Cops Vs. Census Taker

[mrjarrell]

And, as expected the guys with the guns win. Even tho they apparently broke the law. At least they supported the property owner over the feds.

Via West Hawaii Today

Police arrest Census taker

by John Burnett And Peter Sur
Stephens Media

Saturday, May 29, 2010 7:27 AM HST
A battle is brewing between the state and federal governments over a Census taker arrested in Puna for misdemeanor trespassing.

The U.S. Attorney's office filed papers Thursday in federal court in Honolulu to take the case of 57-year-old Russell Haas out of 3rd District Court. That will pit the feds against local prosecutors.

"I'm looking to have it kept in state court," county Deputy Prosecutor Christopher Bridges said Friday.

Haas pleaded not guilty on April 8 to second-degree trespassing. He was arrested March 10 at 12:30 p.m. in in Hawaiian Acres, after a resident Haas says was an off-duty police officer allegedly refused to cooperate with the Census and called Puna police.

Read the rest at the source.

 

[Denny347]

Not clear on the police breaking the law part. Are you talking about the retired officer who refused to take the census or the officers who locked up the worker? The retired officer refused the census which is against Federal law but I think that seems to be favored here since many people talk about NOT completing the form OR talking with the worker. The officers at the scene can't force the homeowner to take the census. If it was clear the homeowner was not going to take it, what else can be done? The census worker is no longer welcome on this property so time for them to go. The article was a bit vague (as always) about the specific facts surrounding the arrest. It is not the census workers job to enforce the law. Let the Feds impose the penalty for non-compliance since that is WAY outside the jurisdiction of the local LEO's.

 

[Prometheus]

Good on the local PD. Census taker was asked to leave several times and refused. He was told to leave again in the presence of LEO and refused. Strait forward trespassing.

Census takers have to abide by the law. Regardless of if the resident was breaking a federal law, the census taker has to follow state law.

Some slackjaw dolt holding a temp job still has to follow the law(s). Doesn't matter if s/he has a spiffy .gov issued messenger bag or not.

 

[INGunGuy]

I guess the thing that really is strange about all of this, is why the hell is everyone so afraid of the census? It is a Constitutionally required census, yes they ask some more questions than number in the household. Who the hell cares? Yea we all talk about "Ausweiss Bitte?" or papers please, or PC, or RAS stops, the 4th Amendment, etc, but this census mirrored the first census taken in 1790. I am all for being free from big government, but come on people its a few questions that take no more than a couple of minutes, and it is required.

INGunGuy

 

[ocsdor]

... Some slackjaw dolt holding a temp job still has to follow the law(s). Doesn't matter if s/he has a spiffy .gov issued messenger bag or not.

 

[ocsdor]

I guess the thing that really is strange about all of this, is why the hell is everyone so afraid of the census? ...INGunGuy

 

[thompal]

 

[Bill of Rights]

I guess the thing that really is strange about all of this, is why the hell is everyone so afraid of the census? It is a Constitutionally required census, yes they ask some more questions than number in the household. Who the hell cares? Yea we all talk about "Ausweiss Bitte?" or papers please, or PC, or RAS stops, the 4th Amendment, etc, but this census mirrored the first census taken in 1790. I am all for being free from big government, but come on people its a few questions that take no more than a couple of minutes, and it is required.

INGunGuy

Emphasis above is mine.

The underlined clause contradicts the boldfaced clause. That is the problem and a reason why so many of us have a problem with the current iteration of the census. Like so many other areas of Big Gov't, they have exceeded their mandate.

Ultimately, I think the problem is that unlike 1790, we have not just won a war for our independence, and the Revolutionary spirit is not present in most of our countrymen now. Instead, many have learned to wear wool and say "Baaaa", and just follow along, doing as they're told without thinking for themselves. At it's deepest level, I think many here are concerned less with what information is being demanded and more with how that information will be abused and used against us.... and by whom.

ETA: As for your last sentence: about it being a few questions, and required, I'm inclined to ask, "How much trouble can come from telling someone you said no to drugs? If you're asked, the answers are required, and it's only a few questions after all."
Sorry if that comes across as "dirty pool", but I ask the question to make the point. At some point, people have to draw that line in the sand and say "this far, but no farther shall I go". Those who are objecting have reached their line in the sand, is all.




Blessings,
Bill

 

[Indy317]

I guess the thing that really is strange about all of this, is why the hell is everyone so afraid of the census? It is a Constitutionally required census, yes they ask some more questions than number in the household. Who the hell cares?

