Driver shears off patrol car door.....

[Hatin Since 87]

Around here that usually means the door is about to open and the drivers is about to run from the vehicle.

So, serious question here (I’m not serious often so felt I needed to point that out).

What should somebody do in that situation? Instead of finding a safe place to pull into, should we just instantly pull over and if the officer wants us in a better location wait for him to say so? I always pull over as soon as I see lights, roll window down, shut the car off, and turn my interior lights on, for 2 reasons really. Helps the officer know I’m not trying to hide anything or planning anything, and if his nerves are calm I figure he will be less on edge with me during the stop. But I have wondered if they would rather me instantly pull over or think of their safety and find a safer area to do so?

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

I like the heavy sigh after a moment. It does appear that he just swung his door open without looking while hoping that everyone is doing the slowdown/move over thing, though.

So you can tell exactly what happened and who was at fault based on the footage?

And how many times have you made a traffic stop and had someone intentionally drive as close as they could to you and/or your patrol car?

 

[Trigger Time]

I've been pulled over at night many years ago. Light wasnt a problem they have spotlights they are happy to let you borrow light from
I'm not touching **** inside my car until he tells me to. My hands go on the wheel after I roll the window down

 

[Trigger Time]

So you can tell exactly what happened and who was at fault based on the footage?

And how many times have you made a traffic stop and had someone intentionally drive as close as they could to you and/or your patrol car?

Slow down and or move over it's the law. For a reason.
The number of stupid and intentionaly insane people on the roads now scares me driving in a car. I cant imagine being on foot

 

[DoggyDaddy]

As for signaling intentions to pull over, I think it'd be really cool to have cars equipped with a marquee on the rear bumper with some kind of talk-to-text technology. That way the driver could communicate to the officer that they have seen them, and are complying just as soon as it is safe to do so. It would also come in handy for tailgaters. "Get the **** off my ass you *******! What the **** is wrong with you?!"

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Dont take this the wrong way, I'm not trying to make it controversial, mostly gonna type this in an asking way not a pointing finger way and trying to tell cops how to do their job.
So why if you pull someone over for a traffic stop related to a basic infraction does it matter if they are stashing something? Let them stash away the drugs or whatever. The weapon or ambush thing sure I understand but I think most cops are trained nowadays (I gather this from talking to cops) that everyone is going to try to kill them and to always be ready. (Seems like it anymore).

I think I'm pretty established that I don't care about petty dope crimes. However what's being stashed isn't always dope. If you "get why" weapons, then you know why we don't want people reaching around in the car. Guns get stashed, too, sometimes to hide them and sometimes to put them out of view but easier to reach.

Yes, we're trained to be ready. Part of that is not letting you reach around a bunch. You're military, you know that you don't get into fights because you're trained for it. You try to cut off the fight before it starts. So think about that. If you're showing the exact same pre-attack indicators as someone ready to ambush, do you think that amps up the response a bit?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

What does the legislature say on this topic? I'll do some more digging on .... wait for it..... in.gov.

IMO, the more appropriate violation is the failure to yield to emergency equipment, which is a ticket and not an arrest. That assumes the scenario of not attempting to evade, so no speeding up, erratic movement, blowing through lights, etc. I don't think it should always be written, mind you, but there is nothing in IC code that says "if you're scared you can..." or "if you don't think it's safe you can..." I think most folks on the "inside" will tell you the law as written always has an unwritten "in the best interest of justice" exception.

 

[woowoo2]

The last time I was "Lit up" I went down the road a bit so that I could pull onto private property.
I did not want the LEO to tow my car in case the jack booted thug decided to take me in.
(Purple implied)

 

[eldirector]

IMO, the more appropriate violation is the failure to yield to emergency equipment, which is a ticket and not an arrest. That assumes the scenario of not attempting to evade, so no speeding up, erratic movement, blowing through lights, etc. I don't think it should always be written, mind you, but there is nothing in IC code that says "if you're scared you can..." or "if you don't think it's safe you can..." I think most folks on the "inside" will tell you the law as written always has an unwritten "in the best interest of justice" exception.

You are correct, of course.

