ATF raid in Parker City - Ludco Gun Shop

[duff]

Regardless how you feel it's a big deal to have this shop raided and shut down. Time will tell what if anything he did wrong. Been 15+ years since I have been in the shop. I nearly went crazy inthe shop as I couldn't focus on anything only all the guns all over the place. Never bought anything there but from the sounds of it he sounds like most of the gun shops I have dealt with except for a few good ones out there. Most treat me like I don't exist for what ever reason and if they are not interested in selling me a gun I certainly am not interested in shelling out cash to them...

I hope the right thing happens weather it is him getting cleared or paying his debt if actually guilty of a crime.

As far as 70 agents in his shop...not a chance but I remember seing all the agents show up at a puppy mill in Greene County last year. Seemed there were about 2 agents per puppy. I wondered how those people got payed and more importantly who was paying them

 

[thompal]

Plead the 5th!

BUZZ! Sorry. You can only plead the 5th if you are guilty.

 

[thompal]

I havent read more anti-government tin foil wearing wing nut statements before in my life. Really?

Really? You never hung out on Fidonet FIREARMS?

 

[jeremy]

WOW...

Some of you need to put the brakes on Your speculations...
Yes the BATF&E raided the Place. As far as I know that is the only fact that is known at this time. I would really like to hear from someone around there to learn a little more. Would really be great to hear from the someone who can tell the Shops side of the Facts...

 

[seanamus]

Is it really that hard to believe that someone broke the law and is now paying the consequences for it? I havent read more anti-government tin foil wearing wing nut statements before in my life. Really? The ATF set up Fred Ludington after 30+ years of selling guns and ammo? Come on, get real. It is more likely that this asshat or someone that works for him was doing something illegal. Flame away I dont care, but come on. Climb out of your bunkers and take off your gas mask. This is how guns make it to the streets, shady gun dealers doing straw purchases. And it didnt say he skipped the 4473 it said that someone else was filing out the paperwork, not the buyer.

i dont think he would suddenly start breaking the law on account every time i went there he did everything by the book including the background check so unless he has multiple personalities and twilight's as a dealer to less then desirable people. how can you believe anything the ATF says? especially after gun runner, hell they encouraged dealers to sell to criminals! now kiss my tin foil wearing rear end

 

[edsinger]

There is no way they could fit 17 agents in there, let alone 70!

^^^^ THIS ^^^^^

 

[Destro]

Sounds to me like this clown shouldn't have been in the gun business anyway...They give him a slap on the wrist for some MAJOR violations?!?!!...hopefully he gets a fair trial, and if found guilty goes away for a long time if these claims are true. This guy gives other gun shops a bad wrap

Between August and November of 2010, Ludington’s firearms dealership underwent a routine, periodic audit conducted by agents of the ATF. During the course of that audit, ATF Inspectors discovered that Ludington had acquired but could not account for 997 firearms that were recorded in his inventory. Ninety-three (93) firearms were located in the physical inventory that had not been logged into the A & D record. In twenty-five (25) instances, a firearm was found in physical inventory but the A & D books reflected the firearm has been sold. Additionally, inspectors uncovered documents suggesting that, on at least seven (7) occasions, Ludco sold firearms to persons who were prohibited by federal law from possessing them. Ludington was also cited with selling a handgun to an out of state resident in violation of federal law, and numerous other regulatory and record keeping violations. At the conclusion of the audit, the inspectors issued Ludington a warning not to engage in such unlawful conduct in the future.

 

[printcraft]

...... now kiss my tin foil wearing rear end

It's not going to do you any good there trust me, you are supposed to wear it on your head.

 

[seanamus]

It's not going to do you any good there trust me, you are supposed to wear it on your head.

