ar trigger

[d30carls]

has anyone here used one of these trigger spring kits on your AR-15 if so what was the result positive or negative I dont have much money to spend on a good trigger right now and probably wont for a while thought this may get me by till next year

JP Enterprises Trigger Spring Kit AR-15 3-1/2 lb Reduced Power

 

[rvb]

I would suggest not using the hammer spring unless you are using a lighter hammer, or there's a good chance you'll have some ignition problems.....

someone posted a link yesterday to a RRA 2-stage for <$70. While I haven't tried the ALG yet (thinking about it for my 9mm), it gets good reports as being somewhat improved over most stock triggers and is ~$45.

-rvb

 

[M67]

I've had it in a couple personal rifles, I ran one in my LR308, it definitely reduced power, but the factory DPMS trigger sucked and had so many gritty stages, the reduced power kit kind of brought out the grittiness more. When I rebuilt the 308 I ended up putting an Armalite FCG in it.

So when I built my pistol, since I had the springs lying around, I stuck it in that using a Spikes Enhanced trigger. I'm not really noticing a huge difference with that trigger and spring combo.


But, I know a lot of people who wanted a better trigger but didn't want to spend the money in a new trigger, so they've put these in. Overall the triggers have felt better, every once in a while you don't notice a change, every once in a while it makes it worse. Really depends how rough the trigger is before you put this kit in.

It's one of the cheapest things you can do to an AR to where if it doesn't work like you want it to, you're not out a lot of money, I'd say try it.

Be it in 308 or 556, I've never had a problem with light strikes using the reduced hammer spring

 

[rvb]

Be it in 308 or 556, I've never had a problem with light strikes using the reduced hammer spring

I too cheaped out and tried this setup many years ago. Wouldn't run w/ cheaper (Eastern-block or South African) .556, eg Olympic, S&B, etc that is known for having harder primers...

in the end, I should have put the $10 towards a better trigger. Heck, if the OP wants, I'll look and see if I still have these springs in my parts bin....

cheaping out almost always results in spending more $ in the long run. Save until you can get something decent, IMO. As m67 said, sometimes lighter just reveals how crappy your trigger really is.... I'm a big JP fan, but something like this just works better in part of a tuned system, not just a drop-in attempt to polish turds....

-rvb

 

[d30carls]

Thanks for the info guys i figured for the price it would not be the best other wise no one would buy $200 triggers guess i will just wait untill I can afford a decent trigger i have never tried anything with a trigger that was not factory so i have no clue what to expect

 

[bbr1121]

We have used many of these kits on our "in house" trigger jobs. Not a single issue to date and they are a significant improvement from factory.

-matt USDS

 

[teddy12b]

I've been fortunate to have an AR with a stock "mil-spec" trigger installed and an AR with the $10 yellow JP springs installed. I could tell a big difference right away. You don't loose a lot of the rough feel if the trigger is rough, what I noticed was just how lighter the trigger pull was itself. A lighter trigger is going to be more accurate and that's why I put these spring kits in my guns. That was until I was training with a guy who's AR I had assembled for him and he was running XM193 (mil surplus 55gr fmj) and he had a light primer strike. There he was behind a barrel with his go-to home defense and whatever else rifle and it didn't fire because of these springs. It was at that point that I decided that I was going to be putting my factory springs back in my guns since I'm starting to buy more XM193 ammo as prices come back down.

For the right guy, the $10 spring kits are a great thing. They're cheap and you'll get tighter groups right now. If you're going to shoot military surplus ammo exclusively then these spring kits aren't going to be the way to go. If you're going to be casually shooting reloads at the range, then the spring kits can't really hurt for $10. Just my two cents.

 

[tradertator]

I've used them in the past but ditched them when I started experiencing light primer strikes on ammo with harder primers. I'd suggest putting the money towards something else if reliability is of utmost concern.

 

[Leo]

I have bent ONE of the legs on hammer and trigger springs for years. Without polishing and re-stoning the hammer and sear surface, you end up with the same trigger, it just feels lighter. Many people are happy with that. I started using Krieger/Malozzo triggers and then went to Jewell Triggers in the mouse gun. I used to believe there was nothing worth shooting without a Jewell. I have one with a Jewell and two with Geissele triggers. Now I kind of think the jewell is a dog.

 

[SEIndSAM]

I have installed the ALG Defense trigger in my last 2 builds and am very pleased. It's not a $200 Geissele trigger, but it is way better than stock and only $50.

