Cutting the zip tie when leaving

[Tamara]

Don't be a dumbass with a gun in your hand?

Try again.

(HINT: It involves backstops, which some guy using your screen name up-thread said aren't important. I know it was some other guy using your screen name, because you just acknowledged the importance of following the Four Rules.)

 

[kjf48197]

I carry a small pair of cutters with me, and wait until I've gotten away from the doors and the crowd to a safe backstop before coonfingering my heater. I figure I can wait until I'm ready to gas it up before I cut the zip tie.

Any guns other than my actual carry piece, I just wait until I get home.

I do the same thing.

 

[Dead Duck]

And what is Rule #4?

Shut the toilet lid.

All married guys know that one.
(and divorced - Hence the rule)

 

[68_F100]

Try again.

(HINT: It involves backstops, which some guy using your screen name up-thread said aren't important. I know it was some other guy using your screen name, because you just acknowledged the importance of following the Four Rules.)

Not sure what four rules you go buy but these are what I use.

1. All guns are always loaded.

2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not
willing to destroy.

3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your ready to fire.

4. Know your target and whats behind it.

If you need a backstop to safely load your weapon then git rid of it because you have no clue what you are doing. Understanding how your weapon works and following the proper procedure for loading it will not cause it to fire. Doing something stupid with it once it's loaded might cause you to come up a finger short. But nice try.

 

[CX1]

If the officer had quietly and politely said,
"Excuse me sir but you are either going to have a new zip tie attached to that firearm or you will need to leave the building."

Since Ted was leaving it would have been simple to comply with the request.

Have they changed the law in Indiana (or had a court ruling) recently that now hold that signs carry the weight of law? I ask because I don't not understand what threat the officer was trying to convey by initiating the altercation with a citizen so rudely. I would think it would/should have been obvious that Ted was leaving so why would the officer start an interaction with Ted where the result is basically going to end up being to ask Ted to leave?
Even if Ted had go so far as to actually load the firearm in the lobby after cutting the zip-tie the immediate legal responsibilities for Ted would have been either to unload the weapon and have a zip-tie reattached upon the lessees (or agents thereof) request or leave the building correct?

On a related topic to what has been brought up in this thread:
Since sand barrels are such a benefit to both gun owners and the general public from a safety standpoint then why is it that a group of responsible gun owners/advocates (for example INGO, the NRA or GOA) don't provide them for situations like the Indy 1500 where the event organizers refuse to do so?

 

[Tamara]

If you need a backstop to safely load your weapon then git rid of it because you have no clue what you are doing. Understanding how your weapon works and following the proper procedure for loading it will not cause it to fire. Doing something stupid with it once it's loaded might cause you to come up a finger short. But nice try.

All guns are always loaded. This includes the gun in your hand that you are loading.

Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy*. Be aware of your target and what's behind it, (ie where your bullet will hit, also known as a "backstop".)

Any time you load your weapon, it can discharge, whether or not your finger is on the trigger.

If you are pointing your gun at anything other than a safe backstop at any time, ESPECIALLY when you're loading it, you are un-frickin'-safe, no matter how much lipstick you want to put on that pig.


*This is the Golden Rule. Dick up on one of the other ones and as long as you obey this one, all you'll get is a loud noise and an acute sense of embarrassment. Hence, the importance of backstops. Whatever your bullet hits, you're going to buy; make sure it's something you can afford to pay for.

 

[Double T]

On a related topic to what has been brought up in this thread:
Since sand barrels are such a benefit to both gun owners and the general public from a safety standpoint then why is it that a group of responsible gun owners/advocates (for example INGO, the NRA or GOA) don't provide them for situations like the Indy 1500 where the event organizers refuse to do so?

Because the guns aren't supposed to be loaded when you enter the building. The risk of having a discharge in the sand, or someone doing an "office pop" just to see if the sand works would be a reason against it.

While most of us could be thought to be responsible, we ALL know there are idiots with firearms (just search gun fails on youtube)

 

[Dirtebiker]

If the officer had quietly and politely said,
"Excuse me sir but you are either going to have a new zip tie attached to that firearm or you will need to leave the building."

Since Ted was leaving it would have been simple to comply with the request.

Have they changed the law in Indiana (or had a court ruling) recently that now hold that signs carry the weight of law? I ask because I don't not understand what threat the officer was trying to convey by initiating the altercation with a citizen so rudely. I would think it would/should have been obvious that Ted was leaving so why would the officer start an interaction with Ted where the result is basically going to end up being to ask Ted to leave?
Even if Ted had go so far as to actually load the firearm in the lobby after cutting the zip-tie the immediate legal responsibilities for Ted would have been either to unload the weapon and have a zip-tie reattached upon the lessees (or agents thereof) request or leave the building correct?

On a related topic to what has been brought up in this thread:
Since sand barrels are such a benefit to both gun owners and the general public from a safety standpoint then why is it that a group of responsible gun owners/advocates (for example INGO, the NRA or GOA) don't provide them for situations like the Indy 1500 where the event organizers refuse to do so?

Best thought yet in this long thread!
INGO sponsored sand barrels! I'll pitch in. What do you say Fenway?