The census is about a count for representation in Congress. I am not sure if ages are required or not. All the other stuff is non-needed data as it pertains to Congressional representation. It is data gathering for all the social programs this country is involved in. That isn't want the census is for.

I have no problem telling a person how many people live in my home, but that is all they are getting. They are not getting personal information. All one has to do is Google these key words: Census worker arrested and find out the kind of people getting arrested while they were legit workers, or fake workers. Some will say "just fill out the form." No. That form may not make it to the census office, and I don't want my personal information floating around the neighborhood where someone can open it up and say "Oh, those two are childless and make $90K+ per year."

If you really want to give data for the social program side, so you can get money for your aera, there are two things I have heard you have to do if you live in a white, middle to upper class area:
#1: Answer that you are African-American. This isn't a lie, as there is no definition of how back one is allowed to go to declare their ethnic/racial heritage. My college anthropology prof. told me that my ancestors came from Africa, so I am part African-American.
#2: Answer that you make the least amount of income you can. Since you can't predict the future, you likely won't be lying. If you say you will make $50K/year, but the next day you lose your job, then the census data is faulty. Only answer using the income you have made right at the time you received the census.

If enough people do this in what the old data shows is a white, middle to upper class income area, it will change the area to minority, lower class. All of a sudden, the area is now open to receive special funding that is set aside for low income minority areas.

 

[akaindy]

I had a census taker show up at my door yesturday. It kind of surprised me, I sent mine in a few days after I got it, she said that my address came up as one that the gov didn't recieve back. I only answered two questions on the one I sent in. Of course while she was standing there I would only answer the question about how many live in the household. I said there is only one other question I would answer and when I gave her my answer that I'm "American" she didn't want to accept that one. She did mention that shes has been sent to a bunch of address that the computer says didn't recieve a form back but the people said they sent them in. She was also trying to get me to answer other questions saying the goverment needed these answer to know where and how to give money out. I responded that I only have to answer the first question and its not the goverments job to give out all this money, the fed only has 17 jobs laid out for it in the constitution and its not been doing those instead is been wasting money on things its not even supposed to be doing. She was polite and eventually left with one one question answered though she said someone may be back with more questions.

 

[INGunGuy]

Doctors offices, your mortgage company, your bank, your local tax assessors office, etc have all the information and more than what is asked on the census form. So, since most people have a mortgage, they gave identifying information to the bank/mortgage company when you applied for your mortgage. So why is giving a little information about yourself so "damning"? I did put for race German-Irish-American as that is who I am. Anyway, I didnt think it was too personal as I have given that information and more to many other people...

INGunGuy

 

[XMil]

My mortgage company doesn't have the ability to suddenly decide, based on my income and assets that my money should be redistributed to the "less-fortunate" family across the street.

When was the last time a mortgage company used demographic data about citizens to commit a holocaust? How about a government?

One last question? If "everybody already knows", why are they asking?

 

[DodgebyDave]

Doctors offices, your mortgage company, your bank, your local tax assessors office, etc have all the information and more than what is asked on the census form. So, since most people have a mortgage, they gave identifying information to the bank/mortgage company when you applied for your mortgage. So why is giving a little information about yourself so "damning"? I did put for race German-Irish-American as that is who I am. Anyway, I didnt think it was too personal as I have given that information and more to many other people...

INGunGuy

I haven't been to a Doctor in years, house is paid for, no bank accounts and I treat the tax man like he is the official mushroom.

Spew your stats, fine with me. However, you will allow me my privacy.

One way or another.

 

[ocsdor]

The next census, they'll ask for DNA samples. I'm sure they'll be no ill-intent with that either.

 

[Hiram2005]

I sent mine in and marked myself as American. I think the whole thing of race has been twisted to fit an agenda. NO, I know it has been twisted.

I was taught early on in school, that there are three races in the entire world. Negroid, Caucusoid and Mongoloid or Black, White and Asian.
So to me Irish-German-Polish is NOT a race. Nor French-Polynesian-Cuban is NOT a race. Or whatever fill in the blank you want is not a race.

Your race is either black, white or asian.
My immediate ancesters came to America in 1676 from France. Two brothers came here as indentured servants.(slaves more or less)
I guess I need reparations too. But that's another subject. Anyway, what I'm getting at is that does not make my race French-American. I am cuacasion or white. That IS my race. I have also researched the family as far back as it can go and outside of France, I have found a couple Great plus Grandfathers , one from the Netherlands and one from Scotland. My race is not therefore Scott or Netherlandic(LOL) It is white.

