Nope, only some. The rest of us are just wannabes....this is the internetz. Here we are all gods of war. lol
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GUN SNOBS
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For my 2 cents get what you can afford and shoot it. If you have problems with it get rid of it and move to something else. I have never had a problem with Beretta as for Glocks would never own one every time I have shot one it malfunctions and thats comming from 35 years LE experience. As for your .45's I have 2 Kimbers, 2 Springfields and like the Springfields better for half the money.
Well ahead of me Kid at 19 I owned a 870 and a hand me down bow and they worked just fine, to many people worry about what the other guy has, if yours work and your happy who really cares. As long as your weapon is reliable, who cares what the name or the finish is.....
grasshopperlegs
Marksman
The trouble with the high price guns is that they want you to use high price ammo. That doesn't make sense unless you make a lot of money. I also started out at your age and I had to save money so I could get a rifle to hunt with to help the family. There is a lot of different Brands out there and they all have the ups and downs in them. So get what you can afford and review them a little before you buy.
That kimber on layaway may not be as good as a hipoint in hand if you don't own any firearms.
But since you do, it's called impulse buying, you're too impatient to save up for the level of investment some guns require.
This is why people take pride in things they own. They likely didn't spend a couple months saving, more like a lifetime of hard work.
I could care less what someone can or can't afford. If they like it that's all that matters. My point is that my experience is exactly the opposite of the OP's. Lots of people can't handle the fact the some people like nice things and don't mind paying for it.
Strangely, this phenomenon doesn't seem to apply to automobiles. I could drive up in a 50k new truck and everyone would talk about how awesome it is and how they want to get one. Buy a $400 Leupold scope and they wig out. I work with a guy exactly like this.
I always have a hearty laugh at those who seemingly don't understand that glass in any form is a lot of money.
Guess they've never bought a telescope, microscope, binoculars, monoculars, or even eye glasses.
Made the mistake of cheaping out on glass once. First range trip with a box store red dot, and the front lens blew out of it and killed the electronics.
Learned my lesson, went used, grabbed an aimpoint m2 and it's been amazing ever since. Ran most of this time as well on the same battery it came with.
Only time cheap glass has worked well for me has been on combloc stuff, but again, still talking $200-400.
Leupold offers a lot of extremely affordable optics if you stop looking at tactical crap. Don't understand why someone wants to burn through paycheck after paycheck replacing blown out BSA red dots.
I earned my Sharpshooters card with a 1903 Swedish Mauser that I bought from sports authority for $70.00. There were lots of people who had 10 or 15 times as much money in their rifles as my swede cost that were still shooting marksman scores. Call me silly, but that kind of made it extra fun!
This happena on the higher end...some gun shop turd said my bushmaster was a turd...later found he was in getting his 2500 ar fixed the same day he was talking crap about my gun...i paid 676 and a 15 transfer fee...shot it a ton with no issues at all and traded for two xd..which i sold for 400 each if i recall...the main thing qith firearms is to get in the game...should have kept the bushy but if u dont get attached to stuff then u can getba lot more....started messing with this stuff a while back and now i have about 15 guns...and getting more...just enjoy where u are...take your tax return and do something cool with it
Been in your shoes of not having any money. We are finally getting better so we are buying guns as often as we can now. I will say you just have ignore the pricks my friend. Several shops lost our business with my wife's first purchase of her life. She was dead set on a 22lr pistol. 3 shops (not naming out of respect) told her she was not smart for wanting a 22 for a carry gun and told her she had to have something bigger. Now my school of thought is 1. a 22 is better than no gun at all, and 2. better to have several well aimed shots from a gun you can control good than to be all over the damn place with a bigger gun. Well a store did agree with our thinking and got our business. There are always going to be haters out there and you will just have to let it fall off your shoulder. I say at least you are able to buy something. something is better than nothing.
I have to agree with you except that I would far rather depend on my AK or DPMS than a Colt AR. My best friend has a Ranch Mini. Two of his friends came to his house to target with their COLT AR's - by the end of the day both Colts were jamming so often they put them away. His cheap Ranch never jammed or FTF 1 time. I have 3 Colt handguns - all stainless - My EDC is a Colt Double Eagle 45, I also have a King Cobra .357 and an Anaconda 44 Mag, love them but wouldn't have a Colt AR.
