Ever pervasive Google/gmail

[browncofiddler]

Over the past several months I've read articles about the insidious spread of Google and all of it's holdings, i.e. gmail, YouTube, etc. Google has the ability to display live photos of our homes, to track our emails, to retain our IP addresses, to know nearly everything about us. Just doesn't sit well with me. Did you know that when you delete an email in gmail it is NEVER truly deleted?? Google holds deleted emails ad infinitum.

An alternative search engine is Start Page - does not track and retain your IP address, as Google does for every search you make.

I began shutting down my {gmail.com} email account today. When I tried to change my email address in YouTube I was not ALLOWED to b/c the email address I had given was my {gmail.com} address!!! So, a word of warning - if you don't have a YouTube account, but are going to get one - don't use a {gmail.com} email address to open your YouTube account, because you will then NEVER be able to change it.

Safe, encrypted email: For much safer email I found {hushmail.com}. Just passing it along for anyone who may be interested. It's much harder for eyes to view email in hushmail.com than it is through Yahoo, Hotmail or of course, gmail.

Just passing on a lil bit of useful & hopefully helpful info that I've learned. My worth...



~Kathy

 

[Protest]

It's nice to think about online privacy, but if the government truly wants to get into your stuff, then they will. If they don't spy on you directly from the company's servers, then they will put up traps on the route and catch all traffic going and coming.

If you want total privacy send a letter or go to the person's house or set up your own internet.

 

[lyric911]

Google has the ability to display live photos of our homes

I have the ability to drive by your house and see it too. And?

Did you know that when you delete an email in gmail it is NEVER truly deleted?? Google holds deleted emails ad infinitum.

Citation needed. From Gmail's own Privacy Policy:

We provide advertisers only aggregated non-personal information such as the number of times one of their ads was clicked. We do not sell, rent or otherwise share your personal information with any third parties except in the limited circumstances described in the Google Privacy Policy, such as when we believe we are required to do so by law.
Your choices
You may change your Gmail account settings through the Gmail "settings" section.
You may organize or delete your messages through your Gmail account or terminate your account through the Google Account section of Gmail settings. Such deletions or terminations will take immediate effect in your account view. Residual copies of deleted messages and accounts may take up to 60 days to be deleted from our active servers and may remain in our offline backup systems.

 

[iamaclone45]

Over the past several months I've read articles about the insidious spread of Google and all of it's holdings, i.e. gmail, YouTube, etc. Google has the ability to display live photos of our homes, to track our emails, to retain our IP addresses, to know nearly everything about us. Just doesn't sit well with me. Did you know that when you delete an email in gmail it is NEVER truly deleted?? Google holds deleted emails ad infinitum.

An alternative search engine is Start Page - does not track and retain your IP address, as Google does for every search you make.

I began shutting down my {gmail.com} email account today. When I tried to change my email address in YouTube I was not ALLOWED to b/c the email address I had given was my {gmail.com} address!!! So, a word of warning - if you don't have a YouTube account, but are going to get one - don't use a {gmail.com} email address to open your YouTube account, because you will then NEVER be able to change it.

Safe, encrypted email: For much safer email I found {hushmail.com}. Just passing it along for anyone who may be interested. It's much harder for eyes to view email in hushmail.com than it is through Yahoo, Hotmail or of course, gmail.

Just passing on a lil bit of useful & hopefully helpful info that I've learned. My worth...



~Kathy

Welcome to the future!

Pretty much all electronic data is never truly erased. Just because you hit delete on that file on your computer doesn’t mean it’s actually gone. With a simple program most deleted files can be easily recovered within 15 minutes.

Pretty much everything we do these days is tracked, recorded, analyzed, etc. From where you spend your money, to what you buy at the grocery store (those little discount cards you scan every time), to what you look at online, and on and on.

How do you know this hushmail.com is so secure? What guarentee do they give you that you can really trust? If I started a email service and called it “we’ll never sell or look at or use your information.com” would you believe it too?


As for Google, I am a huge fan. They have made my online experience quicker, more informative, and a whole lot easier.

 

[browncofiddler]

Protest - It's not so much about the Gov't (there's no escaping from them) but about Google and loss of privacy.

lyric911 - Their citation policy directly contradicts many articles (if they can be believed) I've read about Google's tracking & retention of IP addresses or emails that have been deleted or not. Who knows what to believe anymore?

