Climate Change Update........

[DadSmith]

 

[indyblue]

Fire fears force recall of 2,000 British electric buses

Almost 2,000 electric buses build in the UK but powered by batteries made in China worth in the region of £800m have been recalled over fears their heating and air con units could catch fire.

www.dailymail.co.uk

And IPS just ordered a bunch of electric school buses? With all the problems from the other bus companies that have made the news recently and they're still doing this? When, not if they break down how will they source parts and how much more will servicing them cost?

Electric school buses making their way to IPS

A Cincinnati-based company will provide hundreds of students in Indianapolis Public Schools a cleaner and quieter ride to classes with electric school buses, the district announced.

www.wishtv.com

 

[wtburnette]

Hope he responds by closing the plant. Way to go climate terrorists.

 

[actaeon277]

Hope he responds by closing the plant. Way to go climate terrorists.

They don't care.

They don't know how to make stuff
Or how stuff is made or done.

They don't care.
They think it just magically appears when you want it.

 

[wtburnette]

They don't care.

They don't know how to make stuff
Or how stuff is made or done.

They don't care.
They think it just magically appears when you want it.

That's not what I meant. I want him to close it so that Germany feels the pain. Maybe then they'll crack down on these terrorists instead of giving them a slap on the wrist at worst.

 

[Ingomike]

Couple miles down the road from me, right near Griffith airport is a recycle place.
I can bring in my tv antenna, or other metal stuff, and they pay me for it.
I make a profit.
They make a profit.
They are still in business.

So, how is that consumer steel not making a profit?


I also remember recycling cambell's soup cans at work.
The kind you have in a cabinet at home.
So...

“NO post consumer recycling program was ever profitable and created more usable resources than it consumed”.

Are there things in your home that can be recycled? Maybe even profitablely? Yes. I could get a tidy sum for your condensing unit, but unless you and all your neighbors are going to throw hundreds of them in the recycling bins it will not work.

The percentages of items actually being recycled are shocking. About half the glass put in recycling gets recycled and that is one of the higher percentages. Paper/cardboard is pretty high but the truly shocking is the minuscule amount of plastics that actually get recycled after the consumer went to the trouble to recycle it.

I have never seen metals on the list because I presume that curbside recycling does not see a lot of metals because of their value elsewhere.

 

[actaeon277]

“NO post consumer recycling program was ever profitable and created more usable resources than it consumed”.

Are there things in your home that can be recycled? Maybe even profitablely? Yes. I could get a tidy sum for your condensing unit, but unless you and all your neighbors are going to throw hundreds of them in the recycling bins it will not work.

The percentages of items actually being recycled are shocking. About half the glass put in recycling gets recycled and that is one of the higher percentages. Paper/cardboard is pretty high but the truly shocking is the minuscule amount of plastics that actually get recycled after the consumer went to the trouble to recycle it.

I have never seen metals on the list because I presume that curbside recycling does not see a lot of metals because of their value elsewhere.

Right.
I mean, what would I know about steel and recycling it?

Steel Recycling: Processes, Benefits, and Business Solutions | Rubicon

Steel is one of the most utilized metals in the world, making up everything from the tallest skyscrapers to your everyday kitchen utensils. Steel has driven

www.rubicon.com

steel can be continuously recycled without any damage or degradation to its properties
...
steel tops the list of North America’s most recycled materials, with over 60 percent of steel being recycled annually since 1970
...
Obsolete Scrap: Obsolete scrap covers the rest of steel waste, stemming from areas such as individual household appliances, old cars that are sent to a junkyard, office, and household waste.


The bean counters keep track of how much it cost for each source.
And they vary the amount of recycle used, based on how much it costs.
The safety cage in a car, has less recycle in it, because a mill like mine made it. It's tough to make, especially in the quantities needed by the auto industry.

The steel in the rest of your car, is MOSTLY recycle.
Because the mini mills make that. They can do it cheaper. And it's not specialized enough to need our equipment.


After being collected by scrappers in person, at designated drop-offs, or at buy-back centers, steel scrap is then sorted and sent out to mills or foundries.

Well, that looks "post consumer" to me.

When using recycled materials for production, manufacturers drastically reduce the price of production costs. Steel allows for the use of completely reused materials instead of going through the costly procedure of extracting raw ore from the ground.

Digging the materials up, refining them, shipping them, processing them again... you may not believe the costs.
But they are IMMENSE

Recycled stuff though, is already hear and much of the refining is done.
Yes, it costs to collect and separate.
But not as much.


Recycle is so cost effective, that the big mills haven't built new blast furnaces.
Well, part of that is the EPA.
Also, costs.
They ARE investing in furnaces that take 100 percent recycle though.
And they love them. Not because 'in the future' they will make money.
But because they are making that money RIGHT NOW.

