Deer hunter numbers down

[phylodog]

I see you’ve been hunting with my uncle. As a kid he told us the deer are curious and will come to see what the smell is

We don’t tell him when we’re hunting anymore.

The funny thing is that I honestly don't care how anyone else hunts. My hunting partner and I lease ground to hunt, yes it is expensive but what is our alternative? We hunt mature bucks, film for a television show and use sponsor's gear and products. I can't for the life of me figure out how that has a negative impact on how other people choose to deer hunt. Follow the law is all I ask, beyond that it's really none of my business and I have far better things to do than worry about what other people do in the woods.

 

[bwframe]

 

[Mattroth54]

If you don’t hunt exactly like I hunt you’re probably why deer numbers are down.

 

[turnandshoot4]

I have a ton of people that train with me that want to learn how to hunt.

The barriers are:
1. No one is willing to take anyone out to teach anything
2. No one is willing to share any land.

There is also a bit of a culture clash as well. The up and coming generations don't like the heavy smoking, miller high life swilling, tree stand sleeping, poor muzzle discipline, "I don't ever need to take a class" types of guys that are currently *some* hunters.

 

[bwframe]

It's always someone else's fault isn't it?

As a casual fair weather "call myself a hunter" observer, I'll toss in my ;

The IDNR quit being a promoter of hunting when they stopped selling lifetime licenses. Their concentration on the taxing of hunters has gradually come to bite them back. We can tell from their wavering silliness on deer firearm regulations that the shot callers aren't really informed on hunting anymore.

All of the negatives surrounding hunting private land have grown over the years. Leases, liability, a generation or two of less and less respectful humans, etc. Hunting public ground can at times be the wild wild west. If one is to base their public ground hunting opinion on deer gun season opening day, well ehhh...

The other end of things are political. 20-30 years ago, how many early/middle teens in their formative years were taught in school that firearms are bad? How many now?

 

[phatgemi]

I think there is a flaw in your proposal. I suspect the Michigan landowners you describe don’t receive much, if any, compensation for their generosity. Unimproved farm ground is usually given the lowest assessed value of all real estate. However, more and more land owners in Indiana are recognizing that what has been heretofore non cash producing ground can now be leased to hunters or leasing agents who charge hunters for the privilege. Thus, good deer habitat such as timber/swamp/creek bottom has been commercialized and the chase for horns rather than meat compels the trophy hunters to pay the fees being demanded. Several hundred of dollars or more can be obtained from individuals or multiple individuals grouping together to acquaint good ground that harbors good numbers and quality of deer. Plus, the lessee can implement good deer management and not shoot immature bucks. Herd management is something few farmers care about and, in fact, most farmers view whitetail as vermin that are to be removed due to crop loss.

If you don’t own huntable ground you’re ability to hunt is tenuous at best and can disappear in a heartbeat even tho you’ve hunted for decades based on your association with friends or family relationships.

Happening in Franklin County. At least one individual has leased over 2000 acres and charges mostly out of staters approx 1400 dollars for a hunt. He also was charging for lodging and food but has ran afoul of county ordinances regarding lodging permit, sanitary conditions and food handling. Business must be good.

 

[midget]

Alright, I'm going to do it. No one here is actually using real numbers and is using anecdotal evidence rather than actually posting the real numbers....

Licenses sold by year as provided directly by the DNR:
2006: 790564
2007: 813056
2008: 820216
2009: 806482
2010: 802192
2011: 815126
2012: 750108
2013: 782179
2014: 774244
2015: 744839
2016: 730751
2017: 726667

Now for deer harvest numbers. There is also a graph of past deer harvest in the 2017 Summary: https://www.in.gov/dnr/fishwild/9812.htm

2013: 125635
2014: 120073
2015: 123664
2016: 119477
2017: 113595


The fact of the matter is that the numbers are down, but not significantly. The numbers are where they were in the mid to early 2000's. You can toss around all the wild theories you want, but the fact remains that the sky isn't falling.
Also, worth noting that license sales do not directly equate to deer harvested.

