Building permit for a pergola - what a crock

[Sfrandolph]

Just my rant about the bureaucratic BS that is Marion County code enforcement.

My wife and I wanted to build a small pergola on our back patio. I figured I should give code enforcement a call, just in case. Found out that for a 10'x10' pergola I would have to submit plans, get them reviewed, pay for an improvement permit, a structural permit and get it inspected, totaling about $400....for something to hang plants off of. Are you kidding me?

Just the price you have to pay for living in the big city. Oh that's right...who the hell wants to live in the big ghetto city?

 

[Suprtek]

After seeing all the violations of the so called rules in our HOA, I pretty much decided to ignore it. I've done several things on my property that some would say are in violation. I'm pretty sure I've done a few things that I was supposed to have a building permit for. Oh well.

 

[88GT]

What did they do? Break his leg?

Well, war might be overstating the animosity a bit. But for some reason, he's got it out for them and they have no kind words for him. A few years ago, they were cited for violating some stupid code that restricts the gross weight and/or dual-wheel status of a certain size truck. Yet the Matco tool guy with the 20' big box truck and the semi driver still park their vehicles without penalty.

He makes regular drives through the neighborhood to check on them for compliance and they remain in compliance....just barely. But since we both live on the corner, and my back yard faces their side yard, the code enforcer has an unobstructed view of my entire back yard. So I have to be watch myself too.

 

[mcolford]

I got a buddy on town board if we needed permits, he laughed at me.....

 

[smokingman]

Lack of building permit requirements is part of the reason we moved to northern Minnesota.

It may seem incredible to some,but up here there are very few rules.You need a permit for a drive way(do to the influence of water movement),a septic permit,and of course your zoning permit(residential,commercial ect).

I can build a barn as large as I like without getting a permit.It would need to meet state building codes,but then again there is no inspector responsible to even check it.All the inspectors up here really do is check septic systems and protect designated wet lands(which I made sure the property I purchased had none).

I am tearing down two buildings on the property and building one larger building.I even stopped and asked at the county office and they said "Do what every you like,the only thing you may need to do is let the assessors office know you took down buildings and put up a new one for tax purposes,you do not need any permits.Thanks for stopping by,that sounds like to much work for me."

 

[remauto1187]

And this is why I like Parke Co. they inspect septic systems...thats it.

I called the county up in 2009 to get a electrical permit so I could yank the knob and tube wiring out of my house and install a 200a service. The lady laughed and said "honey we havent had an electrical inspector since the mid 90's" !

My house built in 1900 now has a grounding system..for the very first time!

Next up is a deck, sliding patio door, hot tub room, new siding and windows.

 

[MikeDVB]

hot tube room

What are you planning on keeping in the hot tubes?

 

[IndyDave1776]

What are you planning on keeping in the hot tubes?

Maybe a room for those tubular appliances that keep welding rod dry?

 

[Lakefield22]

I guess part of my frustration over the whole permit thing is the lack of a clear statement of if I do or don't. Speaking to someone at the home improvement store's garden center, they insisted that I did not need one for a simple pergola. Then one of their building/lumber guys said I would need an improvement permit because it would be close to the house but that they are cheap and can be gotten over the phone. Call code enforcement and they tell me that it is $400 and both an improvement and structural permit are required. Then this morning a call a landscaping company to ask if they install pergolas and handle permitting and they tell me I should just call back speak to someone else because depending on who I talk to, they might say I don't need a permit or just give me a cheap improvement permit. This is exactly the kind of bureaucratic nonsense that I hate. The law is just vague enough and the enforcement so haphazard that depending on the whim of some half-wit civil servant that may or may not decide that I need a permit. Is there a graduate academy to go from building permit office to ATF or do they just take the ones that pick their nose the least?

 

[hornadylnl]

And this is why I like Parke Co. they inspect septic systems...thats it.

I called the county up in 2009 to get a electrical permit so I could yank the knob and tube wiring out of my house and install a 200a service. The lady laughed and said "honey we havent had an electrical inspector since the mid 90's" !

My house built in 1900 now has a grounding system..for the very first time!

Next up is a deck, sliding patio door, hot tube room, new siding and windows.

When I built my house and barn, I did all the wiring. I put in:

400 amp meter base/transfer switch
2 - 200 amp disconnects (1 for house, 1 for barn)
2 - 200 amp main panels (1 for house, 1 for barn)
2 - 100 amp sub panels in the house
4000'+ of 12/2
Almost 1000' of 12/3

The day the REMC guys came out to hook up the meter base, the head linesman spent about 30 seconds looking at my meter base and main panel in my house and told his guys to hook it up. That was the only electrical "inspection" I had.

