Hiking .357 load combination

[Redhorse]

Hey everyone,

I recently purchased a Ruger LCRx in .357 with a 3-inch barrel to take with me on hikes. The Redhawk and SAA clone I was carrying were both a little too heavy, and a little too hard to conceal with an OWB holster, especially in hotter months. I'm hoping the LCRx will work better; it's definitely lighter to say the least! I've been doing some research for an efficient load combination but wanted to hear from other's experience/opinions as well. I was thinking the first shot or two should be CCI shot shells for snakes followed by .38 special, .38 +p, or .357 (I have some loaded to max 140 grain FTX Hornady). I do most of my hiking in the Midwest, mostly Indiana and Ohio, at least for now while I finish up graduate school.

Thanks in advance!

 

[natdscott]

One of the 158s, in front of 18 grains of 300MP.

A cylinder full.

Carry a speed strip with shot shells, on a biner on your belt.

 

[Jaybird1980]

Might want to shoot the shot shells to pattern them, so you know how capable they're.
I have never been impressed with them out of a pistol, for snake up close it may work.

 

[DadSmith]

Hey everyone,

I recently purchased a Ruger LCRx in .357 with a 3-inch barrel to take with me on hikes. The Redhawk and SAA clone I was carrying were both a little too heavy, and a little too hard to conceal with an OWB holster, especially in hotter months. I'm hoping the LCRx will work better; it's definitely lighter to say the least! I've been doing some research for an efficient load combination but wanted to hear from other's experience/opinions as well. I was thinking the first shot or two should be CCI shot shells for snakes followed by .38 special, .38 +p, or .357 (I have some loaded to max 140 grain FTX Hornady). I do most of my hiking in the Midwest, mostly Indiana and Ohio, at least for now while I finish up graduate school.

Thanks in advance!

https://www.underwoodammo.com/357-magnum-180-grain-lead-flat-nose-gas-check.html

Those ^ all 5 and as @natdscott said carry snake shot on a speed strip

 

[92FSTech]

My concern with a mixed snakeshot loadout is that if you don't end up shooting it first, there's a chance the capsule could jump crimp and jam up the gun. And now your 5 or 6 shooter is effectively a single-shot. Those things seems to hold up pretty well with the light recoil of other shot shells, but especially in light guns with heavy Magnum or +P loads, I've seen them work their way out.

That said, I became a believer in snake shot this summer, and wished I'd had some on me. We were in Utah hiking barefoot up a slickrock creek through a canyon in Grand Staircase Escalante National Monument. It was awesome....the most beautiful environment you can imagine. The water was cool, the bottom was smooth and solid, and it was like hiking up a shallow waterslide.

The two younger boys (5 and 7) were out front, followed by my oldest (13) and then me and my wife. We were watching trout dart all over the place and around our legs, and had just entered a narrow portion of the creek that was only about 3 feet wide, with a sheer cliff going up on one side, and some foliage and grass on the other. My oldest suddenly yelled "Snake!" and jumped back towards me.

I looked, and sure enough a snake had been lying in the grass on the bank and had struck into the water and grabbed a fish basically right between my son's legs. It was now lying partially on the bank and partially in the water, with a fish in it's mouth, and the fish wasn't moving or flopping around at all, leading me to believe that the thing was definitely venemous (we later looked it up and are pretty sure it was a Lyre snake, which is venemous).

The little boys who were about 20 feet upstream immediately panicked and jumped up onto a rock. My other son and wife were freaking out because we were downstream and if the snake came into the water, it was coming right for us. I figured it was probably preoccupied with it's fish and wasn't too interested in us, but I wasn't dying to test that theory, either.

I had my S&W 360 on me, but it was loaded with +P JHP, and the snake was between me and my two younger sons, and even though I probably could have angled myself to get them out of the line of fire, I didn't feel real comfortable shooting in their direction, especially with the rocky environment and potential for ricochet. I was also concerned that a hit that was not immediately lethal would send the snake into the water and right at us...which seemed worse than what it was currently doing sucking on its fish.

I ended up telling my oldest to watch the snake and let me know if it moved at all, then I went downstream a bit, climbed out onto the bank, gave the snake a wide berth, got upstream and retrieved the two younger boys from their rock and we made our way back to the others on the bank, again giving the snake his space. He never moved...I think he was quite satisfied with his fish.