Also, an edit as a personal comment to the OP. I'm not sure what your comment in the first post is about, but women are getting involved in hunting in a big way. This is a GOOD thing. Especially for those of us who like to hunt with their significant other. Getting people interested in hunting, regardless of their gender is a GOOD thing. Hunting isn't just a man's sport, and if you perpetuate that idea, you are essentially causing the "problem" you are complaining about.

 

[Bradsknives]

The funny thing is that I honestly don't care how anyone else hunts. My hunting partner and I lease ground to hunt, yes it is expensive but what is our alternative? We hunt mature bucks, film for a television show and use sponsor's gear and products. I can't for the life of me figure out how that has a negative impact on how other people choose to deer hunt. Follow the law is all I ask, beyond that it's really none of my business and I have far better things to do than worry about what other people do in the woods.

While leasing ground doesn't have an impact on how people choose to hunt, it does have an impact on whether they can hunt. There are a lot of people that enjoy hunting, but can't afford or justify the cost of leasing ground to hunt. In order to hunt nowadays, you either have to pony up the money to lease or buy, or have family or a very close friend that has ground, or hunt public land. The days of just knocking on doors to secure hunting property is just about gone.

 

[Hookeye]

Hunting area has declined in the last couple of years.
Yet some around still think if they buy the bundle they gotta pop three.

My old spot was super good and started to decline around '95.

Totals cited don't show regional shifts.
The sky may damn well be falling, just not where you are.

 

[Hookeye]

Leasing isn't bad.
Just is what it is.

There's always somebody with way more money to bump you out.

They might be after your chunk, or yours and those all around you.
I find no fault with a farmer cashing in on such.

Don't like it.

But if they want or need that $, so be it.

What gets me is how much crappy ground is going for.

 

[phylodog]

While leasing ground doesn't have an impact on how people choose to hunt, it does have an impact on whether they can hunt. There are a lot of people that enjoy hunting, but can't afford or justify the cost of leasing ground to hunt. In order to hunt nowadays, you either have to pony up the money to lease or buy, or have family or a very close friend that has ground, or hunt public land. The days of just knocking on doors to secure hunting property is just about gone.

There are a lot of people who enjoy a lot of things that they can’t afford. I thoroughly enjoy driving my friend’s 500hp turbo Porsche 911 but I can’t afford one of my own. I don’t blame him or anyone else for the fact that I can’t afford it.

I gave up hunting for 17 years due to a lack of land to hunt and not being willing to put up with the nonsense that comes with hunting public ground. Didn’t blame anyone for that either.

 

[Hookeye]

I never got a deer spot by just knocking on a door.
Did shoot groundhogs for farmers back in the day and that morphed into deer hunting permission on some spots.
Got two places when farmers had poacher problems (did not live there) and needed somebody they could trust, keep an eye on things.
Met the farmers through my place of employment (farming their side job).
And farmers know each other, so that got me a couple of non deer hunting spots.

But the old ways, and folks, are going away.
Some of my landowners are dead. Some retired (sold farms).
Some left the ground in charge of rather strange family members. That putting it lightly.

 

[jagee]

I took my brother in law on his first hunt ever this past gun season. He didn't harvest anything, I only got a button buck. Private land. I guess I did my part in keeping/bringing numbers up.

 

[Bradsknives]

There are a lot of people who enjoy a lot of things that they can’t afford. I thoroughly enjoy driving my friend’s 500hp turbo Porsche 911 but I can’t afford one of my own. I don’t blame him or anyone else for the fact that I can’t afford it.

I gave up hunting for 17 years due to a lack of land to hunt and not being willing to put up with the nonsense that comes with hunting public ground. Didn’t blame anyone for that either.

