Difference between 223 and 22-250

[lazarus0213]

YOU DO REALIZE THAT THE .458 SOCOM IS A NECKED DOWN CASE!

Lol, nope. I was looking at my friend's 22-250 and realized the bullet was the same. I don't reload, and I don't care to start, but I was curious what made the 22-250 so much faster. I assumed powder charge was a reason, but I wasn't sure since a straight wall case (like a 458 socom) doesn't push a bullet as fast. Of course, some of it has to do with the size of the bullet too...

 

[RMC]

Hey, why is Usain Bolt so quick on the track, while an arthritic grandma isn't?

Because when Grandma was fast she got pumped up.

 

[RMC]

We haven't touched on the barrel twist yet. Push a 50 gr V-Max 22-250 through a 1:7-inch twist barrel and your fps will drop substantially from 3800 down to maybe 3400 fps and that is only if the jacket stays intact. The standard 22-250 barrel is 1:14-inch twist which lets you get a lot more velocity but the twist isn't fast enough to stabilize most bullets over 55 grs. The 1:7-inch twist in a 223 does great with the heavier bullets 60 grs and up. There probably isn't much sense in putting a high twist barrel on a 22-250 when a 223 can give comparable performance with less powder. However, for prairie dogs the 223 can't compete with a 22-250 for explosive dismembering and visual aesthetics.

 

[superluckycat]

I wonder how fast a 22-250 would go if you did a compressed load with AA#2?














Disclaimer: I do not recommend trying this.

 

[billybob44]

I wonder how fast a 22-250 would go if you did a compressed load with AA#2?














Disclaimer: I do not recommend trying this.

I see NO point of this post--Disclaimer or NOT..If it is UNSAFE--DO NOT Post...Bill.

 

[sloughfoot]

I see NO point of this post--Disclaimer or NOT..If it is UNSAFE--DO NOT Post...Bill.

I agree, it has turned toward the silly.

 

[whiteoak]

The 22-250 is the 250savage or 300savage necked down to .22 cal. The parent case is a lot like the 308win, in fact most agree that the 300savage was the inspiration for the 308, as the military wanted close to 30-06 performance in a shorter overall case length. So that's why the 223, cant be made into a 22-250 its a whole other class of cartridge case that the round is based on. It's like asking why my 5gal bucket will carry more than my 3 gal bucket.
Many High Power rifle rounds can be grouped into case family groups, that will give an approximate idea of there potential power.
The small case family .17rem, 204ruger, 222, .223, 6x47 300Blackout ect.
Then the 308/7x57 family 22-250savage,.243win, 260rem, 250savage 257roberts, 7mm-08, 7x57, 6.5credmore, 300 savage 308win, 338federal, 358win. ect.
Then the 30-06 family 25-06, 270, 280, 30-06, 338-06, 35whelen.
After that the belted mags formed from the 300 and 375 H&H case, like the 264win mag, 7mm rem mag, 300win mag, 338win mag, 8mm rem mag, 458win mag ect.
That's a real quick over simplified grouping but it gives you an idea . Most new rounds are not completely new cases, just cases with the neck changed by wildcatters that get adopted by a rifle maker, Hope that helps...

 

[Broom_jm]

Best post in this thread for quite some time, Whiteoak.

 

[Woobie]

We haven't touched on the barrel twist yet. Push a 50 gr V-Max 22-250 through a 1:7-inch twist barrel and your fps will drop substantially from 3800 down to maybe 3400 fps and that is only if the jacket stays intact. The standard 22-250 barrel is 1:14-inch twist which lets you get a lot more velocity but the twist isn't fast enough to stabilize most bullets over 55 grs. The 1:7-inch twist in a 223 does great with the heavier bullets 60 grs and up. There probably isn't much sense in putting a high twist barrel on a 22-250 when a 223 can give comparable performance with less powder. However, for prairie dogs the 223 can't compete with a 22-250 for explosive dismembering and visual aesthetics.

I get what you're saying, but if you were to cut a 22-250 chamber in a 1:8 twist barrel, you could still get 200-300fps more from the 22-250, which is not insignificant if you're playing the long range game. Personally, if you're doing that, you should probably just get a .243, but in concept there is still a decent difference in velocity.

Edit: but this should be done with careful research and competent advice, if done at all. Most manuals are written with 1:12 or 1:14 twist rates. There WILL be pressure differences going to that tighter twist.

 

[Woobie]

More powder is not the only answer. Powder burn rates go into that equation. If the powder is too fast, the pressure will go sky high instantly and blow the rifle to bits. Folks in Fort Wayne saw an AR-15 turn into multiple pieces of shredded metal when using too fast of powder. Luckily, none of the injuries were fatal, but the potential was there.

The higher powder charges are usually slower burning powder to even out this pressure curve.

The slower powders take better advantage of longer barrels, as well. A lot of the powders used in .223 see only marginal gains from longer barrels, as they burn a bit more quickly. But you can load nice slow powders in that 22-250 and shoot it out of a 26" barrel.

 

[ryknoll3]

Max charge for .223 is usually somewhere around 26-27 grains of powder depending on what you're using. 22-250 has a max charge with the same bullet of 35-40 grains of powder depending on what you're using. Lot's more powder generally = lot's more speed.

 

[Broom_jm]

@ Ryknoll3 - Do you own rifles in all of those cartridges?

Notice the 225 Winchester is taller than the 22-250, but has a skinnier case body, resulting in slightly less case capacity and slower MV. Both have the exact same base diameter, with the 225 being semi-rimmed while the 22-250 is rimless. The Hornet and Bee are both rimmed cases. Also, notice how the 222 and 223 are pretty similar in height, but the shoulder is much farther up on the 223. This is why it has more capacity and is faster than the Triple Deuce, but also why it's often not quite as accurate or suitable for case bullets.