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Carrying Handgun License / Drivers License on your Person?
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Kirk Freeman
Grandmaster
No, you are not. Now stop that.
Who told you this???
inccwchris
Sharpshooter
IC 34-28-5-3.5
Refusal to identify self
Sec. 3.5. A person who knowingly or intentionally refuses to provide either the person's:
(1) name, address, and date of birth; or
(2) driver's license, if in the person's possession;
to a law enforcement officer who has stopped the person for an infraction or ordinance violation commits a Class C misdemeanor.
As added by P.L.1-1998, SEC.24.
You can and will be charged, prosecuted and fined for failure to produce identification to a police officer when it is requested.
Refusal to identify self
Sec. 3.5. A person who knowingly or intentionally refuses to provide either the person's:
(1) name, address, and date of birth; or
(2) driver's license, if in the person's possession;
to a law enforcement officer who has stopped the person for an infraction or ordinance violation commits a Class C misdemeanor.
As added by P.L.1-1998, SEC.24.
You can and will be charged, prosecuted and fined for failure to produce identification to a police officer when it is requested.
inccwchris
Sharpshooter
Also
Per IC 34-28-5-3 a Indiana Police Officer may, when acting in good faith, require of a Man his name, address, or date of birth for any suspected ordinance violation or other infraction.
Per IC 34-28-5-3-3.5 it is a Crime in Indiana, a Class C Misdemeanor, to refuse to comply with the foregoing provisions of 38-28-5-3 when thatOfficer is indeed acting in good faith. Refusal to Identify, when asked, is a Crime per the unique statutory framework of Indiana Law.
While in Indiana, if any Man goes armed in Public with a Handgun, then, a Officermay, with the foregoing procedure, ask ofHim to make goodHisname, His address, and His birth date, while that Man is armed in Public or any Public Place. Also, you must show your Handgun Carry License as well.
Per IC 34-28-5-3 a Indiana Police Officer may, when acting in good faith, require of a Man his name, address, or date of birth for any suspected ordinance violation or other infraction.
Per IC 34-28-5-3-3.5 it is a Crime in Indiana, a Class C Misdemeanor, to refuse to comply with the foregoing provisions of 38-28-5-3 when thatOfficer is indeed acting in good faith. Refusal to Identify, when asked, is a Crime per the unique statutory framework of Indiana Law.
While in Indiana, if any Man goes armed in Public with a Handgun, then, a Officermay, with the foregoing procedure, ask ofHim to make goodHisname, His address, and His birth date, while that Man is armed in Public or any Public Place. Also, you must show your Handgun Carry License as well.
Hoosierdood
Grandmaster
You need to go back and read this thread rather than just posting what you think in order to get your post count up. YOU ARE NOT REQUIRED TO CARRY IDENTIFICATION. Even in the IC that you cited, all that I am required to provide is my name, address and d.o.b., and this is ONLY in the event that I am suspected of an ordinance violation. It says NOTHING about carrying I.D. with you (insert 4th amendment here)
So lets say I go armed in public without any form of ID. I tell the officer my name, address and d.o.b. and he can look up the rest. He asks me for my valid Indiana LTCH, and I don't have it on me. He CAN (but is not obligated to) arrest me and confiscate my firearm, but as soon as I produce a valid LTCH (or my wife comes to the station with it) he MUST release me and return to me my firearm.
inccwchris
Sharpshooter
Ok first of all, to immediatley go to the point of "oh he's new so he must be trying to boost his post count is kind of silly and I would expect more from an expirienced gun owner and enthusiast. I did not just post "what I think" I also used Indiana code to verify my statements, which makes what I said opinion verified with fact. I can guarantee that if you are caught without a license to carry in your possession you would be arrested. Your reference to IC 35-47-2-24 is all well and good, but the only way to verify your identity is with a license, state id, or other form of ID. I would definatley not reccomend you carry your firearm without identification or LTCH on your person. It will result in your arrest even if you win in court, your arrest still shows up on your record and will result in time off work and money spent on court costs. Its not that difficult to carry your ID and license to carry. If you are driving without a license on your person you will be arrested and charged. Its no different for your gun, regardless of conviction or no conviction in the courtroom. Also refusal to provide ID and LTCH when it is requested gives probable cause, at the very least it gives RAS for a search and arrest. For example, if while out on the road a leo sees a LTCH holder open carrying and he refuses to show his permit upon request, it then gives the officer probable cause to detain and arrest him for carrying a firearm without a license and failure to identify until such time when identity can be verified.
You sound pretty certain of this. May I ask on what you base your certainty? If I put my iPod and a $20 in my pocket and go for a run and decide to stop in to the store while I'm out, I will have committed no violation of any ordinance or law. Now, into that situation, insert a LEO who happens to see me, doesn't know me, and decides to inquire as to who I am and where I'm going, I can choose to answer (and probably would, in all honesty,) or I can choose to remain totally silent other than to ask "Am I suspected of some crime?" and, "Am I free to go, officer?" Unless he has some RAS or PC to believe that I've committed a crime or infraction, he may not answer other than, "No, you're not and yes, you are", in that order. He may not like it, and any future interactions with him will likely be colored by that first impression, but going on the very citation you gave, that is the law. There is no place in the law to "verify his identity" when a citizen has done nothing wrong.
