going off the grid......($60,000 sort of)

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  • longbow

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Apr 2, 2008
    6,900
    63
    south central IN
    Last year I got angry when the power company raised my rates.

    I've talked with several solar design operations to change my hobby farm to off the grid. They have shared with me several ideas to get this project done. Since I have a small farm, I discovered I qualified for some tax credits and grants. The information is a high level off the grid summary of how it could work for my place.

    The costs do not include changing over to propane for the furnace, dryer, stove and hot water heater.

    ---------Part of the email-------
    Let’s size your system at 10 kW. I am going to assume we can consider your needs related to farm use and thus consider it a business expense. The system should generate approximately 13,000 kWh for the year at 13.4 cents per would arrive at annual savings of $1742. Here’s the breakdown:

    Approximate installed cost $60,000
    USDA REAP Grant - 25,000
    Fed 30% investment tax credit - 10,500
    Accelerated fed depreciation - 14,325
    (assuming farm is in 30% tax bracket)
    Energy savings in first year - 1,742

    Total payoff remaining after year one: $8,433 leaving an additional 4.8 years to pay back. T

    That payback does not include the fact that energy prices are undoubtedly going to rise in that period, shortening the payback even more. The panels are guaranteed to produce power for 25 years and likely will produce power beyond that, giving you 20+ years of free energy.
     

    dudley0

    Nobody Important
    Rating - 100%
    99   0   0
    Mar 19, 2010
    3,746
    113
    Grant County
    I have a slight possibility of getting an old farm. I was thinking about turning it into a hobby farm of sorts. I had also wondered what I could do to get it off grid. This is some good initial info.

    If it turns out where I do get the place I will be hounding you for additional info. Thanks for the post.
     

    longbow

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Apr 2, 2008
    6,900
    63
    south central IN
    The total cost for our place to go off the grid: $82,000 before taxes, rebates and grants

    $60,000 solar as quoted with room to upgrade to 15 KW and expand battery bank

    $10,000 for new pump house building with roof to hold solar panals, inverters, gen set, and reserve water tank (with larger expansion tank) so a more efficient jet pump will run to move water. This includes pulling and replacing the submersible pump.

    $8,000 Propane change over costs

    $4,000 propane furnace
    $1000 water heater
    $1000 stove
    $1000 dryer
    $1000 piping

    $4,000 Propane Tank (estimate) above ground or underground-pending depth of limestone. I'm partial to underground.

    FYI-The first bank I have talked to just smiled, but they have not said no since I showed them the tax and grants that exist.
     

    Marc

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Aug 16, 2008
    2,517
    38
    District 6
    keep in mind you can actually sell power to the electric company and they write YOU a check for using your power
     

    vesan87

    Marksman
    Rating - 100%
    10   0   0
    Oct 14, 2010
    270
    16
    A little south of Indy
    After selling them your surplus power for a few months write them a letter explaining how local weather conditions and solar flares from the sun mean that your going to have to raise THEIR rate significantly.
     

    1911Shooter

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Jan 20, 2011
    584
    16
    Pendleton, IN
    Even better than solar would be wind. Here in Indiana we have a lot of windy days so you might what to check into that. It is also a federal law that the electric companies do have to buy back your additional power. I am an electrician and have studied this a great deal. There are many ways to generate power so it really comes down to how much you want to spend and how much power you want to generate. Always make sure that you do the math first before buying any of these type systems. To make them pay for themselves you want to produce as much power as possible for you budget. It should pay for itself in roughly ten years.
     

    ghitch75

    livin' in the sticks
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    117   0   0
    Dec 21, 2009
    13,512
    83
    Greene County
    for 1 there is only 13% sunshine in the winter months around here...2 your gen will burn at least 4 gallons a day @ $3.59 a gallon..3 $5k for a water heater and furnace?.....where do you live?......i'll come and do it for $4k......what kind heat do you have now?
     

    ghitch75

    livin' in the sticks
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    117   0   0
    Dec 21, 2009
    13,512
    83
    Greene County
    Even better than solar would be wind. Here in Indiana we have a lot of windy days so you might what to check into that. It is also a federal law that the electric companies do have to buy back your additional power. I am an electrician and have studied this a great deal. There are many ways to generate power so it really comes down to how much you want to spend and how much power you want to generate. Always make sure that you do the math first before buying any of these type systems. To make them pay for themselves you want to produce as much power as possible for you budget. It should pay for itself in roughly ten years.

    wind would be good if your up north in the flat lands......down here where i'm at it would have to be up about 150ft to get any wind.......
     

    Bendrx

    Expert
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Sep 3, 2009
    975
    18
    East Indy.
    where does the government get all this free money from? I just wanna find the hidden money cave.

    I know where the cave is, there's actually millions of them. Take one finger and pull open your pocket. See it's a cave! Sadly, they isn't any moratoriums set for pocket mining, just oil and it's a booming business for the Federalis.
     

    Waveraider

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 100%
    2   0   0
    Jan 12, 2009
    629
    18
    Indianapolis
    What's the SF of the area taken by the solar panels? Gotta be huge!Something else to keep in mind, your insurance company isn't going to cover 80K of replacement cost for this upgrade for N/C. That may eat up a big part of your energy savings. One hail storm claim will get you dropped w/o any other carrier picking you up. :twocents:
     

    longbow

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Apr 2, 2008
    6,900
    63
    south central IN
    What's the SF of the area taken by the solar panels? Gotta be huge!Something else to keep in mind, your insurance company isn't going to cover 80K of replacement cost for this upgrade for N/C. That may eat up a big part of your energy savings. One hail storm claim will get you dropped w/o any other carrier picking you up. :twocents:

    I already asked, I would add the cost of the system to my farm insurance coverage and they would have no problem taking my money. They claim the covering for the solar panals is rated for hail stikes.

    The insurance company is more concerned with the type of tank I would have for diesel then propane. They don't have a clue which is more dangerous! They stated they have had very good results homes with solar power. They have very few hail damage claims on the units.

    The layout depends on the arrangement to minimize wiring length and voltage. The total area of all the panels is 650 sq ft.
     
    Last edited:

    longbow

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Apr 2, 2008
    6,900
    63
    south central IN
    What are the qualifications for the grant? If I have a single chicken does that constitute a farm?

    It could the first year! I don't think having a chicken in a subdivision would cut it, but a few acres in a rural area might be enough?!

    If you write off the expenses as a farm on your taxes you are on the right direction.. Being on the USDA list as a working farm is also one of the means to get the grant. Your tax consultant would be able to help you.
     

    Keith_Indy

    Master
    Rating - 95.2%
    20   1   0
    Mar 10, 2009
    3,247
    113
    Noblesville
    Great information, thanks for sharing.

    When we can swing it, we're planning on buying a few more acres, and I def. want to be self-sustaining as much as possible.
     
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