Google Earth can be interesting & a good thing or it can be used for sinister purposes. The point is that now, without consent of any kind, anyone can see where you live to easily ID your house. Sure, anyone can usually (unless it's gated) drive by any given house, but for me it's just another unauthorized invasion that never used to be a possibility.

imaclone45 - That's right. This is the future, there's no turning back. Is hushmail safer - who's to know? If Google's citation policy is to be believed, then hushmail's encryption claims can't be discounted either. Would I believe anything I read on any given site - no, that's the point - it's best to proceed with caution and research as much as possible in attempt to navigate the web safely. Using all that Google has to offer does make life easier by far for so many people - but there's no free lunch. Google must be getting something in return for the many wonderful 'free' services it offers - could there be hidden costs to it's users??

One thing for sure is that it was never my intention to stir the pot. I was just trying to pass on what I thought was helpful info that some people might find handy. Take it with a grain of salt - discard the info if it's a pebble in your shoe.

 

[browncofiddler]

More today:

SCARY: CIA teams up with Google to improve Web monitoring

 

[Expat]

Remember also that Google, professes as their mantra, do no evil. But then they were more than happy to work with the Chicoms against the people of China. I think they have since changed their policy but there for quite awhile they were a willing coconspirator with the Chinese government (as was Yahoo).

 

[eldirector]

Remember, its not just Google. Microsoft, Yahoo, etc.. all have the same policies. Their maps show the same data, they keep your email in the off-line backups "forever", they all track what you do and sell to the next business down the line. If you do ANYTHING online, or use a credit/debit card, or discount card, then "they" know what you are up to. Only way around it is to become Amish

Of course, there are a LOT of things you can do to help yourself. Most folks either don't know, or don't bother.

- don't say anything over email or online your wouldn't say in a crowded restaurant
- keep multiple email accounts. One "real" one, and several "throw-aways". Use the throw away accounts when filling out online forms. Keep the real one for family/friend correspondence.
- Google yourself now and then. Take action if you find something you don't like. Most info can at least be updated, maybe even removed.
- Find a credit/debit card with a good privacy policy. Use it (and ONLY it) for online purchases.
- Stay off Ebay and PayPal. They really are teh debbil!
- Make sure your phone (and cell phone) are unlisted
- Get a pre-paid phone, and use its number rather than your home phone number when filling out forms.
- If you are really private, get a mailbox at the UPS store or one of those Mailbox places. Gives you a real mailing address (not a PO box), without using your physical address.

If you are a real online privacy nut, use an "anonymizer" and only connect via public hotspots.

Now, if you would excuse me, my shipment of tinfoil just arrived....

 

[browncofiddler]

eldirector - Very good stuff to know. Thanks.

Expat ~ Thanks for also pointing out the former China connections of both Google & Yahoo.

 

[christman]

I just don't see the problem here. You are using someone elses service. I certainly won't blame the big corporations for keeping tabs on their **** just because the world is becoming dependent on them. Everyone wants to get nowhere in a hurry.

It''s the same when I sit in airports awaiting a plane ride. I constantly hear people complaining around me about it being 15 minutes late. Or too cramped. Etc. Etc.. YOUR FLYING THROUGH THE AIR IN A GIANT METAL ABOMINATION TO NATURE. We should be so lucky that the service is even available to make our lives easier...Same with the interwebs... I guess I just miss Mayberry.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Over the past several months I've read articles about the insidious spread of Google and all of it's holdings, i.e. gmail, YouTube, etc. Google has the ability to display live photos of our homes, to track our emails, to retain our IP addresses, to know nearly everything about us. Just doesn't sit well with me. Did you know that when you delete an email in gmail it is NEVER truly deleted?? Google holds deleted emails ad infinitum.

An alternative search engine is Start Page - does not track and retain your IP address, as Google does for every search you make.

I began shutting down my {gmail.com} email account today. When I tried to change my email address in YouTube I was not ALLOWED to b/c the email address I had given was my {gmail.com} address!!! So, a word of warning - if you don't have a YouTube account, but are going to get one - don't use a {gmail.com} email address to open your YouTube account, because you will then NEVER be able to change it.

Safe, encrypted email: For much safer email I found {hushmail.com}. Just passing it along for anyone who may be interested. It's much harder for eyes to view email in hushmail.com than it is through Yahoo, Hotmail or of course, gmail.