HAVENT YOU EVER HEARD THE TERM BUTT HEAD, DO YOU HAVE DOO DOO FOR BRAINS

Destro

Sounds to me like this clown shouldn't have been in the gun business anyway...They give him a slap on the wrist for some MAJOR violations?!?!!...hopefully he gets a fair trial, and if found guilty goes away for a long time if these claims are true. This guy gives other gun shops a bad wrap

Between August and November of 2010, Ludington’s firearms dealership underwent a routine, periodic audit conducted by agents of the ATF. During the course of that audit, ATF Inspectors discovered that Ludington had acquired but could not account for 997 firearms that were recorded in his inventory. Ninety-three (93) firearms were located in the physical inventory that had not been logged into the A & D record. In twenty-five (25) instances, a firearm was found in physical inventory but the A & D books reflected the firearm has been sold. Additionally, inspectors uncovered documents suggesting that, on at least seven (7) occasions, Ludco sold firearms to persons who were prohibited by federal law from possessing them. Ludington was also cited with selling a handgun to an out of state resident in violation of federal law, and numerous other regulatory and record keeping violations. At the conclusion of the audit, the inspectors issued Ludington a warning not to engage in such unlawful conduct in the future.

so the plot thickens, sounds even more like he was working with them but quit, on account the ATF revokes or suspends FFLs for poor punctuation or incorrect spelling...

 

[Destro]

HAVENT YOU EVER HEARD THE TERM BUTT HEAD, DO YOU HAVE DOO DOO FOR BRAINS

Destro

Sounds to me like this clown shouldn't have been in the gun business anyway...They give him a slap on the wrist for some MAJOR violations?!?!!...hopefully he gets a fair trial, and if found guilty goes away for a long time if these claims are true. This guy gives other gun shops a bad wrap

Between August and November of 2010, Ludington’s firearms dealership underwent a routine, periodic audit conducted by agents of the ATF. During the course of that audit, ATF Inspectors discovered that Ludington had acquired but could not account for 997 firearms that were recorded in his inventory. Ninety-three (93) firearms were located in the physical inventory that had not been logged into the A & D record. In twenty-five (25) instances, a firearm was found in physical inventory but the A & D books reflected the firearm has been sold. Additionally, inspectors uncovered documents suggesting that, on at least seven (7) occasions, Ludco sold firearms to persons who were prohibited by federal law from possessing them. Ludington was also cited with selling a handgun to an out of state resident in violation of federal law, and numerous other regulatory and record keeping violations. At the conclusion of the audit, the inspectors issued Ludington a warning not to engage in such unlawful conduct in the future.

so the plot thickens, sounds even more like he was working with them but quit, on account the ATF revokes or suspends FFLs for poor punctuation or incorrect spelling...

1000+ guns misaccounted for = verbal warning
transpose a DL number = Club Fed

 

[seanamus]

1000+ guns misaccounted for = verbal warning
transpose a DL number = Club Fed

exactly, just off the way this happened. unless he really does have multiple personalities... several have said he was rude, every time i went he was pretty nice and gave plenty of attention.

 

[Cherryspringer]

If the A.T.F. wanted to take a bunch of weapons off the street this would have been the place to hit. I've not seen an inventory like his store anywhere else. I can't believe they would have the right to keep his inventory. It would be like them taking all of the inventory from walmart for a clerk selling cigarettes to a minor. I didnt care for Fred either, he personally bid against me at his auction in the fall. But the Feds shouldn't be able to just take a million $ if they see fit.

 

[warmachine]

i dont think he would suddenly start breaking the law on account every time i went there he did everything by the book including the background check so unless he has multiple personalities and twilight's as a dealer to less then desirable people. how can you believe anything the ATF says? especially after gun runner, hell they encouraged dealers to sell to criminals! now kiss my tin foil wearing rear end

No one said he wasnt doing the background checks, what they said was he was doing straw purchases. He can do a background check on everyone in the store but if someone besides the person filing out the paperwork hands him the money he's broken the law. Ive had gun shops refuse to take money from my wife as I was filing out the paperwork, as ridiculous as it was, but thats the law. And for him (fred) to allegedly know that the person paying for the weapon was a convicted felon breaks yet another law. Now for your further reading enjoyment...

On each of those occasions, Ludington sold firearms despite the fact that someone other than the actual purchaser of the firearms was filling out the mandatory paperwork.

In three (3) of those instances, an informant (who is also a convicted felon) informed Ludington that he wanted to purchase a firearm. Ludington knew the purchaser was a convicted felon, yet sold the firearm anyway.

The convicted felon handed Ludington the money to complete the purchase of the firearms.

