GM plant / United Auto Workers Local 23

[BloodEclipse]

None of this can take into account how union employees screw around on the job. They arean't afraid of being fired. Sure they make the same hourly wages, but when a man is doing half the work for the same hourly rate, he isn't earning his keep.

Come work on assembly line and show me how to accomplish that.
I love people making assumptions. If you want to be taken serious, try having some knowledge of what you say.
The union is part owner now. Not the workers mind you.
Whose interest do they protect?
The workers who they are supposed to represent or their own?

 

[localone]

The unions dont hire the employees the company does..Maybe they do look harder at the **** they hire then there wont be any problems

 

[Mike Elzinga]

I didnt read through the whole thread becuase it is full of a lot of opinions. At the end of the day, analyze if you could tolerate a 50% pay cut, regardless of what your pay rate is. Also, if the union in question just took the deal, they are devaluing themselves. They have just told evey industry in that area that they can cut labor costs in half and it will be tolerated. You get what you pay for, that includes people. If you pay a guy good money, you will get good employees, if you pay a **** wage, you will get **** people.

Also, unless you have been at the table with a corporation, and argued a union contract, feel free to keep opinions to yourself, because you dont have all the facts. I have been at that table, and while I am not a super pro union guy, without unions in existence, we would all be screwed.

Things like this are how China is full of 6 yr olds working for $1 a day

 

[PwrCruz]

I saw the new's report a couple of day's ago so I might be wrong but the way I understood it the UAW local 23 accepted the purposal from the perspective buyer and held a vote to ratify the agreement at which time the membership voted it down.

 

[BloodEclipse]

I saw the new's report a couple of day's ago so I might be wrong but the way I understood it the UAW local 23 accepted the purposal from the perspective buyer and held a vote to ratify the agreement at which time the membership voted it down.

Close, the International went behind the Local's back and worked a deal.
When the Local stood up and said no, that was the end of it.

 

[PwrCruz]

Close, the International went behind the Local's back and worked a deal.
When the Local stood up and said no, that was the end of it.

Thanks for the info .

 

[BigMatt]

Come work on assembly line and show me how to accomplish that.
I love people making assumptions. If you want to be taken serious, try having some knowledge of what you say.
The union is part owner now. Not the workers mind you.
Whose interest do they protect?
The workers who they are supposed to represent or their own?

Whose interest do they protect? Did you just see the report about the Chrysler workers drinking hooch and smoking weed on their breaks? Whose interest were they looking out for?

I have heard mare than one first hand report of people that have worked in GM and Chrysler assembly plants that were told to slw down their production because they were making others looking bad.

I do have knowledge of what I am talking about. Please quit putting me down while assuming that I don't know what I am talking about.

 

[jd4320t]

I didnt read through the whole thread becuase it is full of a lot of opinions. At the end of the day, analyze if you could tolerate a 50% pay cut, regardless of what your pay rate is. Also, if the union in question just took the deal, they are devaluing themselves. They have just told evey industry in that area that they can cut labor costs in half and it will be tolerated. You get what you pay for, that includes people. If you pay a guy good money, you will get good employees, if you pay a **** wage, you will get **** people.

Also, unless you have been at the table with a corporation, and argued a union contract, feel free to keep opinions to yourself, because you dont have all the facts. I have been at that table, and while I am not a super pro union guy, without unions in existence, we would all be screwed.

Things like this are how China is full of 6 yr olds working for $1 a day

You can't not factor in the pay rate. This is Indianapolis. $30 and hour is a big deal here and you can't get it just anywhere.

A lower wage does not make a person ****! I hope I never live in a society where someone is **** because they make a lesser wage.

I've never been to the Union bargaining table and I hope I never am. I've worked at some great non union places and believe a union would make them worse.

 

[BloodEclipse]

Whose interest do they protect? Did you just see the report about the Chrysler workers drinking hooch and smoking weed on their breaks? Whose interest were they looking out for?

Maybe you are not making the distinction between the UAW and the workers who have to join to work there.
The UAW is an International Union that takes dues from more than autoworkers. Many law enforcement employees are UAW members.
This entity is supposed to represent its members.
For GM workers, the UAW owns a percentage of the company. My point was, are they more interested in the value of that share, or of the well being of the union dues paying employees?
Do you see the conflict of interest here?

I have heard mare than one first hand report of people that have worked in GM and Chrysler assembly plants that were told to slw down their production because they were making others looking bad.

This happened in the past at parts plants. GM has effectively closed and outsourced almost all of the parts plants. This is not done on an assembly line, because the line moves at a certain speed continuously. You have to put that bumper, seat, window, door or other components on within the window of time it passes your station, then be ready to do the next one.

I do have knowledge of what I am talking about. Please quit putting me down while assuming that I don't know what I am talking about.

I'm not putting you down.
You just think you know more than you really do.

 

[Tactical Dave]

Congratulations to the UAW local 23 for standing together and rejecting an offer that would have kept the Indianapolis metal plant open. Congratulations on the lose of 650 production workers and more than 50 salaried workers jobs. Where was the win in your stance? What did you gain? How does your decision affect Indianapolis down the road? Here we go, IMO this is exactly the reason why a foreign auto maker is the #1 selling vehicle in the US today. I don't see the logic in closing a plant, sure I can understand your issue with a wage cut (by nearly half). But like momma always said "a half glass of milk is better than no milk". According to the unemployment statistics I'm sure there are thousands of unemployed people that would love to have a job paying $15.50 per hour.
I just don't understand, I guess it all comes down to GREED.
Congratulations on your WIN !!!!!! What will your unemployment checks breakdown to per hour???? Not $15.50 per hour.

