Do the military actually use the select fire setting on their rifles?

[Woobie]

Just curious why you have That opinion? (honest question) To me that sounds like a device much like a reverse lockout on a transmission or a lockout/tagout bar. It seems pretty straightforward.

Well, if made correctly, it's possible. But since it isn't a standard piece of equipment, it almost sounds like something a good idea fairy came up with. If it's some kind of sheet metal tab to prevent the selector lever from rolling past semi, I could see that interfering with going on safe. If it's made to interfere with the trigger itself, then you've got crap in there it was never designed to have.

 

[freekforge]

You can't set headspace and timing on the new M2's.

Havent got my mits on one yet, and probably won't now that I've transitioned to #poguelife. I'm guessing it's a ratchet system like a 240, but that's just conjecture on my part.

Not to thread jack but i have a question regarding this. Im not too familiar with the m2 so it may sound stupid but by ratchet do you mean turn it until it stops clicking and back off two, back off bolt 1/16" and insert go gage. or is there absolutely no go/no go gage? is the way i described the old way or new way. I know when i was taught how to run the 240 it was 2-7 clicks and it was gtg is this what you are saying in the second quote?

 

[actaeon277]

My brother in Law & Sister came out to shoot guns recently. My sister had been out once before, as part of her initial 'Want to try shooting once in my life' requests.
On this second trip, she was much more comfortable to my surprise. Equally surprising was my Brother in Law, who is a Navy vet, and was quite stand offish to the whole concept. And that's fine with me, I'm not going to force anyone to be 'macho' or do anything they aren't comfortable with... Eventually he came around, and he was quite honest and open...

He stated that he hadn't shot a gun since in the Navy, and wanted me to go over everything in detail so that he'd be safe and all...

I was shocked to discover his training consisted of 'Shooting a 1911 in .45 and it just kept going BOOM and rocking his hands back'.
The only rifle he ever shot was (maybe an m-14? he couldn't remember) BUT it was with Blanks only....

I was like, WTH?

He's about 60... so served maybe 40 years ago? I should have asked. I've honestly met noobs that were more confident in their abilities. Not that it's a bad thing... He made some pretty great strides that day. Compared to my younger sister? This 6'5" burly vet surprised the hell out of me, first with how timid he was, and later with how much more confident he became throughout the day, and not because 'It all came back to him', but because it was all totally new to him. The world of firearms, and facets of learning never ceases to amaze me.

It doesn't surprise me.
Small arms fire training is mostly nonexistent in the Navy.

 

[BigMoose]

I am an Officer in the Guard, I have never seen this. What state/unit/time was this?

It was a part made for the old M16A1.

NSN is 1005-00-233-9031

They show on eBay all the time. It's no longer a current item.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/330726955904

 

[Toole]

Not to thread jack but i have a question regarding this. Im not too familiar with the m2 so it may sound stupid but by ratchet do you mean turn it until it stops clicking and back off two, back off bolt 1/16" and insert go gage. or is there absolutely no go/no go gage? is the way i described the old way or new way. I know when i was taught how to run the 240 it was 2-7 clicks and it was gtg is this what you are saying in the second quote?

You can still adjust timing on the new M2's, you're just not supposed to. We got the new ones when I was the armorer for my unit in Hawaii, naturally we took them to the range, one was firing slow, cut the wire, adjust, rewire... good to go. However, I did get *****ed at for it. The mechanism (little nut to turn for timing) is still there but it has lacing wire ran through it. However, you can not do anything about the head spacing which I don't agree with, because 10's of 100's of thousands of rounds later when that barrel is hammered and you'd need to adjust the head space (spin the barrel in more) you can't

Freekforge, the timing isn't a run it all the way in/out then go the other way two clicks necessarily. With the headspace/timing gauge you insert it in and bring the barrel in until it's good to go with the gauge, then you use the go/nogo gauge and spin a nut, that's behind the trigger/buffer plate. charge, try to fire, if it fires, spin the gauge to the nogo side, it shouldn't fire. the timing nut is a +2/-2 (towards the bottom it'll shoot faster, towards the top it shoots slower, but outside of that total 5 click range it won't fire). So once you have it so it fires in the go and doesn't fire with the no go gauge, if you were spinning it down from the top, you spin two more clicks down, and vise versa if you started the nut from the bottom, once it fires correctly spin the nut 2 clicks up.