 

[Hookeye]

I've used them repeatedly, no problems.
Polish contact surfaces, add set screw above grip screw to take creep out (and if need be, notch back of trigger for even more creep out- but then the disconnector needs dressed down a bit to work right).
End up with a decent hunting trigger for $20.

PMC, WW, Blackhills, AM Eagle, even steel case Wolf, and some other foreign crap............ran fine in my rigs.

 

[Hookeye]

For those with failures to fire, I wonder how they absolutely verified it was due to the lighter springs alone?

 

[teddy12b]

For those with failures to fire, I wonder how they absolutely verified it was due to the lighter springs alone?

In my case all my rifles ran like what you described, no problems. The AR my buddy has was a light primer strike. During the training he just cycled in a new round and kept on going like he should have, but afterwards we went and picked it up and saw the slightly smaller than usual primer strike. I don't think the spring kits are bad, but if it's a 1 in 10 guns chance that you're going to get light primer strikes then it may be a deal breaker depending on what your AR is used for.

 

[Hookeye]

Maybe the springs caused the issue, maybe they didn't.................wouldn't claim they did without applying proper problem solving/experimentation.

 

[teddy12b]

What's the proper problem solving when a rifle with lighter trigger springs puts a smaller dent in the primer and doesn't set it off. Then another AR with mil-spec springs chambers the round and fires it without issue. Second guess it all you want, it was the springs plain and simple.

 

[rvb]

Maybe the springs caused the issue, maybe they didn't.................wouldn't claim they did without applying proper problem solving/experimentation.

it's not brain science or rocket surgery. no worky w/ light hammer spring; worky w/ regular spring. Could other factors contribute (like what? slightly short firing pin?), I suppose.

If you know what ammo you're going to be running and know not to use others, tuning lighter is ok. If you want it to work w/ anything, then it may not be ok. I've got tuned pistols that ONLY run w/ federal primers. I wouldn't tell folks to run the springs I run in those guns w/o cautioning that the gun may not light off some ammo. No different than this. You can overcome some of the reliability issues w/ a lighter hammer (eg cutting off the 'tail' on a std AR hammer), but that's what I meant by tuning the system, not just dropping in springs.

-rvb

 

[rvb]

from JP's website:
JP - Spring Kits

Note: Use of this spring kit requires the use of US manufactured (domestic) ammunition or reloads with domestic (non-NATO spec) primers as ignition reliability will be reduced with hard low sensitivity primers as found in made foreign made ammunitions and NATO specification ammunition. Use these parts only in rifles for recreational or competition shooting. Do not use this spring kit for any defense or duty applications or any AR-10 type rifle.

 

[Hookeye]

Could not contaminates or other contribute to the problem (maybe the problem was only with the round itself)?
The other rounds went off.................do springs just wimp out for one cycle?

Nobody ever have a light strike on a regular spring AR?

Yeah, JP offers a warning, and somebody got a light primer dent. That doesn't mean that warning proves why.

Problem solving and rocket science..............yeah there's a freakin' link to that stuff.

BTW, lawyer talk (warnings by companies) doesn't exactly prove a problem with the gear. It is there to thwart those who might have or think they have a problem (maybe unrelated) and place blame on them. This thread proves why they need it.

And FWIW, doesn't cutting the tail off a reg GI AR hammer actually cause problems when using lighter springs? (Reduced mass).

I could see cutting one if using regular springs for less lock time (if wanting a possible accuracy gain from that "direction").
IMHO there's more accuracy gain to be had from a lighter trigger.



The light springs may have been a major factor in the light primer strike, but there is no real proof of it. Not when other rounds went off and the suspect round was not properly analyzed (before and after the event).


Now, saying it MIGHT have been the problem, or a major factor in it, that's one thing. Saying it WAS the problem, based on the severely limited data and questionable testing methods, is another.

I actually want to know what happens to stuff. Masking things by applying slop may yield a satisfactory result, but that doesn't identify and solve the problem.


If the car dies going down the road and you get out and see a low tire, stop and take a few minutes to change the tire, and then get back in and the car starts and runs OK.................was the low tire the problem? Hey, low tire and it died. No low tire and it runs.............same junk science.

And if it never screws up again, that's enough proof.

Yee friggin' haw.

 

[rvb]

You're right, it is rocket science. If I decide to go for my phd I'll make the correlation/causation my thesis.....

-rvb

 

[teddy12b]

You're right, it is rocket science. If I decide to go for my phd I'll make the correlation/causation my thesis.....

-rvb

Yup, it's rocket science.