I do have a DPMS LR-308, Fit and finish is as good as any gun I own. Accuracy seem to be under 1/2 moa, haven't completely broke it in so aren't sure. I wouldn't trade it for any other brand -heads up! Son's wife has a Bushmaster AR. I have seen her shoot many rounds. Probably has 1500~ 2000 round count - I have never seen it jam or FTF. She is shooting well under 1 MOA - usually under 3/4" at 100 yds.
There are many reasons a firearm can be expensive - most of which have nothing to do with reliability. Fit and finish, surface appearance costs money - AK's are rougher than hell but probably the most reliably firearm made. (cheap too). Advertizing is expensive, Glock, S&W, Colt and some others spend millions - haven't seen an ad for Jennings or DPMS!\
I have a couple of Garands, also have a Russian SVD40. Difference in fit and finish is great, but the Rusky firearm is damn reliably. I don't disparage those who like Glocks - I admit they are reliably - I don't and won't own one. I do not like plastic firearms. Each to his own, but I know my wood and metal firearms (some of which are well over 75 years old) will still function and not "crack" or get brittle in another 50 or 100 years, never seen any functional plastic item yet that has held up for 40 years!
I have some real cheap guns that have NEVER failed including a Jennings 22 semi-auto. Bought the thing new at a gun show a few years ago. A dealer had a stack of them with a $60 price posted, as I walked by, I said "I'd pay $50 for that" and kept walking. He shouted at me and asked if I had my pink slip (when they still allowed instant sales to them), and said "you bought it". I said Ok, and pealed out $50. Took the thing to my sons house in the country and fed several different ammo brands from CCI to Russian, it fed and fired it all! Have ran several hundred rounds through it with zero problems.
Don't worry about it.
The truth is that some guns are junk, some are not, and everyone has a different opinion.
Not everyone is trying to be a snob when they say those things. Some of them are just trying to help others by stopping them from wasting money. It is almost always cheaper to buy right and buy once. Believe it or not, many people with expensive guns also have cheap guns and can provide honest advice on the quality of each of them. Its the people who own (or have owned) a wide variety of guns that can provide the best input. Like most things, until you have owned very high end things, you don't even have a concept of what makes them so good (and what is just hype). A great example is table saws. Someone who has never used anything other than a $200 Craftsman contractor saw probably has no idea why anyone would spend $1,500 on a Delta Unisaw. However someone who DOES have a Unisaw can also spot a less expensive contractor saw that is high quality because they know what they are looking for.
Me personally, I would choose to wait twice as long to buy if it means getting something better. There are a lot of good deals to be had for $200 (or at least used to be). My brother picked up a Sig P6 for <$200 and its an incredible gun for the price. I picked up a Star BM for $150 and it was REALLY nice. Then there is my brother's stainless Walther PPK that won't cycle a thing.
I guess my point is there are a lot of diamonds in the rough, some expensive junk, and some companies that are worthless.
I will agree there are a lot of people in the gun world who are willing to trash talk a company without having tried it first. Those people can be annoying, but just ignore them. Look for those who can speak from experience.
The truth is that some guns are junk, some are not, and everyone has a different opinion.
Not everyone is trying to be a snob when they say those things. Some of them are just trying to help others by stopping them from wasting money. It is almost always cheaper to buy right and buy once. Believe it or not, many people with expensive guns also have cheap guns and can provide honest advice on the quality of each of them. Its the people who own (or have owned) a wide variety of guns that can provide the best input. Like most things, until you have owned very high end things, you don't even have a concept of what makes them so good (and what is just hype). A great example is table saws. Someone who has never used anything other than a $200 Craftsman contractor saw probably has no idea why anyone would spend $1,500 on a Delta Unisaw. However someone who DOES have a Unisaw can also spot a less expensive contractor saw that is high quality because they know what they are looking for.
