Gun Free School Zones Act

[Thomas1969]

Hello,

I have heard that the gun free school zones act of 1995 (I think) makes it so you can’t even drive through a school zone while carrying unless you have a carry permit from the state that the school is located, so even if I have a carry permit if I am in, say, Ohio I can’t even drive through a school zone. Is this correct??

 

[actaeon277]

Bump for help.

 

[actaeon277]

I hate to use wiki as a source, but..

Gun-Free School Zones Act of 1990 - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Following a 1995 Supreme Court ruling, United States v. Lopez, which stuck down the original law, the Gun-Free Schools Act of 1990 was amended so prosecution would only occur for crimes involving guns linked to either interstate or foreign commerce





Maybe someone more knowledgeable will show up

 

[Thomas1969]

I hate to use wiki as a source, but..

Gun-Free School Zones Act of 1990 - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Following a 1995 Supreme Court ruling, United States v. Lopez, which stuck down the original law, the Gun-Free Schools Act of 1990 was amended so prosecution would only occur for crimes involving guns linked to either interstate or foreign commerce





Maybe someone more knowledgeable will show up

Thanks for the bump and the info. I’m more so wanting to know if it’s illegal to carry (with a valid permit) in a different state as I drive through a school zone

 

[actaeon277]

Gun Free School Zone Notice (ATF P 5310.1) | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives

www.atf.gov

 

[Thomas1969]

Gun Free School Zone Notice (ATF P 5310.1) | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives

www.atf.gov

Also, which states actually enforce this? (The likelihood of being stopped by a federal agent is essentially zero)

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Thanks for the bump and the info. I’m more so wanting to know if it’s illegal to carry (with a valid permit) in a different state as I drive through a school zone

First IANAL but from my reading if you know or should reasonably know you are in a school zone it is illegal to carry in another state unless you are licensed by that state. But from my understanding there has not been a prosecution under that law since the original law was overturned for simply carrying in a school zone. For someone actively shooting at people within the school zone that may be a different story though.

That's not to mention that the type of police that would most likely be pulling you over can't enforce that law. Federal LEO or those deputized by the feds are the only ones that can enforce fed law.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I hate to use wiki as a source, but..

Gun-Free School Zones Act of 1990 - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Following a 1995 Supreme Court ruling, United States v. Lopez, which stuck down the original law, the Gun-Free Schools Act of 1990 was amended so prosecution would only occur for crimes involving guns linked to either interstate or foreign commerce





Maybe someone more knowledgeable will show up

Unfortunately virtually every gun and everything else "effects" interstate commerce. See Wickard v Filburn wheat grown on your own property for your own use "effects" interstate commerce.

{{meta.fullTitle}}

 

[Thomas1969]

First IANAL but from my reading if you know or should reasonably know you are in a school zone it is illegal to carry in another state unless you are licensed by that state. But from my understanding there has not been a prosecution under that law since the original law was overturned for simply carrying in a school zone. For someone actively shooting at people within the school zone that may be a different story though.

That's not to mention that the type of police that would most likely be pulling you over can't enforce that law. Federal LEO or those deputized by the feds are the only ones that can enforce fed law.

It’s so obvious that this law is unconstitutional, but at least only federal agents can enforce this since the likelihood of being pulled over by an ATF agent is essentially 0.
Do you have a reliable source that only federal agents can enforce this? I cannot find a definitive and reliable answer.

 

[xwing]

This hinges on how 18USC 922(q)(2)(B)(ii) is interpreted.

Does a state's official recognition of another state's permit count as "licensed to do so by the State"? I would argue "yes", especially based on the lack of any prosecutions for a lawful permit-holder. But it does open up a can of worms in Constitutional Carry states for those without any permit. IMO this act is another reason to get a license even if you are in (or travel in) Constitutional Carry states.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

It’s so obvious that this law is unconstitutional, but at least only federal agents can enforce this since the likelihood of being pulled over by an ATF agent is essentially 0.
Do you have a reliable source that only federal agents can enforce this? I cannot find a definitive and reliable answer.

No source off the top of my head, but feds can't enforce state/local laws without being deputized by the state/locals and the reverse is the same. State/locals can't enforce fed laws without being deputized by the feds. Now I believe but am not sure that the locals could detain you for it and a fed officer could come and make the arrest, but as I stated there hasn't been an arrest/prosecution for simply carrying in a school zone since the law was put into place.

 

[Thomas1969]

No source off the top of my head, but feds can't enforce state/local laws without being deputized by the state/locals and the reverse is the same. State/locals can't enforce fed laws without being deputized by the feds. Now I believe but am not sure that the locals could detain you for it and a fed officer could come and make the arrest, but as I stated there hasn't been an arrest/prosecution for simply carrying in a school zone since the law was put into place.

Oh okay. Thank you for the info! Hopefully the courts strike down this unconstitutional law and the whole thing becomes moot

 

[actaeon277]

Feds Jail Montana Man for Carrying Gun *Near* School | A Great Case for Constitutional Challenge​

 

[Thomas1969]

Feds Jail Montana Man for Carrying Gun *Near* School | A Great Case for Constitutional Challenge​

Dang that is ridiculous

 

[actaeon277]

Dang that is ridiculous

Yes.
It is.

Especially since I thought the court already ruled on that before, and now the guy still has to go through the system.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Yes.
It is.

Especially since I thought the court already ruled on that before, and now the guy still has to go through the system.

SCOTUS found the original 1990 law unconstitutional, IIRC congress tried to link education to interstate commerce. SCOTUS said that was too much of a stretch. So congress changed it to guns that move in/effect interstate commerce. To the best of my knowledge that hasn't been tested for constitutionality.

 

[actaeon277]

The guy was on a sidewalk... in his own yard.

 

[Thomas1969]

The guy was on a sidewalk... in his own yard.

The one silver lining in all of this is that it happened now while we have a relatively pro gun Supreme Court. Had this happened when Roberts and Kennedy were the swing votes that would decide the case that would have been awful

 

[dburgette]

A side note...Indiana did pass HB 1177 this year a few months ago. It allows firearms training for teachers. That is a big step in allowing guns on school grounds in the event of a school shooter. I had "heard" not confirmed that some resource officers aren't allowed to carry a firearm in schools. I don't know that to be true, though.

 

[DadSmith]

Gun-Free School Zones & Shootings Statistic (2023 Updated)

Get the facts about 'gun-free zones' and how they contribute to mass shootings in the United States - learn more! (statistics updated 2023)

ammo.com