 

[Dirtebiker]

If you are pointing your gun at anything other than a safe backstop at any time, ESPECIALLY when you're loading it, you are un-frickin'-safe, no matter how much lipstick you want to put on that pig.


*This is the Golden Rule. Dick up on one of the other ones and as long as you obey this one, all you'll get is a loud noise and an acute sense of embarrassment. Hence, the importance of backstops. Whatever your bullet hits, you're going to buy; make sure it's something you can afford to pay for.

So, if you carry a holstered gun, you are "unsafe"?

Also, I believe you said earlier that even if sand barrels were available, you would choose to go point your gun at "a brick wall" and reload. Do you consider the possibility of a ricochet? Or damage to the building? Or anyone inside the building?

 

[JohnnyTre]

The guys watching the door on the way out gave me a hard time when a dealer removed my orange band and replaced it with a clear one after I was finished trying out a holster. They said there was no way to tell if it was a gun I had just taken off of a dealer table. At this show a dealer took off the orange band and when I requested a replacement he went and talked to the guys at the door and they said it was fine as long as I kept my original cut orange ziptie.

 

[donballz]

Yeah, I never thought of rule #4 as having anything to do with reloading either.

But I never heard of "slam fire" until this guy blew his hand off, apparently its a thing.

 

[rhino]

Yeah, I'm never going to a gun show again. Haven't been in years, but this is helping me remember one of the 32,714.7 reasons why I don't want to go.

 

[MikeDVB]

Yeah, I never thought of rule #4 as having anything to do with reloading either.

But I never heard of "slam fire" until this guy blew his hand off, apparently its a thing.

I haven't heard anything but it being his pinky, where did you see that it was a slamfire (so I can read it)?

 

[Tamara]

So, if you carry a holstered gun, you are "unsafe"?

No, "point" is an active verb; a gun that isn't in someone's hand isn't going to do anything

Also, I believe you said earlier that even if sand barrels were available, you would choose to go point your gun at "a brick wall" and reload. Do you consider the possibility of a ricochet? Or damage to the building? Or anyone inside the building?

Yes, I do. It's why I pick a brick wall with dirt or grass at the base rather than concrete or asphalt, so that the angle of incidence will send the bullet (or fragments) into a surface that will stop it, rather than send it caroming off elsewhere.

I'd prefer to use a sand barrel of course, but not if they put it in the middle of that scrum of shoving shoulders and waving muzzles up by the entrance. I don't need Cletus jostling my elbow with a "Hey! Whatchu got there? How much yoo want for it?" while I'm trying to milk a rattlesnake.

 

[JetGirl]

Yeah, I'm never going to a gun show again. Haven't been in years, but this is helping me remember one of the 32,714.7 reasons why I don't want to go.

With the heightened prices of reloading components at the 1500, it doesn't really pay off for me to make the trek anymore. Honestly, the only reason I've done so the last few times is to meet up with some of the Monkey Minions, hang out, and have lunch at G.T. South's. (OMG, they have THE best hot BBQ sauce there!)

 

[Dirtebiker]

With the heightened prices of reloading components at the 1500, it doesn't really pay off for me to make the trek anymore. Honestly, the only reason I've done so the last few times is to meet up with some of the Monkey Minions, hang out, and have lunch at G.T. South's. (OMG, they have THE best hot BBQ sauce there!)

Didn't G.T.'s close?

 

[Dirtebiker]

No, "point" is an active verb; a gun that isn't in someone's hand isn't going to do anything



Yes, I do. It's why I pick a brick wall with dirt or grass at the base rather than concrete or asphalt, so that the angle of incidence will send the bullet (or fragments) into a surface that will stop it, rather than send it caroming off elsewhere.

I'd prefer to use a sand barrel of course, but not if they put it in the middle of that scrum of shoving shoulders and waving muzzles up by the entrance. I don't need Cletus jostling my elbow with a "Hey! Whatchu got there? How much yoo want for it?" while I'm trying to milk a rattlesnake.

Fair enough!

 

[JetGirl]

Didn't G.T.'s close?

No clue. Haven't been there since last March (the last 1500 I could attend).
I hope not!

 

[Rhoadmar]

You have a complex whether you admit it or not my friend. Can you name one post where you haven't badmouthed an LEO or had something positive to say about them?

Regardless of whether or not you can be trusted to prevent a ND or to protect yourself on the way home, you did not have to undo the ziptie IN THE FACILITY. You broke their rules, and got a reprimand rather than them telling you to GTFO.

I don't care where you parked, or whether you would be armed on your long cold walk. You are missing the point.

I am telling you that in this instance, property rights are transfered to the leaseholder, and you were in violation of their wishes. Their rights trump your rights while in their establishment. You broke a rule, got a smack on the hand, and are now complaining and trashing that person.

You could have walked outside, and cut it off with no repercussions and no talking to. There are plenty of flat surfaces outside, and it's an EDC-you really shouldn't be worried about scratching it a little. A scratch on the slide isn't going to matter one damned bit if you do have to use it on your long walk home.

Ok, how is cutting a zip tie loading a weapon?

 

[Dirtebiker]

No clue. Haven't been there since last March (the last 1500 I could attend).
I hope not!

The one in Beech Grove is closed and I thought the one on 71st (I think that's where it was) closed also.
Are there any other locations?