Me personally, I would choose to wait twice as long to buy if it means getting something better. There are a lot of good deals to be had for $200 (or at least used to be). My brother picked up a Sig P6 for <$200 and its an incredible gun for the price. I picked up a Star BM for $150 and it was REALLY nice. Then there is my brother's stainless Walther PPK that won't cycle a thing.
I guess my point is there are a lot of diamonds in the rough, some expensive junk, and some companies that are worthless.
I will agree there are a lot of people in the gun world who are willing to trash talk a company without having tried it first. Those people can be annoying, but just ignore them. Look for those who can speak from experience.
This sounds like a wise man and sound advice to me. You are a young man doing what you can to protect yourself and your family, and that makes you a hero to me. If the weapon is reliable in your hands, that is all that counts.
About this, I dont feel like I am a gun snob, but I do feel like I am comfortable in what guns I have chosen, and there are alot of firearms that I DO NOT feel comfortable to carry. Look, I am not coming aginst you, but you said you were open for conversation.
I think it is wonderful that you have made a choice to protect your family with firearms that you can afford. But just playing devils advocate here. For the most part, if you ask around, even the gun shop employees, they will tend to try to lead you away from hi points and cobras. Not because they want to make a big money sell, because most ALL OF US do not get paid on commision and get paid the same if you buy a cobra or a kimber. But because we get to see what comes back into the shop to be sent out for repair.
Just an idea here and take it or leave it, but why not look at a charter arms or other lower priced revolver? The thing is that if a semi auto fails, you may have one good shot (the one that was chambered). If a revolver fails to go boom, just squeeze the trigger again for another 4 or 5 shots that is readily available. If I was on a budget it would be a Used lower priced revolvers over a lower priced semi auto anyday.
I dont care what manufacture you buy, but just remeber that the life of your family and yourself is dependent on the firearm working or not.
So please fell 100% comfortable that your firearm will work.
If it is protecting your home and you have a choice to pick up the hi point or the Remington shotgun, which one would you pick up and why? Is it because you feel one is more likely to work better over the other?
If you feel comfortable with the firearm that you have chosen to work 100% then I say you need to stick with that, because that is rare.
I choose to believe that if you feel like your firearm will always work 100% no matter what, then you may be fooling yourself. All firearms sigs, glocks, wilson combats, ed browns, ect are nothing more than alot of moving parts with a lot of things that are able to go wrong. I feel comfortable in my firearms working 99% of the time, and for me that is good enough. But I think it is always important to train for the case that it does malfunction, and have a plain on how to either get out of the situation or get the gun back in the fight.
That is just my 2 cents in a conversation type of response.
I think it is wonderful that you have made a choice to protect your family with firearms that you can afford. But just playing devils advocate here. For the most part, if you ask around, even the gun shop employees, they will tend to try to lead you away from hi points and cobras. Not because they want to make a big money sell, because most ALL OF US do not get paid on commision and get paid the same if you buy a cobra or a kimber. But because we get to see what comes back into the shop to be sent out for repair.
Just an idea here and take it or leave it, but why not look at a charter arms or other lower priced revolver? The thing is that if a semi auto fails, you may have one good shot (the one that was chambered). If a revolver fails to go boom, just squeeze the trigger again for another 4 or 5 shots that is readily available. If I was on a budget it would be a Used lower priced revolvers over a lower priced semi auto anyday.
I dont care what manufacture you buy, but just remeber that the life of your family and yourself is dependent on the firearm working or not.
So please fell 100% comfortable that your firearm will work.
If it is protecting your home and you have a choice to pick up the hi point or the Remington shotgun, which one would you pick up and why? Is it because you feel one is more likely to work better over the other?
If you feel comfortable with the firearm that you have chosen to work 100% then I say you need to stick with that, because that is rare.
I choose to believe that if you feel like your firearm will always work 100% no matter what, then you may be fooling yourself. All firearms sigs, glocks, wilson combats, ed browns, ect are nothing more than alot of moving parts with a lot of things that are able to go wrong. I feel comfortable in my firearms working 99% of the time, and for me that is good enough. But I think it is always important to train for the case that it does malfunction, and have a plain on how to either get out of the situation or get the gun back in the fight.
