Escorted Out

[rbane3]

Good evening, INGO.

I was in our neighboring state of Ohio and patronized an establishment that was not gun friendly. I was CCing, but my shirt rode up and outed me. I had been in the establishment for two and a half hours, by this point, and spent more money than I'd care to admit. During this time, I didn't once touch, draw, or fondle my handgun lovingly. No moms were a-gasping and no 8 year old girls a-grabbing. That didn't stop security from approaching me. The interaction was not great, but could have gone worse I suppose.

The large gentleman approached from my 4 o'clock. His body language was authoritative, and he had no regard for personal space. He plainly asked me if I had a firearm on me. I responded, with no hesitation and no menace, that I did. He, maintaining his centimeters away stance, said that I had to leave immediately. I said, "Okay, I wasn't aware of your policy. Would you like me to store my firearm in the car?" No backing down on this man's part. "No, you are not welcome back. Get in your car and go." I agreed to comply, but informed him that there are better ways to handle this situation. I told him that approaching people from that angle and leaving no personal space was a very aggressive stance to take with anyone, let alone someone you believe to be armed. I requested a refund for the time I had paid but hadn't used (given) and was escorted to the front.

No physical altercation. No touching of weapons. No threats, etc. Just an altogether unpleasant experience.

My question for you is this: I know about the "No guns, no money" cards one can print out and hand out in the event of an anti-2a encounter. Is there a form letter you like that I could edit and send to their corporate address? I've found a couple via google, just want the best.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Kutnupe14]

Wow, that guy was a ****. Kudos for taking the high road.

 

[Bigtanker]

Good evening, INGO.

I was in our neighboring state of Ohio and patronized an establishment that was not gun friendly. I was CCing, but my shirt rode up and outed me. I had been in the establishment for two and a half hours, by this point, and spent more money than I'd care to admit. During this time, I didn't once touch, draw, or fondle my handgun lovingly. No moms were a-gasping and no 8 year old girls a-grabbing. That didn't stop security from approaching me. The interaction was not great, but could have gone worse I suppose.

The large gentleman approached from my 4 o'clock. His body language was authoritative, and he had no regard for personal space. He plainly asked me if I had a firearm on me. I responded, with no hesitation and no menace, that I did. He, maintaining his centimeters away stance, said that I had to leave immediately. I said, "Okay, I wasn't aware of your policy. Would you like me to store my firearm in the car?" No backing down on this man's part. "No, you are not welcome back. Get in your car and go." I agreed to comply, but informed him that there are better ways to handle this situation. I told him that approaching people from that angle and leaving no personal space was a very aggressive stance to take with anyone, let alone someone you believe to be armed. I requested a refund for the time I had paid but hadn't used (given) and was escorted to the front.

No physical altercation. No touching of weapons. No threats, etc. Just an altogether unpleasant experience.

My question for you is this: I know about the "No guns, no money" cards one can print out and hand out in the event of an anti-2a encounter. Is there a form letter you like that I could edit and send to their corporate address? I've found a couple via google, just want the best.

Thanks in advance!

Just want to make sure you know that in Ohio, no gun signs carry the weight of the law and it is YOUR responsibility to look for them. The gentleman invading your space did you a favor by asking you to leave and not calling the cops. You could have easily been arrested for your actions.

As to your question, write a letter yourself and save it in a file. Fill in the details pertaining to the establishment you are contacting, then send it out. Good luck.

 

[Cygnus]

Which strip club was this ?

 

[rbane3]

Which strip club was this ?

Haha, it wasn't. My SO and I were actually out on a date. She doesn't tend to be that... understanding. :P

 

[voidsherpa]

...in Ohio, no gun signs carry the weight of the law

If properly posted.

...it is YOUR responsibility to look for them.

Within reason, otherwise they aren't properly posted.

The gentleman invading your space did you a favor by asking you to leave and not calling the cops. You could have easily been arrested for your actions.

He never said it was posted as a GFZ, just that it was not gun friendly; clearly it wasn't.


OP what was the name of the place?

 

[Cameramonkey]

Just want to make sure you know that in Ohio, no gun signs carry the weight of the law and it is YOUR responsibility to look for them. The gentleman invading your space did you a favor by asking you to leave and not calling the cops. You could have easily been arrested for your actions.

As to your question, write a letter yourself and save it in a file. Fill in the details pertaining to the establishment you are contacting, then send it out. Good luck.