 

[freekforge]

Wow! thanks toole. You seem way more knowledgeable than the guy that showed me. I didnt realize that much went in to it. but of course i only had a crash course from a really hyper cpl. So once the barrel has some wear and the headspace is out of spec its done and needs a new one? That sucks.

 

[oldpink]

You can still adjust timing on the new M2's, you're just not supposed to. We got the new ones when I was the armorer for my unit in Hawaii, naturally we took them to the range, one was firing slow, cut the wire, adjust, rewire... good to go. However, I did get *****ed at for it. The mechanism (little nut to turn for timing) is still there but it has lacing wire ran through it. However, you can not do anything about the head spacing which I don't agree with, because 10's of 100's of thousands of rounds later when that barrel is hammered and you'd need to adjust the head space (spin the barrel in more) you can't

Freekforge, the timing isn't a run it all the way in/out then go the other way two clicks necessarily. With the headspace/timing gauge you insert it in and bring the barrel in until it's good to go with the gauge, then you use the go/nogo gauge and spin a nut, that's behind the trigger/buffer plate. charge, try to fire, if it fires, spin the gauge to the nogo side, it shouldn't fire. the timing nut is a +2/-2 (towards the bottom it'll shoot faster, towards the top it shoots slower, but outside of that total 5 click range it won't fire). So once you have it so it fires in the go and doesn't fire with the no go gauge, if you were spinning it down from the top, you spin two more clicks down, and vise versa if you started the nut from the bottom, once it fires correctly spin the nut 2 clicks up.

I had no idea that they had lockwired that out, and that they did away with adjusting headspace.
That was one of the two most important safety issues that our instructors in gun school at Great Lakes drilled into our heads, with the other being the issue with making sure that the recoil spring wasn't under tension and how to very carefully take it out.
That spring was reputed to have seriously injured some squids, and supposedly even killed more than one when they didn't heed the warnings about it.

 

[Toole]

Wow! thanks toole. You seem way more knowledgeable than the guy that showed me. I didnt realize that much went in to it. but of course i only had a crash course from a really hyper cpl. So once the barrel has some wear and the headspace is out of spec its done and needs a new one? That sucks.

Yes, the new ones will need a new barrel, unless they (-30 level armament guys) have a way of adjusting the stop pin to fix the headspace when the time comes, but short of cutting it off and rewelding, there didn't appear to be any way to adjust it.
As a scout, while I was never a PT stud, I made weapons, land nav, and tactics my bread and butter.... then got sent to the armorer school to become the unit armorer.

I had no idea that they had lockwired that out, and that they did away with adjusting headspace.
That was one of the two most important safety issues that our instructors in gun school at Great Lakes drilled into our heads, with the other being the issue with making sure that the recoil spring wasn't under tension and how to very carefully take it out.
That spring was reputed to have seriously injured some squids, and supposedly even killed more than one when they didn't heed the warnings about it.

The newer models of the M2 started coming out in 2011/2012 I believe. I never saw the newer ones until 2012, every unit I was in before hand still had the adjustable ones. And yea, if you have the bolt locked to the rear and knock the pin out holding in the trigger plate/buffer assembly, you're definitely going to feel it! The Navy may still very well be using the older ones as I know most of the Marines are as well.

 

[freekforge]

Thanks for the info toole. Im only IGR so the only thing we do weapons related is qualification at cajmtc and if im lucky i get to get a mini class like the one on the m2 from one of the army guys. The 240 i actually got to learn how to operate hands on which was cool and according to the oic of the range i scored expert unfortunately I cant wear the badge though (only pistol, carbine and rifle are allowed).

sorry for the thread jack op

 

[trapperDave]

Navy Airedale here from the first Iraq war.

We had zero play time with firearms after boot camp, and then it was only a 1911 in 22 rimfire for the most basis of basics. Hell, we didn't even carry rifles in bootcamp. They never left the rack