End of story.

 

[88GT]

#1: Answer that you are African-American. This isn't a lie, as there is no definition of how back one is allowed to go to declare their ethnic/racial heritage. My college anthropology prof. told me that my ancestors came from Africa, so I am part African-American.

It's got to really **** off the Afrikaners that African American is equivalent to black.

Doctors offices, your mortgage company, your bank, your local tax assessors office, etc have all the information and more than what is asked on the census form. So, since most people have a mortgage, they gave identifying information to the bank/mortgage company when you applied for your mortgage. So why is giving a little information about yourself so "damning"? I did put for race German-Irish-American as that is who I am. Anyway, I didnt think it was too personal as I have given that information and more to many other people...

INGunGuy

Somehow I don't think my OBGYN is all fired up to use my information for gun confiscation, wealth redistribution, or re-education camp enrollment.

*snip*

Your race is either black, white or asian.

*snip*

End of story.

Yup. This one really bothers the libs too, particularly when framed within the context of AZ's immigration law.

 

[AFA1CY]

The census is about a count for representation in Congress. I am not sure if ages are required or not. All the other stuff is non-needed data as it pertains to Congressional representation. It is data gathering for all the social programs this country is involved in. That isn't want the census is for.

I have no problem telling a person how many people live in my home, but that is all they are getting. They are not getting personal information. All one has to do is Google these key words: Census worker arrested and find out the kind of people getting arrested while they were legit workers, or fake workers. Some will say "just fill out the form." No. That form may not make it to the census office, and I don't want my personal information floating around the neighborhood where someone can open it up and say "Oh, those two are childless and make $90K+ per year."

If you really want to give data for the social program side, so you can get money for your aera, there are two things I have heard you have to do if you live in a white, middle to upper class area:
#1: Answer that you are African-American. This isn't a lie, as there is no definition of how back one is allowed to go to declare their ethnic/racial heritage. My college anthropology prof. told me that my ancestors came from Africa, so I am part African-American.
#2: Answer that you make the least amount of income you can. Since you can't predict the future, you likely won't be lying. If you say you will make $50K/year, but the next day you lose your job, then the census data is faulty. Only answer using the income you have made right at the time you received the census.

If enough people do this in what the old data shows is a white, middle to upper class income area, it will change the area to minority, lower class. All of a sudden, the area is now open to receive special funding that is set aside for low income minority areas.

OK, I'm confused. The census form I filled did not have any of those questions.

 

[csaws]

I sent mine in and marked myself as American. I think the whole thing of race has been twisted to fit an agenda. NO, I know it has been twisted.

I was taught early on in school, that there are three races in the entire world. Negroid, Caucusoid and Mongoloid or Black, White and Asian.
So to me Irish-German-Polish is NOT a race. Nor French-Polynesian-Cuban is NOT a race. Or whatever fill in the blank you want is not a race.

Your race is either black, white or asian.
My immediate ancesters came to America in 1676 from France. Two brothers came here as indentured servants.(slaves more or less)
I guess I need reparations too. But that's another subject. Anyway, what I'm getting at is that does not make my race French-American. I am cuacasion or white. That IS my race. I have also researched the family as far back as it can go and outside of France, I have found a couple Great plus Grandfathers , one from the Netherlands and one from Scotland. My race is not therefore Scott or Netherlandic(LOL) It is white.

End of story.

Hiram, I agree with you most people don't have a clue what the difference between race and heritage is. +1 for you

 

[Joe Williams]

snip
Somehow I don't think my OBGYN is all fired up to use my information for gun confiscation, wealth redistribution, or re-education camp enrollment.
snip.

CDC and AMA have both been trying to get the government to treat gun violence and ownership as a public health crisis, and regulate it as such.

 

[thompal]

OK, I'm confused. The census form I filled did not have any of those questions.

The form we got in the mail had questions on income, race, ethnicity (which, until that point, I believed were the same thing), birthdays, other people who might stay here, etc. I threw it away.

Last week, we got a visit from a census worker. I only answered the number of people, and age. To the rest, I simply replied "I'm not answering that." When she asked me the race and ethnicity questions, I asked her what the difference was. From her answer, it was pretty obvious she didn't know either.