 

[Nazgul]

When in CA for 10 years, I worked for a company that installed recycling system. Think huge bulldozer fed units. They were impressive and fun to work on.
At that time all the cardboard was baled, sent to San Diego and shipped to China. Saw an article in an industry magazine about the richest women in China who reworked the cardboard and sold it back to the US.

For a long time we paid to ship plastics to them but it became unprofitable and they dumped them. Hence the plastic patch in the Pacific Ocean.

It has to be profitable or it will not work. I honestly believe we should recycle things just because like many I don't like to waste things. But it has to be done from an intelligent perspective......by private, profitable companies that sustain themselves.

At that time the state gov't paid $.05 each for recycle bottles/cans. I outfitted my entire wood working shop with a drill press, planer, table saw, band saw and sander from collecting aluminum cans everywhere I went. My daughters were little and we had a ball taking them to the recycling place and them getting an Icee on the way home.

Don

 

[Magyars]

 

[Bugzilla]

Fire fears force recall of 2,000 British electric buses

Almost 2,000 electric buses build in the UK but powered by batteries made in China worth in the region of £800m have been recalled over fears their heating and air con units could catch fire.

www.dailymail.co.uk

These will be recycled also!

 

[DadSmith]

UN Plans To Widen The Energy Gap, Keeping World's Poor In Squalor

Green energy policies hold back the developing world, creating a gulf in energy consumption between the West and nations such as Kenya.

thefederalist.com

This is the whole reason for going green.
So the rich, and politically correct have energy, and the poor/middle class do not.
Use it for control of the population.

 

[BugI02]

When in CA for 10 years, I worked for a company that installed recycling system. Think huge bulldozer fed units. They were impressive and fun to work on.
At that time all the cardboard was baled, sent to San Diego and shipped to China. Saw an article in an industry magazine about the richest women in China who reworked the cardboard and sold it back to the US.

For a long time we paid to ship plastics to them but it became unprofitable and they dumped them. Hence the plastic patch in the Pacific Ocean.

It has to be profitable or it will not work. I honestly believe we should recycle things just because like many I don't like to waste things. But it has to be done from an intelligent perspective......by private, profitable companies that sustain themselves.

At that time the state gov't paid $.05 each for recycle bottles/cans. I outfitted my entire wood working shop with a drill press, planer, table saw, band saw and sander from collecting aluminum cans everywhere I went. My daughters were little and we had a ball taking them to the recycling place and them getting an Icee on the way home.

Don

Another strategy to cut down on waste is to not generate it in the first place. Go back to building high quality appliances that last well over twenty years and/or are repairable with replaceable parts. Currently you're lucky to get 1/3 of that lifespan for majors and 1/6 of that for small appliances like coffee makers and toaster ovens etc. That should also mean using more metal and less plastic in major appliances so they can be mostly recycled when they can no longer be repaired

It wouldn't hurt to stop the stupid 'trends' in appliances that have people replacing them because they are not the latest fashionable color/finish, either

Any color you want as long as it's stainless steel

 

[BugI02]

These will be recycled also!

They already are, I think they're selling them to IPS, aren't they?

 

[Ingomike]

Right.
I mean, what would I know about steel and recycling it?

Steel Recycling: Processes, Benefits, and Business Solutions | Rubicon

Steel is one of the most utilized metals in the world, making up everything from the tallest skyscrapers to your everyday kitchen utensils. Steel has driven

www.rubicon.com

steel can be continuously recycled without any damage or degradation to its properties
...
steel tops the list of North America’s most recycled materials, with over 60 percent of steel being recycled annually since 1970
...
Obsolete Scrap: Obsolete scrap covers the rest of steel waste, stemming from areas such as individual household appliances, old cars that are sent to a junkyard, office, and household waste.


The bean counters keep track of how much it cost for each source.
And they vary the amount of recycle used, based on how much it costs.
The safety cage in a car, has less recycle in it, because a mill like mine made it. It's tough to make, especially in the quantities needed by the auto industry.

The steel in the rest of your car, is MOSTLY recycle.
Because the mini mills make that. They can do it cheaper. And it's not specialized enough to need our equipment.


After being collected by scrappers in person, at designated drop-offs, or at buy-back centers, steel scrap is then sorted and sent out to mills or foundries.

Well, that looks "post consumer" to me.

When using recycled materials for production, manufacturers drastically reduce the price of production costs. Steel allows for the use of completely reused materials instead of going through the costly procedure of extracting raw ore from the ground.

Digging the materials up, refining them, shipping them, processing them again... you may not believe the costs.
But they are IMMENSE

Recycled stuff though, is already hear and much of the refining is done.
Yes, it costs to collect and separate.
But not as much.