That is just my 2 cents in a conversation type of response.
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Bleh. MOST of this "you can just TELL the difference" is hogwash. Rifles, handguns, table saws, cue sticks, watches - same same.
It's the man (or woman) behind it, and that's it and that's all. A man with a $500 rifle that CAN shoot is always gonna outshoot the man with the $5000 rifle that can't.
It's the same with most anything. Guys who don't TRULY have the skill sets try and make up for that lack of skill by buying more expensive (NOT necessarily better quality) gear. Doesn't work like that.
Sure, the guy that absolutely never misses a dime-sized target at any range (good luck finding him, LOL...) will do better than with that $5000 rifle. But, if you're lucky, in your lifetime ya might meet 2, maybe 3 people that good.
The V-A-S-T majority aren't. And the ones who are won't need, and probably won't have, a $5000 rifle.
MOST guns off the shelf are capable of 'outshooting' the guy who bought it.
Not sure what all the hatred is by some on the forum for Glocks, nor what the 'fanboy' rhetoric is about. If anything, I've seen a LOT more 'fanboys' all 'giggly' over 1911's. And worse, 1911 CLONES. And all because the Col. swore by 'em. Of course, that wasn't the ONLY bun the Colonel owned. And OF COURSE, they ALSO forget guys like Elmer Keith, Bill Jordan, et. al.
Get what FEELS right for ya, seems to just sort of 'sits there' on target that you can afford. Then shoot it until you can hit targets in your sleep, or half-asleep, or half in the bag, or standing on one foot and screaming like a chicken.
THEN you'll be good, and those yabos that OVERPAID for their guns (which is most people) won't be making fun of your gun.
They'll wanna BUY it. And then won't understand why they STILL can't hit a bull in the a$$ with a bassfiddle.
It's the man (or woman) behind it, and that's it and that's all. A man with a $500 rifle that CAN shoot is always gonna outshoot the man with the $5000 rifle that can't.
It's the same with most anything. Guys who don't TRULY have the skill sets try and make up for that lack of skill by buying more expensive (NOT necessarily better quality) gear. Doesn't work like that.
Sure, the guy that absolutely never misses a dime-sized target at any range (good luck finding him, LOL...) will do better than with that $5000 rifle. But, if you're lucky, in your lifetime ya might meet 2, maybe 3 people that good.
The V-A-S-T majority aren't. And the ones who are won't need, and probably won't have, a $5000 rifle.
MOST guns off the shelf are capable of 'outshooting' the guy who bought it.
Not sure what all the hatred is by some on the forum for Glocks, nor what the 'fanboy' rhetoric is about. If anything, I've seen a LOT more 'fanboys' all 'giggly' over 1911's. And worse, 1911 CLONES. And all because the Col. swore by 'em. Of course, that wasn't the ONLY bun the Colonel owned. And OF COURSE, they ALSO forget guys like Elmer Keith, Bill Jordan, et. al.
Get what FEELS right for ya, seems to just sort of 'sits there' on target that you can afford. Then shoot it until you can hit targets in your sleep, or half-asleep, or half in the bag, or standing on one foot and screaming like a chicken.
THEN you'll be good, and those yabos that OVERPAID for their guns (which is most people) won't be making fun of your gun.
They'll wanna BUY it. And then won't understand why they STILL can't hit a bull in the a$$ with a bassfiddle.
Screw the snobs.
I love my Glocks and M&P's but if that is out of your price range....for around $300-$350 you can get an ultra reliable and quality Kahr pistol. I suggest them to all of my budget minded customers, friends and families.
I know that Wilson Combat, Nighthawk Customs, Knights Armament, etc all make incredible firearms....but they could never worth 4-10 times a Glock or Spikes Tactical to me.
I love my Glocks and M&P's but if that is out of your price range....for around $300-$350 you can get an ultra reliable and quality Kahr pistol. I suggest them to all of my budget minded customers, friends and families.
I know that Wilson Combat, Nighthawk Customs, Knights Armament, etc all make incredible firearms....but they could never worth 4-10 times a Glock or Spikes Tactical to me.
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