THIS. Times eleventyseven. If posted per Ohio law (proper signage, proper location, etc) you got of easy.* In our neighbor to the east you cant ignore the fancy signs. I agree your personal space was violated. But given he probably wasnt armed, he had to rely on surprise and sheer macho intimidation to force your compliance for fear of getting ventilated. (you'd be surprised by how much compliance you can achieve by APPEARING bigger than your opponent regardless of reality. Lizard brain basics.)

Play by the rules... ALWAYS**.

*alternative is a trooper doing the same and arresting you. I was there this week on business and had to tread lightly at dinner... Boss and I went to dinner and I had to decline the offer to seat us in the bar of the restaurant we went to. (I was legal in the restaurant, but not the bar area as they didnt post the official sign, but did still post the warning about carrying in the bar area... and my boss isnt comfy w guns and isnt aware I carry when not on the clock)

**at least when the penalties are enforced by Johnny Law and not just a (not so) polite request to vacate the property.

 

[Bigtanker]

If properly posted.



Within reason, otherwise they aren't properly posted.



He never said it was posted as a GFZ, just that it was not gun friendly; clearly it wasn't.


OP what was the name of the place?

I never said it was a GFZ. I just wanted to make sure he knows about the law.

 

[AngryRooster]

I'm curious as to where this was. I want to make sure never to spend a single dime there.

 

[rbane3]

Dave and Busters. The MIL had the kids for the day and told us to take a date day. The weather wasn't great so we decided to check it out.

I didn't see any signs, and I didn't ask during my forced exodus. I was, however, aware that signs carry the weight of law in Ohio.

 

[LPMan59]

Did you blade at 45 degrees?

 

[femurphy77]

Your first sentence said you were in an establishment that was NOT gun friendly; if you knew this up front then you paid your money, you took your chances and you lost. The outcome couldn't have gone any other way. If you didn't know then you took the opportunity to try to educate a Neanderthal and I'm guessing the attempt was in vain. Any further attempt on your part to educate the establishment is pissing in the wind.

 

[Drail]

Maybe avoid the State of Ohio in the future........

 

[rbane3]

Your first sentence said you were in an establishment that was NOT gun friendly; if you knew this up front then you paid your money, you took your chances and you lost. The outcome couldn't have gone any other way. If you didn't know then you took the opportunity to try to educate a Neanderthal and I'm guessing the attempt was in vain. Any further attempt on your part to educate the establishment is pissing in the wind.

Fair point. I wasn't aware of their stance prior to going. Your advice would be to never again spend money at their establishment and attempt no further contact?

 

[Cameramonkey]

Fair point. I wasn't aware of their stance prior to going. Your advice would be to never again spend money at their establishment and attempt no further contact?

I agree. Or if you want D&B, drive to Indy.

In OH it is at the property owners discretion whether to post an official no guns sign. [STRIKE]However it is against state law to carry in an area that derives most of its income from alcohol. (Or whatever verbiage they use to describe a bar) So for example I know the outback chain does not post the sign, so I can enter armed but I am legally unable to enter the bar area of the restaurant[/STRIKE].

So depending on how they are classified, D&B may not have had to post the sign but you'd still be running afoul of the law. I'd count your blessings.

Edit: I missed a change in the law. You can enter bars legally now, you just cant be intoxicated or consume alcohol while armed.

 

[GNRPowdeR]

Fair point. I wasn't aware of their stance prior to going. Your advice would be to never again spend money at their establishment and attempt no further contact?

I agree. Or if you want D&B, drive to Indy.

In OH it is at the property owners discretion whether to post an official no guns sign. However it is against state law to carry in an area that derives most of its income from alcohol. (Or whatever verbiage they use to describe a bar) So for example I know the outback chain does not post the sign, so I can enter armed but I am legally unable to enter the bar area of the restaurant.

So depending on how they are classified, D&B may not have had to post the sign but you'd still be running afoul of the law. I'd count your blessings.

I'm agreeing with how Cameramonkey states things... Just don't let him know!

 

[The Spud]

I agree. Or if you want D&B, drive to Indy.

In OH it is at the property owners discretion whether to post an official no guns sign. However it is against state law to carry in an area that derives most of its income from alcohol. (Or whatever verbiage they use to describe a bar) So for example I know the outback chain does not post the sign, so I can enter armed but I am legally unable to enter the bar area of the restaurant.

So depending on how they are classified, D&B may not have had to post the sign but you'd still be running afoul of the law. I'd count your blessings.

This is from the pamphlet given to me when I took my Ohio CCW license course:

The ability to have a firearm carries with it certain restrictions and responsibilities, many of which are regulated by state and federal laws. The explanation in this publication of laws regulating carrying a handgun is not an exhaustive list. If you have questions, consult an attorney.