I'm not disagreeing with you at all. My point is, hunting has become more expensive over the years with more and more land owners leasing their land for hunting, and I would guess is probably main reason people have given up on hunting due to losing ground to leasing, thus the main topic of this thread....."Deer Hunter Numbers Down".

 

[phylodog]

Gotcha

 

[Leadeye]

I'm curious how far back folks go into public ground, most I've seen around here only travel about 100 yards from the entrance which explains some of the density problems. Before buying my own ground I looked into one of those wheeled contraptions that you take deer out on as a way to take a one man camp deeper into the woods.

 

[Hoosier Carry]

Alright, I'm going to do it. No one here is actually using real numbers and is using anecdotal evidence rather than actually posting the real numbers....

Licenses sold by year as provided directly by the DNR:
2006: 790564
2007: 813056
2008: 820216
2009: 806482
2010: 802192
2011: 815126
2012: 750108
2013: 782179
2014: 774244
2015: 744839
2016: 730751
2017: 726667

Now for deer harvest numbers. There is also a graph of past deer harvest in the 2017 Summary: https://www.in.gov/dnr/fishwild/9812.htm

2013: 125635
2014: 120073
2015: 123664
2016: 119477
2017: 113595


The fact of the matter is that the numbers are down, but not significantly. The numbers are where they were in the mid to early 2000's. You can toss around all the wild theories you want, but the fact remains that the sky isn't falling.
Also, worth noting that license sales do not directly equate to deer harvested.

Also, an edit as a personal comment to the OP. I'm not sure what your comment in the first post is about, but women are getting involved in hunting in a big way. This is a GOOD thing. Especially for those of us who like to hunt with their significant other. Getting people interested in hunting, regardless of their gender is a GOOD thing. Hunting isn't just a man's sport, and if you perpetuate that idea, you are essentially causing the "problem" you are complaining about.

I believe the bundle started about 2012. If 1 bundle license = 3 licenses sold prior to 2012, the numbers are not quite comparable.

I use to have to buy multiple license to hunt early archery, late archery, firearms, muzzleloader, antlerless, and bonus antlerless. Now I can buy 1 license and hunt all seasons from start to finish. How does this not change the statistic of license sold and why wouldnÂ’t it show a decline in numbers?

 

[Willie]

Alright, I'm going to do it. No one here is actually using real numbers and is using anecdotal evidence rather than actually posting the real numbers....

Licenses sold by year as provided directly by the DNR:
2006: 790564
2007: 813056
2008: 820216
2009: 806482
2010: 802192
2011: 815126
2012: 750108
2013: 782179
2014: 774244
2015: 744839
2016: 730751
2017: 726667

Now for deer harvest numbers. There is also a graph of past deer harvest in the 2017 Summary: https://www.in.gov/dnr/fishwild/9812.htm

2013: 125635
2014: 120073
2015: 123664
2016: 119477
2017: 113595


The fact of the matter is that the numbers are down, but not significantly. The numbers are where they were in the mid to early 2000's. You can toss around all the wild theories you want, but the fact remains that the sky isn't falling.
Also, worth noting that license sales do not directly equate to deer harvested.

Also, an edit as a personal comment to the OP. I'm not sure what your comment in the first post is about, but women are getting involved in hunting in a big way. This is a GOOD thing. Especially for those of us who like to hunt with their significant other. Getting people interested in hunting, regardless of their gender is a GOOD thing. Hunting isn't just a man's sport, and if you perpetuate that idea, you are essentially causing the "problem" you are complaining about.

I'm curious as to where you got those license sales numbers. You said DNR but can you give us a site? There is no way there are 800,000 deer hunters in Indiana.

Page 28 gives us the true numbers of deer licenses sold

https://www.in.gov/dnr/fishwild/files/fw-DeerSummaryReport_2017.pdf

 

[Hookeye]

I used to buy several tags, remember when firearms used to be weapon specific?

 

[Hoosier Carry]