 

[E5RANGER375]

well just goes to show you that the govt will flip your wife on you if they think they can get a conviction. hide your kids, hide your wife....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMtZfW2z9dw

 

[indyjohn]

This is quality comedy: "hang on the door bell just rang........................"

As for my hate comment: Nobody knows what really happened. Nobody's gonna know. Could it be politically motivated? Maybe. I have to deal with politics where I work and hate it. Was the guy operating outside of the laws on the books? I don't know and neither does anyone else. I am entertained by the "Angry Mob with axes and pitchforks" that form around these kind of things. What are you gonna do? Stop buying guns and dig a hole to hide in? I'm not. Sometimes it seems there are a lot that have done just that. It makes me wonder if the statistics on paranoid people in the wild are grossly underestimated.

Just my

 

[GeneralCarver]

I think it would be a more accurate representation to say that the ATF is an evil group of liars.

The ATF has lied before.

The ATF has set people up before.

It is likely that they are continuing this habit and pattern.

Let's say that you believe the ATF (Which you apparently do). Have you asked yourself why the ATF should be able to, by their own admission, break federal law, and pay others to break federal law, for the sole purpose of trying to get their "target" to also break the law?

If you or I (assuming you don't work for ATF) were to go into a gun store and try to persuade the salesperson into selling a firearm without proper paperwork, do you think that only the saleperson would go to prison? Or, is it more likely that BOTH buyer and seller would go to prison? Why, then, if such an act is a federal felony when done by us, is it acceptable for the ATF to have felons perform the same activity in the name of "justice?" Government authority comes FROM us, and as such, how is it possible that we have granted them more authority than we ourselves have?

Where in the 9th and 10th Amendments does it grant federal employees power and authority superior to that of the citizens? Where in Article I, Section 8, does Congress have the ability to enable such activities?

You can turn a blind eye to ATF if you want, or even condone their actions and history wholesale, but you have to remember, that ATF is, at its core, a TAX enforcement agency, and is a part of Dept. of Treasury. Doesn't 70 federal agents (plus support personnel) seem excessive to enforce a TAX CODE? Or does it seem more like ATF's traditional grandstanding?

Extremely well said my friend. You are a true Patriot.

 

[Koukalaka]

I feel bad for the other guy who works at Ludco--I forget his name. He was pleasant to deal with and doubtless will lose that job now.

 

[Yamaha]

I feel bad for the other guy who works at Ludco--I forget his name. He was pleasant to deal with and doubtless will lose that job now.

or get rang up as an accomplice........sadly we do need to find out more details since I don't trust the atf's "official" statement. I prefer to see facts lined out and reserve judgement until then

 

[ddenny5]

Coming from the ATF, I have ZERO faith that this is anywhere close to the truth. More likely, it means that they tried to pressure him to entrap someone, and he refused to play their game.

Or, perhaps he was not very polite to an ATF agent during a visit.

I wouldn't trust ATF to tell the truth under any circumstances. If they want to arrest a gunstore owner, do they really need 100 people to do it? Why not just wait for him to leave work and approach him in the parking lot with a polite "Excuse me sir"?

Let me guess, ATF's budget is up for renewal, and they needed a grandstanding event to show what a grand job they are doing? Did they arrive in cattle trailers?

Good point! Project Gunrunner got a customs officer killed. He had too many guns i.e. Ruby Ridge. However if Fred did break the law he does need to be punished. If you bought something there legally; you should not have anything to worry about.

 

[turnandshoot4]

This is quality comedy: "hang on the door bell just rang........................"

As for my hate comment: Nobody knows what really happened. Nobody's gonna know. Could it be politically motivated? Maybe. I have to deal with politics where I work and hate it. Was the guy operating outside of the laws on the books? I don't know and neither does anyone else. I am entertained by the "Angry Mob with axes and pitchforks" that form around these kind of things. What are you gonna do? Stop buying guns and dig a hole to hide in? I'm not. Sometimes it seems there are a lot that have done just that. It makes me wonder if the statistics on paranoid people in the wild are grossly underestimated.

Just my

Great post! RUN! A guy that was doing something illegal got arrested! OH NOES! How could they?!