower into a rifle it wouldn't be legal? Interesting if so.

 

[HavokCycle]

So if somewhere were to completely strip it down, sell the upper and the buffer tube, and turn the lower into a rifle it wouldn't be legal? Interesting if so.

most lowers are sold as -other- which means it can be either as long as it within NFA regs. correct me if im wrong

 

[t1545jh]

If the lower is not marked as a pistol then it is considered a rifle and can never become a pistol. It can become an SBR with an approved form 1. If it is marked as a pistol then you are good as long as you dont add a stock or vertical fore grip. Im not sure about the gas tube. Im sure there will be guys along shortly who will know and possible correct me as well. NFA is its own animal, and can be very confusing at times.

 

[Bikerdad61]

~What qualifies an AR Pistol?

~Does the lower HAVE to be marked PISTOL to be legal?
Short answer, NO

~Are there restrictions on what type of buffer tube is legal? (Ex. 6-Position tube without the stock be legal?)
The Buffer tube must be constructed in a manner which will NOT allow a butt stock to be attached. Most pistol tubes are of smooth outer design. A 6 position tube even without the stock would not qualify as legal.

I'm sure this is somewhere else on here but I couldn't find much by doing a search.

I have a virgin stripped lower that I want to make into a pistol and want to make sure I don't break any laws before I take it to the range. I don't want to find out the hard way I made an illegal SBR instead of a pistol.

Most AR pistols are built with a Barrel under 16" (16" and over are considered rifle length barrels) Common pistol length barrels are 11.5", 10.5" and 7.5". A upper with a common pistol barrel length and a pistol design buffer tube is legal to build and own. The shorter the barrel the greater the chance for gas system cycling issues. However many people have had no issues with running a 7.5" barrel. It's not actually the barrel it's self, it's the length of the gas tube. They also make a longer gas tube known as a Pigtail system that will solve cycling issues.

If down the road you want to replace the pistol buffer tube with a buffer tube that will accept a butt stock, then you must first apply for a NFA stamp by going thru the proper BATFE procedures, pay the $200.00 tax and the receiver will be registered as a SBR (short barrel rifle)

 

[NathanJefferson]

~What qualifies an AR Pistol? Any AR lower that has NEVER had a stock on it.
~Does the lower HAVE to be marked PISTOL to be legal? NO
~Are there restrictions on what type of buffer tube is legal? (Ex. 6-Position tube without the stock be legal?) No. There is even an ATF letter stating so. Caveats, you cannot EVER put a stock on the buffer tube or else it irrevocably becomes a rifle, and if you have a short barrel on it you have an unregistered SBR.

I'm sure this is somewhere else on here but I couldn't find much by doing a search.

I have a virgin stripped lower that I want to make into a pistol and want to make sure I don't break any laws before I take it to the range. I don't want to find out the hard way I made an illegal SBR instead of a pistol.

Once a pistol you can convert to a SBR by getting an NFA stamp or putting a legal length rifle upper on it.

You can turn a pistol into a rifle, you cannot turn a rifle into a pistol.

You CAN use a standard multi-position buffer tube as long as you do not ever put a stock on it. If you want to be extra safe, don't have a spare stock hanging around your work bench as that could be 'constructive intent' but that could be stretching the law. IANAL, YMMV.

 

[atalon]

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...85-ingunowners_faqs_sticky-2.html#post1761124
Go here and read up on the SBR to help know the difference. This is just a FAQ so interpretations and laws can change obviously.

 

[PriestEG]

ok ive read thru all this thread and am still confused slightly... if i have a new, bare lower it can be made/built into either a rifle or pistol. that correct?

 

[NathanJefferson]

ok ive read thru all this thread and am still confused slightly... if i have a new, bare lower it can be made/built into either a rifle or pistol. that correct?

Correct.

 

[PriestEG]

Correct.

ok now thats clearly established for me.. if you originally build it as a rifle, it Can NOT be converted into a pistol later.

but if you build it as a pistol first, it could be converted to a rifle at a later date??

and caliber makes no difference in what direction you right

 

[atalon]

ok now thats clearly established for me.. if you originally build it as a rifle, it Can NOT be converted into a pistol later.

but if you build it as a pistol first, it could be converted to a rifle at a later date??

and caliber makes no difference in what direction you right

According to the way BATFE interprets the laws the 1st and 3rd statements are correct. However, if you convert a pistol into a rifle is is considered a SBR (Short Barreled Rifle) and is a NFA item requiring a stamp.

You could however convert the SBR back into a pistol if you wanted if it started it's life that way.

 

[NathanJefferson]

According to the way BATFE interprets the laws the 1st and 3rd statements are correct. However, if you convert a pistol into a rifle is is considered a SBR (Short Barreled Rifle) and is a NFA item requiring a stamp.