Recycle is so cost effective, that the big mills haven't built new blast furnaces.
Well, part of that is the EPA.
Also, costs.
They ARE investing in furnaces that take 100 percent recycle though.
And they love them. Not because 'in the future' they will make money.
But because they are making that money RIGHT NOW.

I am not in a discussion of metals recycling other than acknowledging they can be successfully recycled. I don’t think we are discussing the same thing. You responded to my post about post consumer recycling, that is the common term for the truck that does curbside recycling...

 

[indyblue]

Another strategy to cut down on waste is to not generate it in the first place. Go back to building high quality appliances that last well over twenty years and/or are repairable with replaceable parts. Currently you're lucky to get 1/3 of that lifespan for majors and 1/6 of that for small appliances like coffee makers and toaster ovens etc. That should also mean using more metal and less plastic in major appliances so they can be mostly recycled when they can no longer be repaired

It wouldn't hurt to stop the stupid 'trends' in appliances that have people replacing them because they are not the latest fashionable color/finish, either

Any color you want as long as it's stainless steel

This!

My first whirlpool appliances each ran flawlessly for 23 years until the parts to repair them were no longer available and then they broke down. They were all technically repairable provided I could get the parts necessary.

My parents had an old GE refrigerator from the 50's that ran well into the 80's.

It's all greed (profit) based now. They don't want to sell us stuff anymore, they want us to rent or subscribe to everything for continuous recurring revenue. So now they design/build for that limited lifespan.

 

[Ingomike]

It's all greed (profit) based now. They don't want to sell us stuff anymore, they want us to rent or subscribe to everything for continuous recurring revenue.

It takes two to tango. Even if there is the quality you describe, the public will barely support it out of their greed for cheap so manufacturers build what the public will buy.

For example one of the best vacuum cleaners is from Riccar, metal frame with replaceable parts available, the flagship model is now over $700. They apparently sell enough to survive but most of you have never heard of them, they are bulletproof and repairable.

But the public would rather buy cheap or cool, neither usually have any serviceable parts. Cheap vacuums have no bearings the shafts are set in the plastic housing. That is why they squeal after a year or two, a built in reminder to get another $150 cheapo.

The Riccar is so good ours of 30 years is still going strong and another of forty years is too after a $50 tune up. But of the dozens of friends I have told of these not one ever bought one I know of. They all bought cheap big box store or paid ridiculous prices for junk plastic Dyson”s…

 

[Leadeye]

This!

My first whirlpool appliances each ran flawlessly for 23 years until the parts to repair them were no longer available and then they broke down. They were all technically repairable provided I could get the parts necessary.

My parents had an old GE refrigerator from the 50's that ran well into the 80's.

It's all greed (profit) based now. They don't want to sell us stuff anymore, they want us to rent or subscribe to everything for continuous recurring revenue. So now they design/build for that limited lifespan.

This.

It's the easiest path to "sustainability" but the least taken.

I been asked quite often about how to make products more "sustainable" it's a buzz word in manufacturing these days. My first response is always make the product higher quality so it lasts longer, but this flies in the face of the two groups that really run companies, sales and finance.

 

[Ingomike]

This.

It's the easiest path to "sustainability" but the least taken.

I been asked quite often about how to make products more "sustainable" it's a buzz word in manufacturing these days. My first response is always make the product higher quality so it lasts longer, but this flies in the face of the two groups that really run companies, sales and finance.

We have lost our pride to stewardship. I still have that as do many here. I love it when a guy walks over to check out my truck at the gas station, a truck I bought new, have had 18 years, and 225,000 miles. I also pay that same compliment.

There is little respect in society for anything but new and shiny. Sadly I suspect that respect for stewardship will die with those of us that embody it…

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I am not in a discussion of metals recycling other than acknowledging they can be successfully recycled. I don’t think we are discussing the same thing. You responded to my post about post consumer recycling, that is the common term for the truck that does curbside recycling...

The truck that does curbside recycling is a type of post consumer recycling. But it isn't the only type. The scrapyard down the street is as well, the auto junkyard when they crush cars for scrap, yep that's post consumer recycling. Now the scrap that the Ball aluminum can plant produces is not. Heck returning a car battery for the core charge is PCR.

 

[Ingomike]

The truck that does curbside recycling is a type of post consumer recycling. But it isn't the only type. The scrapyard down the street is as well, the auto junkyard when they crush cars for scrap, yep that's post consumer recycling. Now the scrap that the Ball aluminum can plant produces is not. Heck returning a car battery for the core charge is PCR.

Post consumer recycling articles are usually about home recycling and its pick up, at least that is how most articles I have read over years are structured. Too bad you were not around to straighten them out…