 

[hornadylnl]

I guess part of my frustration over the whole permit thing is the lack of a clear statement of if I do or don't. Speaking to someone at the home improvement store's garden center, they insisted that I did not need one for a simple pergola. Then one of their building/lumber guys said I would need an improvement permit because it would be close to the house but that they are cheap and can be gotten over the phone. Call code enforcement and they tell me that it is $400 and both an improvement and structural permit are required. Then this morning a call a landscaping company to ask if they install pergolas and handle permitting and they tell me I should just call back speak to someone else because depending on who I talk to, they might say I don't need a permit or just give me a cheap improvement permit. This is exactly the kind of bureaucratic nonsense that I hate. The law is just vague enough and the enforcement so haphazard that depending on the whim of some half-wit civil servant that may or may not decide that I need a permit. Is there a graduate academy to go from building permit office to ATF or do they just take the ones that pick their nose the least?

This isn't the fault of government alone. You can equally blame those who value property values over property rights. Many of the current building codes exist for no other reason than people want to control what their neighbors can and can't do with their properties. The fact that you called and asked about a permit for fear your neighbors would report you is evidence enough.

 

[MikeDVB]

The fact that you called and asked about a permit for fear your neighbors would report you is evidence enough.

Excellent point!

 

[remauto1187]

What are you planning on keeping in the hot tubes?

I store trolls in there. Every once in awhile I feed them to the dogs.

 

[MikeDVB]

I store trolls in there. Every once in awhile I feed them to the dogs.

OH! Where are you finding trolls these days? All the ones I find are not fresh and have already been torn to pieces!

 

[88GT]

Excellent point!

What point? Busybody neighbors are every where. Hornady likes to **** and moan about neighbors not minding their own business, but I have a hard time finding sympathy for folks who CHOOSE to live in areas where neighbors are given that kind of authority by virtue of HOAs or local code.

Local government should reflect what the people want. If one doesn't like it, he should choose to live where it is more amenable to his tastes. But there's no one to blame but himself if he continues to live under the boot of such horrible tyranny as permitting and building codes and zoning ordinances.

 

[MikeDVB]

What point?

That the codes appear to be designed in such a way to give your neighbors power over you. That is all.

 

[Lakefield22]

What point? Busybody neighbors are every where. Hornady likes to **** and moan about neighbors not minding their own business, but I have a hard time finding sympathy for folks who CHOOSE to live in areas where neighbors are given that kind of authority by virtue of HOAs or local code.

Local government should reflect what the people want. If one doesn't like it, he should choose to live where it is more amenable to his tastes. But there's no one to blame but himself if he continues to live under the boot of such horrible tyranny as permitting and building codes and zoning ordinances.

My point is that it is a bad law, poorly regulated and unequally enforced. It is unreasonable. and more than a little farcical, that one is required to obtain a permit of such expense for something as simple as a garden structure to hang plants. The fact that the law itself is interpreted unevenly by a local government minion just makes it all the more unreasonable. Where one chooses to live does not have any impact on whether the law is a good one or not. I am sure many people in New York would like to own high capacity magazines and are displeased that local law does not permit them. However, I am not going to suggest to them it is their own fault for choosing to live there when it is obvious to me that the law is a bad one.

To be fair, I could easily decide to move a greater distance from my place of employment, to a place with laws and ordinances more to my liking. Or I could simply leave my job and move back to my farm in Kentucky. But the inconvenience of local ordinance in how I arrange my backyard seems trivial to lose of income and/or additional travel those two options would require. And none of those options does anything to diminish that it is a stupid law.

 

[remauto1187]

OH! Where are you finding trolls these days? All the ones I find are not fresh and have already been torn to pieces!

I usually only mess with the ol' geezers since they dont put up much of a fight and they are almost always all bark and no bite and if they try to bite I kick them in their neck and stomp on their heads a little and that changes their attittude real quick.

 

[88GT]

My point is that it is a bad law, poorly regulated and unequally enforced. It is unreasonable. and more than a little farcical, that one is required to obtain a permit of such expense for something as simple as a garden structure to hang plants. The fact that the law itself is interpreted unevenly by a local government minion just makes it all the more unreasonable. Where one chooses to live does not have any impact on whether the law is a good one or not. I am sure many people in New York would like to own high capacity magazines and are displeased that local law does not permit them. However, I am not going to suggest to them it is their own fault for choosing to live there when it is obvious to me that the law is a bad one.

To be fair, I could easily decide to move a greater distance from my place of employment, to a place with laws and ordinances more to my liking. Or I could simply leave my job and move back to my farm in Kentucky. But the inconvenience of local ordinance in how I arrange my backyard seems trivial to lose of income and/or additional travel those two options would require. And none of those options does anything to diminish that it is a stupid law.

Yes, it's a stupid ordinance. I never said it wasn't. But are you living where you live by choice or not? Complain about it all you want, but in the end realize that the only one responsible for your current situation is you. That's all I'm saying.

 

[Caleb]

Whenever I get around to buying my first piece of land/house, there's 3 things that are deal breakers to me:

1) Flood zone, it sucked in June of 2008 and not looking to do that all over again.
2) HOA...mind your own business!
3) In any big city, aka, Indy.