We turned around and went back...sadly that was the end of the river hike for the day. I'm glad nobody got bit, and I'm glad we were able to leave without having to shoot it...but it definitely underscored the benefit of snakeshot in certain circumstances. Had I had to shoot it, I would have been far more confident in my ability to make a lethal hit, and been a lot less concerned about the potential for a ricochet off the rocks to seriously injure one of my sons.

As to a loadout, I guess it depends on the circumstances and what you're most likely to encounter. Personally, in the future I plan to carry snakeshot on a speed strip to have as an option. Snakes are easily avoided if you see them...if you don't, they're fast enough that it's not going to matter...you're not going to outdraw a snake.

In my situation above, there was plenty of time after the initial contact that I could have reloaded with snakeshot if I'd had to dispatch it to get to the younger boys. But if it had actually been after my son instead of the fish, he'd have gotten bit and there's nothing anybody could have done about it snakeshot or otherwise. We never saw it coming until it was already over.

If for some reason I felt it absolutely necessary to carry a mixed load, I'd probably have the first one be snake shot and the others all JHP, and plan to just shoot the snakeshot with a quick follow-up shot of JHP if I was dealing with something bigger than a snake.

Another option is a second airweight revolver...one for snakes and one for bigger stuff...if you want to deal with carrying 2. I could see doing this around the farm or something like that...on a high-milage backpacking or hiking trip, though, I'm all about saving weight and won't be carrying 2 guns.

 

[Amishman44]

I more of a fan of carrying the same load in every cylinder in a revolver...instead of having to 'scroll' through and find the right load for the right application! I prefer .357 magnum as a hiking caliber, but have carried .45 Colt and .454 Casull when needed. In my 3" SP101, I prefer a 170 grain cast load from Buffalo Bore. In a GP100, I prefer a 200 grain cast load from Buffalo Bore Ammo. I've also carried a variety of Littlestone's Ammo as well!

 

[mike4]

Reinforcing some good advice above. Out West I would estimate the odds of needing to suddenly shoot a snake are at least 100x less than suddenly needing to shoot one or more persons in self-defense (because avoidance is a follow-on option to detection). In Indiana and Ohio the odds are probably 1000x due to the limited number of poisonous snakes, with even less chance as you go north. I've run across snakes only two times on trails in Indiana, one fairly large but non-poisonous with absolutely no reason to harm it. As 92FSTech observes, unless you are struck immediately by surprise, it's extremely unlikely that you can't simply walk around or displace a poisonous snake in the rare event you come across one.

That makes it outright irrational to reduce an already very low effective round count of 5, to 3 or even 4, plus the added delay to bring the "real" rounds to bear. Worrying more about bad people, I would go with a heavier (like 158 grain) JHP in .357 if you find you can handle the recoil well at the range, otherwise the same in .38 +P. Many people have an innate fear of snakes (which makes some sense to encourage your survival by avoidance) which you have to look beyond to assess that threat objectively.

I'd be very concerned about possible charges for killing any snake on state or federal parks and lands. I'd only shoot one in any location if there was an ongoing threat due to their proximity to your camp, children or pets. I also know they are so prolific in other parts of the country that folks will understandably kill those that get too close to buildings, livestock, pets, etc. on their own property. 92FSTech again for the win, as you can back away, reload snake shot from a speedstrip and then take care of business.

Where snakes might be a bigger issue, or you just want the peace of mind of a reliable option to deal with them, a good length stout hiking staff provides the options for gently relocating them, pinning them down while you pass which may result in injury to them, or just plain beating them to death if they are poisonous and taunt you inappropriately. That is also quiet and does not launch a ranger or law enforcement investigation into reports of gunfire.

 

[gmcttr]

I'm sorry but I just do not understand so many people's thoughts that they will need to kill a snake in the great outdoors.

If you have seen the snake, just step away and leave it alone. If you have time to draw a gun and fire, you have plenty of time to take a step away.

Even in the example above, once the snake was spotted, everyone had the choice to go around. Also it was thought to be a Lyre snake, a "mildly venomous, rear-fanged snake" that would pose little thread to humans. Rear fanged snakes would have difficulty injecting venom into something all large as a childs leg.

Short version, just leave the snakes alone. Observe them and enjoy them.

 

[92FSTech]

Short version, just leave the snakes alone. Observe them and enjoy them.