You could however convert the SBR back into a pistol if you wanted if it started it's life that way.

For clarification:

It is only a SBR if you have a short barrel on it, a 16 inch or 14.5inch with pinned flash hider is fine.

If you convert it to a rifle, which the by the law means ever, even for a second putting, a stock on it you cannot ever go back to a pistol.

If you have a less than legal length barrel on a stocked or previously stocked rifle, and no NFA stamp, you have an illegal SBR.

If you do get the SBR stamp you are free to remove the stock and turn it into a 'pistol like' configuration, but it is NOT a pistol it remains a SBR.

 

[EvilBlackGun]

Saw some beautiful bare lowers at the Alec show.

No marks on them at all except fine machine marks. Resembled forged aluminum, and beautiful! All holes, trigger well, etc proper but no other marks. $250 asked. Didn't buy, didn't ask. What are they?

 

[stephen87]

ok now thats clearly established for me.. if you originally build it as a rifle, it Can NOT be converted into a pistol later.

but if you build it as a pistol first, it could be converted to a rifle at a later date??

and caliber makes no difference in what direction you right

All three statements are correct. If you build it as a pistol, it can be converted to a rifle AND back. If you build it as a rifle first, it can never be a pistol. Calibers have no bearing.

According to the way BATFE interprets the laws the 1st and 3rd statements are correct. However, if you convert a pistol into a rifle is is considered a SBR (Short Barreled Rifle) and is a NFA item requiring a stamp.

You could however convert the SBR back into a pistol if you wanted if it started it's life that way.

Incorrect. The only way it would be an SBR is if the barrel is less than 16" in length. If you have a pistol and add a 16"+ upper, it is not an SBR, but a legal rifle.

For clarification:

It is only a SBR if you have a short barrel on it, a 16 inch or 14.5inch with pinned flash hider is fine.

If you convert it to a rifle, which the by the law means ever, even for a second putting, a stock on it you cannot ever go back to a pistol.

If you have a less than legal length barrel on a stocked or previously stocked rifle, and no NFA stamp, you have an illegal SBR.

If you do get the SBR stamp you are free to remove the stock and turn it into a 'pistol like' configuration, but it is NOT a pistol it remains a SBR.

Incorrect. If you convert a pistol into a rifle, it can go back to a pistol. You are correct in saying that a lower that starts as a rifle can never go to a pistol legally.

http://atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2011-4.pdf

IANAL, however the ruling is right there for you to read. What you want to specifically read is the section titled "Assembly of Weapons from Parts Kit."

 

[NathanJefferson]

All three statements are correct. If you build it as a pistol, it can be converted to a rifle AND back. If you build it as a rifle first, it can never be a pistol. Calibers have no bearing.



Incorrect. The only way it would be an SBR is if the barrel is less than 16" in length. If you have a pistol and add a 16"+ upper, it is not an SBR, but a legal rifle.


Incorrect. If you convert a pistol into a rifle, it can go back to a pistol. You are correct in saying that a lower that starts as a rifle can never go to a pistol legally.

http://atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2011-4.pdf

IANAL, however the ruling is right there for you to read. What you want to specifically read is the section titled "Assembly of Weapons from Parts Kit."

From my research that ruling applies to "kits" that come with all mentioned parts(think T/C contender). IANAL but unless you buy the lower, stock, rifle upper, pistol upper, pistol tube as a "kit" you cannot go back from rifle to pistol.

 

[GMack_1]

I think Georgia's gun laws are very similar to IN's, but I am not an expert. I have a stripped lower just waiting for an AR pistol. This vid is another one that most folks have seen, but if you are new to the game then go nuts..., but these days cross your T's and dot your I's.., good luck

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAIkT8XaAtA[/ame]

 

[stephen87]

From my research that ruling applies to "kits" that come with all mentioned parts(think T/C contender). IANAL but unless you buy the lower, stock, rifle upper, pistol upper, pistol tube as a "kit" you cannot go back from rifle to pistol.

The ruling very well could be based on "kits," but I disagree that it's meant to only include kits due to one key phrase: "Therefore, so long as a parts kit or collection of parts is not used to make a firearm regulated under the NFA..."

It clearly states that a collection of parts, which an AR-15 is a collection of parts.

 

[Echelon]

Holy Crap, this thread went down hill quickly... the first few posts were overflowing with incorrect info.
Reggywill, Good luck with your AR pistol build, they are a ton of fun, especially if this is an pending SBR build, and you want to play before you pay!

 

[Shibby575]

When it's bought doesn't it have to be designated a pistol or rifle? Or are they just written up as bare lowers? The reason I ask is because if it was written up as a rifle you might get yourself into trouble making a pistol out of the lower.