As to the carry of a handgun, that is another issue. To do so without being issued a license is a violation of the criminal code of this state. (I don't agree that it should be, but that's how the law reads and is interpreted at this point in time.) At that point, you must provide that minimum information, and as written, the burden of proof of licensure is on the citizen, not the officer. He may, as said upthread, choose to do a little checking and verify it himself, maybe for as simple a reason as the fact that it's less paperwork for him if he does, or because he doesn't want to jack up someone who is doing nothing wrong, but he is not obligated to prove me innocent of that violation.
Further, the law is specific: Once the LTCH is presented to the prosecutor, ALL records of the arrest are to be destroyed. Believe you me, if I was ever arrested under this statute, I would be going back and checking my records after the proof was given. Were I to find that a record of that occurrence still existed, I would be contacting my attorney and would look upon it as a financial opportunity.
There has been a ruling, (IIRC, by SCOTUS, but I can't verify that at this point in time) that LEOs cannot pull over a driver just to check and see if he has a DL. No such ruling exists that they cannot do so for a person carrying a firearm, so while I think the one should be applicable to the other logically, the law does not have to be logical, and thus, yes, a LEO can stop a gun owner for the sole purpose of verifying that he is doing so with a lawful permission slip.
All of that said, though, I reiterate that without a suspicion of a crime being committed, an officer has no basis to arrest a citizen solely because the latter is not carrying a specific card on his person.
Lastly,
to 
! 
Blessings,
Bill
Hoosierdood
Grandmaster
The discussion in this thread is a matter of LEGALITY. Is it wise to have ID with you of some sort? Sure. But even if an officer approaches me for carrying in public, I am still not obligated to show ID. All I am obligated to do is show him my LTCH. That removes the burden of proof that I am in violation of the law. If I cannot produce my LTCH, I will be arrested and taken to jail. Once I produce that little pink piece of paper, I am released, my firearm is returned, and the record of my arrest is destroyed (per IC 35-47-2-24). If that is not the way the police department handles it, they are in violation of the law, and subject to a law suit.
Wow, you are very wrong, as others have informed you... you apparently failed to read the Indiana Code that you posted...
1) There is NO legal requirement to have ID on you.
2) You are only required to identify yourself to a LEO if you are suspected of committing some crime.
3) If you do not have your LTCH on you and you are carrying, you MAY be arrested, but based on the testimony of all here, it's unlikely if they can verify your identity in some way and look up your LTCH.
4) Your arrest does NOT stay on your record once you produce your LTCH, they must drop all charges and remove the arrest record.
inccwchris
Sharpshooter
How does one verify that they are who they say they are. I could give your name, address, and date of birth. If you fail to produce ID you will be detained and or arrested until your identity can be verified. Unfortunately failure to identify has to be backed up with proof. Your picture does not show up on the MDT, nor does your description. If you do not have the LTCH on you, you will be arrested and charged with carrying a handgun without a license and failure to identify. Lets run hoosierdood's scenario. I am carrying a handgun, I produce my LTCH. How does the officer know that is my LTCH? Does he have a way to see a picture of you on his computer? No. The burden of proof is then on you to prove that you are the rightful owner of that LTCH. Until it can be verified that you are who you say you are, that you rightfully own that LTCH and handgun, you will be detained and arrested. Even if the charges are dropped, they can not remove all record of the stop and arrest from your record. They can list that you were not charged but the record of the stop and detention can not be removed to my knowledge. It will still be in his report. They can seal the records, but there will still be a record to be found if someone digs enough, just like all juvenile records are sealed at 18 or upon the release at age 21. Bill of Rights, I agree that carrying a firearm should not be reason alone for a stop, but under current law anyone open carrying a firearm may be stopped to verify that they are licensed to do so. My statement in simple terms is that if you are stopped by police because they see you open carrying and you fail to produce a license to carry and an identification card, it will result in your arrest until such time as your identity can be verified through an ID or fingerprint check.
You seem to keep changing what you're saying. According to IN statutes, IF a person is suspected of a violation of a law or ordinance, (such as CWOL), yes, he can be expected to give his identifying information. According to the statute, however, a person may do so verbally. If the officer does not like it, he has the ability to effect an arrest, yes, but the law specifies "or". The person can provide the information on a card "or" verbally. None of this applies to the person not suspected of a violation, however, which speaks to what you initially said, that everyone is required to carry ID at all times.
It doesn't matter how you read it, the law does not provide for that statement to be true in this state.
Also, if the information is placed in a computer, it can be removed from a computer. I don't give a d**n how tough it is to do, that is the law: All record of the arrest is to be destroyed. I can guarantee that if the law required me to do something, no excuse for not doing so would be sufficient.
Blessings,
Bill
Armed Citizen
Sharpshooter
I got problems with reefer, alcohol, pills, horse, meth, coke, sid, inter alia.