Identification Required
You must carry another piece of valid government identification in addition to the handgun license.

Forbidden Carry Zones
The law sets forth several places where your license does not allow you to carry a handgun. Under the law, you may not carry a concealed handgun into the following places:
• Police stations
• Sheriffs’ offices
• Highway Patrol posts
• Premises controlled by BCI
• Correctional institutions or other detention facilities
• Airport terminals or airplanes
• Facilities for the care of mentally ill persons
• Courthouses or buildings in which a courtroom is located
• Universities, unless locked in a motor vehicle or in the process of being locked in a motor vehicle
• Places of worship, unless the place of worship permits otherwise
• Child day-care centers
• Licensed Class D liquor permit premises, if you are consuming beer or intoxicating liquor or are under the influence. If you are not consuming, and not under the influence, you may carry unless there is a conspicuous sign prohibiting carry. Possession of a concealed firearm is allowed in a retail store with a D-6 or D-8 permit as long as the concealed carry license holder is not consuming liquor. Class D permits are generally issued to an establishment that sells alcohol for consumption on the premises. In any event, do not consume beer or intoxicating liquor before carrying a concealed handgun into a licensed premises or while on the premises.
• Government facilities that are not used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility and are not a courthouse or a building or structure in which a courtroom is located.
• School safety zones
A “school safety zone” includes a school, school building, school premises, school activity, and school bus. For purposes of this statute, a school includes everything up to the property boundary.
If you are licensed to carry a concealed handgun, you may carry a handgun into a school safety zone only if you do not enter a school building, school premises, or school activity. You also must not be in one of the places listed in ORC 2923.126(B). You may be in a motor vehicle and immediately in the process of picking up or dropping off a child. You also must comply with all other laws governing the transportation of firearms in a motor vehicle.

 

[voidsherpa]

Kinda sounds like y'all were crucifying the OP when it wasn't properly posted. Shouldn't feel bad about it at all, or "lucky", especially due to a disingenuous, anti 2 amendment business.

 

[Ddillard]

Well, D&B's won't see another dime from me or mine. For sure, a salute for the high road taken.

 

[Cameramonkey]

This is from the pamphlet given to me when I took my Ohio CCW license course:

The ability to have a firearm carries with it certain restrictions and responsibilities, many of which are regulated by state and federal laws. The explanation in this publication of laws regulating carrying a handgun is not an exhaustive list. If you have questions, consult an attorney.

Identification Required
You must carry another piece of valid government identification in addition to the handgun license.

Forbidden Carry Zones
The law sets forth several places where your license does not allow you to carry a handgun. Under the law, you may not carry a concealed handgun into the following places:
• Police stations
• Sheriffs’ offices
• Highway Patrol posts
• Premises controlled by BCI
• Correctional institutions or other detention facilities
• Airport terminals or airplanes
• Facilities for the care of mentally ill persons
• Courthouses or buildings in which a courtroom is located
• Universities, unless locked in a motor vehicle or in the process of being locked in a motor vehicle
• Places of worship, unless the place of worship permits otherwise
• Child day-care centers
• Licensed Class D liquor permit premises, if you are consuming beer or intoxicating liquor or are under the influence. If you are not consuming, and not under the influence, you may carry unless there is a conspicuous sign prohibiting carry. Possession of a concealed firearm is allowed in a retail store with a D-6 or D-8 permit as long as the concealed carry license holder is not consuming liquor. Class D permits are generally issued to an establishment that sells alcohol for consumption on the premises. In any event, do not consume beer or intoxicating liquor before carrying a concealed handgun into a licensed premises or while on the premises.
• Government facilities that are not used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility and are not a courthouse or a building or structure in which a courtroom is located.
• School safety zones
A “school safety zone” includes a school, school building, school premises, school activity, and school bus. For purposes of this statute, a school includes everything up to the property boundary.
If you are licensed to carry a concealed handgun, you may carry a handgun into a school safety zone only if you do not enter a school building, school premises, or school activity. You also must not be in one of the places listed in ORC 2923.126(B). You may be in a motor vehicle and immediately in the process of picking up or dropping off a child. You also must comply with all other laws governing the transportation of firearms in a motor vehicle.

EDIT: corrected due to more research

[STRIKE]This is was posted near the hostess stand in several restaurants w bars during my travels there. So Im not sure your highlighted section is entirely accurate.
2923.121.
(A) No person shall possess a firearm in any room in which any person is consuming beer or intoxicating liquor in a premises for which a D permit has been issued under Chapter 4303. of the Revised Code or in an open air arena for which a permit of that nature has been issued.[/STRIKE]