Flight 370

[avboiler11]

I realize that the transponder signal is issued on a per-flight basis, you said that much earlier, but there isn't some sort of vehicle-identification number anywhere on the fusilage or stamped anywhere into the plane?

Each airplane has a unique registration number, and a (small) dataplate somewhere on it with its unit serial number.

All Boeing 777s are indistinguishable from other Boeing 777s? All same-model aircraft are indistinguishable from other same-model aircraft except for N-tail numbers and paint jobs? That's really what I'm wanting to know.

Basically, yes, within the same model number (777-200 or 777-300).

 

[Max Volume]

I failed to mention in my previous post that I believe the pilots of airliners have smoke/oxygen masks for just such an occasion of fire.

 

[88GT]

A Startlingly Simple Theory About the Missing Malaysia Airlines Jet | Autopia | Wired.com


I saw this article today about FLT 370. it is a very well written piece from a very experienced pilot. i think he makes some very good points and some very good determinations from his wealth of experience. to me this is the first explanation that has seemed realistic and matches the given evidence at hand. I hate to say i think he is right as it would mean the death of all on board but i hope and pray this is not a precursor to a larger terror plot.

Makes sense except for one thing: IIRC, the final "Good night" came after the transponder communication ceased. If that's true, this guy's scenario doesn't really add up.

 

[indykid]

Reference the Swissair MD-11 that had an inflight fire, the pilots saw smoke, but it was right after takeoff and the aircraft was well above it's maximum safe landing weight. The pilots started dumping fuel but as they went over land, they stopped as a nice gesture to those on the ground, a fatal move. By the time they were back over water to continue dumping fuel to get the plane within it's safe landing weight, the fire burned through the controls and the plane went down into the sea, uncontrolled. Hindsight, had the pilots attempted to land at a field almost directly in front of them, dumping fuel along the way instead of circling and trying to dump only over the ocean, they might have successfully landed, or the plane break up on landing heavy and catch fire. We will never know.

As for Flight 370, for grins assuming there was a waiting runway for them, and a place to hide the plane, getting it airborne and communicating would be easy. First if it landed in Africa, there is almost no air traffic control over the continent, really scary. Second, all they would have to do is call in as a cargo aircraft operating unscheduled. They would then be assigned a perfect transponder code, and flown on their way to anywhere they desired, without anyone knowing what they were up to.

Or the pilot was suicidal and flew the plane as far south as possible, and as the plane ran out of fuel, dived nose down straight into the ocean leaving a very tiny debris field, if any.

 

[87iroc]

Makes sense except for one thing: IIRC, the final "Good night" came after the transponder communication ceased. If that's true, this guy's scenario doesn't really add up.

He indicated that the pilots may not have known that problems were happening in the back...maybe things were shorting out/shutting down w/o their awareness at that point.

 

[IndyUSMC]

A Startlingly Simple Theory About the Missing Malaysia Airlines Jet | Autopia | Wired.com


I saw this article today about FLT 370. it is a very well written piece from a very experienced pilot. i think he makes some very good points and some very good determinations from his wealth of experience. to me this is the first explanation that has seemed realistic and matches the given evidence at hand. I hate to say i think he is right as it would mean the death of all on board but i hope and pray this is not a precursor to a larger terror plot.

I fly a B777 for work. There are quite a few holes in this theory. I do not subscribe to the onboard fire theory at all.

 

[indykid]

IndyUSMC, another thing that stands out against that article is the guy not knowing that the Swissair plan was an MD11. If you are going to quote stuff to prove your point, you need to make sure you get your stuff right.

And a front tire fire? Wouldn't a low tire cause steering issues that could or would cause a takeoff abort? Usually a tire fire is cause by a brake issue and there are no brakes on the nose gear.

Add to that the pilots of Swissair 111 reported smoke before pulling the breakers. The pilots of 370 gave no indication of smoke.

 

[stephen87]

BREAKING NEWS::

Fox News reporting Australia states that they have possibly found two pieces from flight 370. They are sending a ship to investigate and the ship will reach the area Thursday afternoon.

 

[jblomenberg16]

BREAKING NEWS::

Fox News reporting Australia states that they have possibly found two pieces from flight 370. They are sending a ship to investigate and the ship will reach the area Thursday afternoon.