Most of the problems are with cops and prosecutors.
What the heck is "horse" ?????
Being hung like one is that a crime?
I'm sorry, back to the regular scheduled thread, which IMO makes no sense.
Three things I never leave my house without:
My wallet (and it's contents which includes my DL and LTCH)
My weapon
My cell
I do this because (in the event) I have to shot a BG, I have my weapon to shot him, I have my cell to call the police, and I have my original documents to prove who I am when asked by the police why there is a wounded or deceased BG laying on the ground.
Kirk Freeman
Grandmaster
Where to start?
1. There is no statute requiring one to carry ID in Indiana.
2. If one is stopped for an infraction or ordinace violation (e.g. speeding, turn signal, spitting on sidewalk) one must give his name, address and date of birth.
3. Carrying a Handgun without a License to Carry a Handgun is not an infraction ior ordinance violation t is a misdemeanor. The police officer could arrest you if you do not have your LTCH and you don't want to say anything, but everything will fall into a memory hole the next week.`
4. The police cannot stop you and ask you for ID if no infraction or ordinance violation just as Adam Starr's attorney argued:
http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/06221001lmb.pdf
Because I showed it to him. Once I show my LCTH end of discussion about my pistols. Nothing more can be done by the cop about the handgun, he can still write you a ticket for speeding or whatever.
http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/03041001jsk.pdf
Who told you this? Again, read Washington. Once I show my pink card, full stop. Nothing else can be done by the police (about my pistols).
Is this something you heard at a gun shop, or the range, or where? I am just curious as chasing gun rumors is a hobby of mine. Where did you hear this?
Who is telling you this?
Once I get my order to expunge there better not be any record anywhere on the Chief of Police is being hauled in for contempt and the sky will turn legal pad yellow.
One does not need an identification card. Why would you think this? Is someone telling you, a gun shop? Who?
Once I show my pink card, it is end of the issue. That's why some INGOers wear it around their necks.
1. There is no statute requiring one to carry ID in Indiana.
2. If one is stopped for an infraction or ordinace violation (e.g. speeding, turn signal, spitting on sidewalk) one must give his name, address and date of birth.
3. Carrying a Handgun without a License to Carry a Handgun is not an infraction ior ordinance violation t is a misdemeanor. The police officer could arrest you if you do not have your LTCH and you don't want to say anything, but everything will fall into a memory hole the next week.`
4. The police cannot stop you and ask you for ID if no infraction or ordinance violation just as Adam Starr's attorney argued:
http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/06221001lmb.pdf
Because I showed it to him. Once I show my LCTH end of discussion about my pistols. Nothing more can be done by the cop about the handgun, he can still write you a ticket for speeding or whatever.
http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/03041001jsk.pdf
Who told you this? Again, read Washington. Once I show my pink card, full stop. Nothing else can be done by the police (about my pistols).
Is this something you heard at a gun shop, or the range, or where? I am just curious as chasing gun rumors is a hobby of mine. Where did you hear this?
Who is telling you this?
Once I get my order to expunge there better not be any record anywhere on the Chief of Police is being hauled in for contempt and the sky will turn legal pad yellow.
One does not need an identification card. Why would you think this? Is someone telling you, a gun shop? Who?
Once I show my pink card, it is end of the issue. That's why some INGOers wear it around their necks.
EvilBlackGun
Master
"Horse" in this case is not related to basket-ball games.
"Horse" -- also called "Aitch" & al, is street-code for HEROIN.
"Horse" -- also called "Aitch" & al, is street-code for HEROIN.
Where to start?
1. There is no statute requiring one to carry ID in Indiana.
2. If one is stopped for an infraction or ordinace violation (e.g. speeding, turn signal, spitting on sidewalk) one must give his name, address and date of birth.
3. Carrying a Handgun without a License to Carry a Handgun is not an infraction ior ordinance violation t is a misdemeanor. The police officer could arrest you if you do not have your LTCH and you don't want to say anything, but everything will fall into a memory hole the next week.`
4. The police cannot stop you and ask you for ID if no infraction or ordinance violation just as Adam Starr's attorney argued:
http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/06221001lmb.pdf
Because I showed it to him. Once I show my LCTH end of discussion about my pistols. Nothing more can be done by the cop about the handgun, he can still write you a ticket for speeding or whatever.
http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/03041001jsk.pdf
Who told you this? Again, read Washington. Once I show my pink card, full stop. Nothing else can be done by the police (about my pistols).
Is this something you heard at a gun shop, or the range, or where? I am just curious as chasing gun rumors is a hobby of mine. Where did you hear this?
Who is telling you this?
Once I get my order to expunge there better not be any record anywhere on the Chief of Police is being hauled in for contempt and the sky will turn legal pad yellow.
One does not need an identification card. Why would you think this? Is someone telling you, a gun shop? Who?
Once I show my pink card, it is end of the issue. That's why some INGOers wear it around their necks.
9-24-13-3 Have to have your driver's license on you if you are driving. The police can check your license status if you are stopped for a traffic offense. 9-24-13-3 is no license in possession.
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