[FONT=&amp]IC 9-21-8-35Vehicles displaying flashing lights; yield right-of-way; violation
[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp] Sec. 35. (a) Upon the immediate approach of an authorized emergency vehicle, when the person who drives the authorized emergency vehicle is giving audible signal by siren or displaying alternately flashing red, red and white, or red and blue lights, a person who drives another vehicle shall do the following unless otherwise directed by a law enforcement officer:[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp](1) Yield the right-of-way.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp](2) Immediately drive to a position parallel to and as close as possible to the right-hand edge or curb of the highway clear of any intersection.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp](3) Stop and remain in the position until the authorized emergency vehicle has passed.[/FONT]

The IC says pull over IMMEDIATELY. State-supplied lawyers and other "official" sources are encouraging folks to violate the IC as written.

Wish I could find the recordings of ISP telling folks to do the whole flashers/slow-down/well-lit area thing. Seems to pop up after someone gets attacked by a fake cop late at night. I thought the Internet was forever, but darned if I can find a clip.

I haven't been pulled over in decades, I don't think. Can't even really remember. So, this is all pretty moot for me, personally. Just happy to tease out the truth from all the noise.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Strangely absent was the sound of the trooper crapping himself

Perhaps that's why the sound cut out briefly right after his door was taken off?

...and this remains (largely) true. We have a PA, if you pull over somewhere that's sketchy we can ask you to creep up a bit or whatever.

You know you're looking for a "safe place", but our experience is when people are slow rolling they are either stashing things or preparing an ambush. That experience hypes up the response to a slow roller for many officers.

I generally pull over as quickly as possible. But I have drove a short distance to a safer IMO place. When I say short I'm talking a hundred feet or so if there is a parking lot or an intersecting road with less traffic. And the times I did that wasn't for my safety it was for the officers. Heck I did a preemptive stop before I was pretty sure I was going to get pulled over, so I stopped at a relatively well lit closed gas station rather than a unlit 55 mph road.

So you can tell exactly what happened and who was at fault based on the footage?

And how many times have you made a traffic stop and had someone intentionally drive as close as they could to you and/or your patrol car?

Nope can't tell exactly, and the person you are responding to did say appears not did. It is possible that it was clear and the guy swerved over when the door was opening. But which is the more likely? I'm not saying which did happen or bashing the officer. I don't know for sure, I may have a hunch but that's about it.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Wish I could find the recordings of ISP telling folks to do the whole flashers/slow-down/well-lit area thing. Seems to pop up after someone gets attacked by a fake cop late at night. I thought the Internet was forever, but darned if I can find a clip.

They exist, and it's fairly common advice. I suppose the thought process is you can argue out of a ticket, or just pay it. You can't argue out of a robbery/rape, or just pay it. This is where the "in the best interest of justice" comes into play. The law as written was violated. Was it for a sufficiently good reason?

I've had a lot (and seriously a lot) of civilian shootings that were either reaaaal borderline or bright line "nope", but due to the rather trying circumstances they found themselves in the prosecutor did not file on them. Better for them to be a witness against the "real bad guy", etc. Obviously a more serious situation than a traffic ticket, but same principal.

My thought process is something like:
1) Is it illegal?
2) Is it fair to enforce the law as written in this circumstance?
3) Would some method, other than arrest/citation, be equally or more effective at curbing the undesirable behavior?

I've found as a sergeant I write a lot more warnings then I did as a patrol officer. I've written exactly one ticket since going back to the street, and that's because he violated a central tenant of my code. (Make me dodge, you get a ticket). He was also suspended and playing on his phone...which is why I had to dodge to avoid a collision. The ticket was a warning, as he could have been arrested.

 

[IndyTom]

So you can tell exactly what happened and who was at fault based on the footage?

And how many times have you made a traffic stop and had someone intentionally drive as close as they could to you and/or your patrol car?

Who was at fault? The driver who took the door off by not slowing down (he did appear to be moving at speed) and/or moving over.

My statement? Did you not watch the whole video to where it went to on-body camera? Based on the movement of his hands and what people would normally do when collecting items and making sure they've got everything, it does look like he opened the door without taking a good look. I'm not saying the LEO was at fault, but it might have been avoidable. Then again, had the door not been open, maybe he would have been sideswiped, anyway.

How many times? Enough to make sure I don't take for granted that the lane is clear before opening my door on a street or highway.