Sure hope it is. Then again, what are we going to talk about now? I bet Obama has either finished up conceding to Putin, or is desperate for some media attention again and ready to be back in the spotlight.

 

[atvdave]

Malaysia Airlines Flight 370: Australia says possible objects in ocean - CNN.com

 

[stephen87]

I'm hoping that if they DO find that it's pieces of the plane, the rafts are open with passengers in them.

 

[K_W]

I'm hoping that if they DO find that it's pieces of the plane, the rafts are open with passengers in them.

This long on the open salt water? Most would be dead, or worse.

 

[stephen87]

Would you rather have a proper burial or would you rather be at the bottom of the ocean in a plane?

 

[K_W]

Would you rather have a proper burial or would you rather be at the bottom of the ocean in a plane?

I thought you were saying they would find survivors.

If not alive, bodies are better than forever missing, but if there are survivors, they will never be the same.

 

[stephen87]

Agreed. I would love for the passengers to be alive, but I know they won't be and that if they are, they'll never be the same.

However, I would rather bury my family member/be buried than the be at the bottom of the ocean.

 

[IndyUSMC]

IndyUSMC, another thing that stands out against that article is the guy not knowing that the Swissair plan was an MD11. If you are going to quote stuff to prove your point, you need to make sure you get your stuff right.

And a front tire fire? Wouldn't a low tire cause steering issues that could or would cause a takeoff abort? Usually a tire fire is cause by a brake issue and there are no brakes on the nose gear.

Add to that the pilots of Swissair 111 reported smoke before pulling the breakers. The pilots of 370 gave no indication of smoke.

Yes if it truly was a fire, one of the first things we would do is tell ATC.

There are two nose tires and you may or may not notice one going flat, but the plane would tell you. This more likely would happen on the main gear where there are six tires on each side, and you would not know it unless the jet told you. Tire pressure monitoring, just like in your new car. Fires are usually brake fires on landing and not on takeoff, although we practice both.

One of the first steps for these fires while airborne is to lower the gear, blow it out and starve it of oxygen. Usually the concern of a tire issue is the possible damage from shrapnel during the blowout. Other systems become affected, but not fires. This would have happened well before they made a left turn an hour into the flight.

 

[88GT]

He indicated that the pilots may not have known that problems were happening in the back...maybe things were shorting out/shutting down w/o their awareness at that point.

It was my understanding that the two different communication devices were turned off at two different points in time and that they were located (they being the on/off switches) were located in the cockpit. If a fire were responsible for taking out the electrical source to the communication devices somewhere other than the cockpit, then the chances that it would have taken out the electrical power of something else is almost 100%. And that assumes the physical communication devices are located elsewhere on the plane, which seems unlikely. If they are located in or near the cockpit, how does a fire take out the communication devices, at separate points in time, and without the pilots being aware of it? I would think that unlikely, but I readily admit my knowledge of 777 design and construction is for all intents and purposes non-existent. I just really doubt a fire fits the timeline and the other evidence.

But are there no means of detecting fire in these jets other than the feedback from the damage they cause? Do they not have something akin to smoke detectors? Wouldn't surprise me. All that technology and someone forget the fire detection.

 

[IndyUSMC]

But are there no means of detecting fire in these jets other than the feedback from the damage they cause? Do they not have something akin to smoke detectors? Wouldn't surprise me. All that technology and someone forget the fire detection.

Lots of fire and smoke detection on the plane and presented on the flight deck to the pilots, engine, wheel well and cabin.

 

[avboiler11]

But are there no means of detecting fire in these jets other than the feedback from the damage they cause?

I can't speak for the 777, but generally there are smoke/heat detectors in cargo compartments and in the cabin, along with landing gear/engines/axillary power unit.

With a slow burning electrical fire, the first indication of an issue would be electrical issues and/or faint wisps of acrid smoke that is VERY distinct in an airplane.

 

[88GT]

Lots of fire and smoke detection on the plane and presented on the flight deck to the pilots, engine, wheel well and cabin.

Okay, so unlikely that a fire is burning long without some sort of warning to the pilots?

Are the shut off switches to the transponder and other device (I forget the acronym) near the pilots? Are the actual devices near the pilots? What is the likelihood the fire took them out, 12 minutes apart, from a location in the plane other than in or near the cockpit?