Just passing on a lil bit of useful & hopefully helpful info that I've learned. My worth...



~Kathy

You seem nice, so instead of lambasting, I'm going to try to explain.

Every thing you do online is monitored by the NSA and logged. Currently they are so understaffed and overwhelmed that the surveillance is NOT real-time, but if anything from your keyboard matches any one of several thousand keywords determined by the NSA, all traffic to and from your computer is logged and then read through by a human to determine if you are a threat. This is not conspiracy, this is not a hoax, this is not exaggeration. This is fact. The name of this program is 'Stellar Wind' and has been ongoing for several years.

Even https://, the supposedly 'secure' protocol, has significant weaknesses, particularly to an entity as cryptographically-inclined as the NSA, which may or may not have cracked the current de-facto standard, RSA-4096, which is an encoding scheme derived by Rivest/Shamir/Adleman co-dependently and is apparently one of the most secure useable cryptographic schemes out there. I take this on authority as I am NOT a cryptologist nor would I ever make the claim. Nor do I particularly comprehend well the nuances of sockets or servers or internet routing. However, even with supposedly anonymous networks, such as the infamous TOR/eepnet protocols, if an adversary is monitoring both ends of the tunnel through which your traffic is routing, then it can use timing and packet size to easily determine who you are, where you are, and what you're up to.

But there are different types of adversaries. Government could be an adversary. A nosy co-worker or employer could be an adversary. A hostile relative or acquaintance could be an adversary, and all of these entities have vastly different intents and capabilities. Your neighbor, unless he/she is particularly versed in the weaknesses of computer systems, probably wouldn't garner much even if handed the tools to supposedly 'hack' (and I use the term reluctantly here given its disambiguation through years of continual misuse) your accounts and sensitive information, even if they had the time or inclination. Government, however, has both the time and money and resources to do precisely that. Everything you do online not only has the potential to be traced given the vast control the NSA possesses, but IS in fact being traced and logged. All of it. Also of interest to you might be learning more about the NSA's 'Total Information Awareness' mission (which is actually public knowledge right there on its website), as well as its perhaps more secretive ones, such as 'Stellar Wind.'

There is no relief from the telescreens and never again will there be. This is the brave new world of our own creation and there is no hope of reverting back to a more free or more simple time. There is no one to save us except Big Brother himself, should he ever choose to do so.

 

[Tactical Dave]

It's nice to think about online privacy, but if the government truly wants to get into your stuff, then they will. If they don't spy on you directly from the company's servers, then they will put up traps on the route and catch all traffic going and coming.

If you want total privacy send a letter or go to the person's house or set up your own internet.

Letters can be stoped in the mail and read....... then sent off to their destenation trust me a guy I used to work with got busted for sending child porn in the mail...... they grabed the box at the post office, opend it and checked it out then sent it off to its destenation so that they could charge them from what I hear. Houses can also be buged or listening devices can be used...... I don't think we will ever have 100% privacy all the time......


A rule of thumb is that anything that is sent/saved/typed on a computer never goes away for good when the internet is used.

 

[browncofiddler]

christman - That's just it - if that's what the big interweb giants do with our information - then I don't want to use their services if it can be helped. But this thread has been very illuminating for me because, as Tom Sawyer and others have pointed out, there's NO getting around it or escaping from it. Maybe I see it as a problem b/c I'm obviously very, very old school and miss Mayberry too. This is our brave new world and I'm having a hard time getting used to it and am still shocked at how accurate '1984' was. When I read it in the 60's, it was beyond anyone's comprehension, seemed like a fairy tale that no one could imagine in their wildest dreams. But we're living it now.

Tom Sawyer - Thanks for not lambasting me with hostility. I had no idea how 'the system' works. I know how to run a keyboard but don't know how the guts of the internet really works. Your explanation is really helpful and lends a lot of understanding to the inner workings of the web.

I now take away from all of these comments a better understanding of how it works. Kind of makes me feel like walking into a store with cash is a better way of doing business for those who don't want to leave paper trails miles long for strangers to see. For those of us who knew what it was formerly like to live our lives with dignity and privacy, the world we live in now feels pretty inhospitable at times.

Thanks, I appreciate the opportunity to learn more each day.