At first I was fired up about this but when I was in contracting in Aviation I would have not had taken a pay cut. I would have just gone to the next job making the same money.

Do we know if UAW would have cut them all together if they had said yes? Maybe they did not want to loose their senority?

Personally it means nothing, we all know that when GM closes another company will open up shopw and pay $15.50 or less...

Also I am sure that on unemployment they would make more then 15.50 an hour or at least close enough that it is still more money in their pocket to sit at home....... or the extra pay from working is not worh going in....

 

[BigMatt]

BloodEclipse, You're right. The UAW shouldn't own part of GM or Chrysler. They drove the companies into the ground until they could get what they want - power. That can't be good for the average union guy who is not only negotiating with GM or Chrysler, but, in effect, he is negotiating with the guy who is supposed to be supporting him.

That also can't be good for Ford. The UAW can screw with Ford all it wants causing that company to be uncompetitive.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

Awhile back I heard that GM was readying an IPO to sell their stock again. My question is: who in their right mind would buy their stock after what happened to the last set of investors at the hands of the government?

 

[Hoosier Gun Coat]

Awhile back I heard that GM was readying an IPO to sell their stock again. My question is: who in their right mind would buy their stock after what happened to the last set of investors at the hands of the government?

I think I also read where GM would have to offer it up at $134 a share just to be able to payback their "loan". YEAH RIGHT! Sounds like to should be a penny stock.

 

[BigMatt]

Awhile back I heard that GM was readying an IPO to sell their stock again. My question is: who in their right mind would buy their stock after what happened to the last set of investors at the hands of the government?

That was my thought.

Mitch Daniels: Hoosiers vs. Crony Capitalism - WSJ.com

 

[4sarge]

That was my thought.

Mitch Daniels: Hoosiers vs. Crony Capitalism - WSJ.com

Obama & the UAW Stole $$'s from the Indiana Public Employees Pension Fund of which I am a Member. This Theft places the Fund in Jeopardy and Diminishes Pension Returns. This is a Prime Example of his (OBAMA) Wealth Redistribution and Payment (Bribes) to the UAW for their Votes & Contributions to the Democrat Party. I will NEVER Forget or Forgive this THEFT.

June 10 will be a silent anniversary, but one worth noting by those alarmed at the past year's assault on free institutions. It was last June 10 when the federal government tossed aside the option of proven, workable bankruptcy procedures in order to nationalize Chrysler on behalf of its union allies.
In order to provide preferential treatment to its cronies, the Obama administration confiscated the property of those creditors who had lent money to Chrysler in good faith, believing that their interest was legally secured and that they stood at the head of the line in the event of the ...

 

[x10]

Hey guys its about time that the lay down and take anything Unions finally got a back bone.

If we start thinking $15 is a good wage then we'll be a 3rd world county in a heartbeat. A person can't sustain an American level of living on $15.

We should strive to make our selves as valuable as possible and to settle for low wages is not what American's do we don't settle we progress and what is going on right now with american busines is rolling back to pre WW2

Its criminal for a skilled worker to take a $15/ hour job

 

[melensdad]

Hey guys its about time that the lay down and take anything Unions finally got a back bone.

If we start thinking $15 is a good wage then we'll be a 3rd world county in a heartbeat. A person can't sustain an American level of living on $15.

We should strive to make our selves as valuable as possible and to settle for low wages is not what American's do we don't settle we progress and what is going on right now with american busines is rolling back to pre WW2

Its criminal for a skilled worker to take a $15/ hour job

As far as I am concerned you are entitled to your opinion.

However, if I want to sell my labor for $14.95 per hour and take away the $15.00 per hour job that you are doing then that I my right to do so.

You say its criminal for a skilled worker to make so little. I say its feeding a family to accept it.

We can each have our own moral code, mine is to do what it takes to feed and shelter my family. Yours is apparently to force the jobs offshore so families in Mexico, Brazil, Korea or China can feed their families while you take 'unemployment' from our government . . . which is nothing more than taking some of my money from my pocket.

I can't understand why people want to turn down good jobs and close factories. That is really what this whole discussion is about. You have the right to turn down the job, but you should not have the right to shut down the factory and prevent me from taking the same job. The idiotic union is taking away the rights of people to choose where to work by forcing these factories overseas. If fairness matters then the union workers should walk away and let the rest of the people take the jobs. But the unions don't care about fairness as long as congress keeps extending unemployment benefits. They are happy to suck off the government's teat. Me, I'd rather do my job and be left alone. I'll take that job at $14.95 and do it better than you.

 

[4sarge]

The UAW is showing it's True Colors on 10-02-10 and Marching in DC with at least 20 Marxist organizations - and I stopped counting before I was a 1/4 of the way through the list. Ask yourself this: do you really want to dump OUR Freedoms and our Constitution for whatever the Socialist Union Bosses tell You What to do?

One Nation Working Together

 

[ATOMonkey]

Oh those whacky unions...

I've been dealing with UAW line workers for 10 years. I have no sympathy for any of them. They're cooking the golden goose and they know it. They just don't care. They assume they'll be able to get another job at another union shop, or they're holding out long enough to retire with 20 years on the job.

 

[rjstamp]

An EMT that can literally save your life makes about $15-20 per hour.....some schmuck that dribbles an air filled leather ball up and down a wooden floor makes between $3 million and $30million bucks per year.....where is the wisdom and equity in our American system?