I'm not a big fan of snakes, and while I don't know about the "enjoy" them part, I do agree with the underlying sentiment...I'm not going to go out of my way to kill something that is doing is own thing in its own environment and posing no threat to me or mine. Even snakes.

That said, had there not been the option to go around and the snake posed an immediate danger to my kids or myself, I'd have dispatched it with a clear conscience, rear-fanged or not.

 

[Amishman44]

I'm sorry but I just do not understand so many people's thoughts that they will need to kill a snake in the great outdoors.
If you have seen the snake, just step away and leave it alone. If you have time to draw a gun and fire, you have plenty of time to take a step away.
Even in the example above, once the snake was spotted, everyone had the choice to go around.
Also, it was thought to be a Lyre snake, a "mildly venomous, rear-fanged snake" that would pose little threat to humans. Rear fanged snakes would have difficulty injecting venom into something all large as a child's leg.
Short version, just leave the snakes alone. Observe them and enjoy them.

I concur...99% of the time, just leave a snake alone because that's what the snake wants too!
I've only ever ran into two (2) snakes while out in nature, once in GA, while jogging with my dog (the dog was slightly ahead of me on a leash and the snake sprang away from him) and once while kayaking with the family in southern MI there was a black water snake sunning itself on a log.
We sat in our kayaks and observed it for a short bit and then carried on our way!

 

[Skullglide]

I carry a 3” GP100 .357 a lot while hiking. Federal 180 JHP or Underwood 180 HC or Grizzly 200 HC.

 

[Steve]

I agree with the idea of "live and let live". While you should always be aware of your surroundings, spotting a snake can be difficult at best in wooded or rough terrain. And I guarantee you that more snakes have spotted you then you have them. And 99.9% of the time, they have no interest in you.

My choice of snake loads in my S&W 60 snubbie is 5, 357 HydraShock SJHP for the "2 legged snakes" I might encounter on the trail or campsite.

 

[DadSmith]

On property if its a copperhead it dies on sight. In the woods no big deal. I have several black snakes on property that have lived here for years. A few black snakes live in the out buildings taking care of the mice etc.


She is about 8' long now. This picture is her above my front door.

Reason I don't allow copperheads on property is grandchildren and the copperhead is much more aggressive/defensive.

 

[G192127]

I use cci shotshells in my s&w 340,2 in bbl. First 2 rounds are shotshells, then 3 critical defense. I got time too roll the cylinder.

 

[CB1911]

135 grain Speer Gold Dot Short Barrel loads in 38+p or 357 magnum.

 

[Redhorse]

I think it's important to say I'm not deathly afraid of snakes nor looking to shoot the first one I see, I was just looking for insight in the unlikely event I'd need to shoot one and round combinations. Based on what's been posted, its looking like a better way to go is to carrying some shot shells in a speed strip. I also have some .357 158 JHPs that should work for carrying in the chamber.

 

[randyb]

Just my 0.02 worth. I used to carry shot loads until I had one move forward and bind the cylinder. IF I loaded one it would be the 1st shot only. With the rest of the cylinder being either 148 wadcutters, the FBI load 158 hollowpoints+P or now my preferred load the CCI 130 grain HST load. I really preferr that last load for the whole cylinder and walk with a hiking stick..

 

[OurDee]

I've taken snakes with 45acp, 22 lr, rakes, hoes, mowers, dogs, and bare handed. I never used shotshells for snakes. They are like a bunny target in archery, how do you miss. Cleared a patch in Tennessee where one person would take 2 swipes with the sythe and step back. 2 other guys would step up with hoes and kill a copperhead. Did that all day. Cooked a lot of snakes that day. My advice is just carry bullets and a walking stick.

 

[92FSTech]

Handgun shotshells do have some advantages beyond making it easier to hit things with a wide pattern. They also have very limited penetration and very limited travel, so they are much safer to use in or around your house than a solid projectile. I have some .22 shotshells that I've tested on a single-layer piece of 3/8 drywall, and they wouldn't penetrate. But they work great for killing chipmunks or mice that are trying to eat their way into my house or chewing on my truck wiring. And if you somehow do miss, you don't have to worry about a projectile hitting and damaging anything more than a few yards downrange. This is admittedly less of a concern for snakes which typically tend to be on the ground (but not always, which is a thought that I REALLY don't like!), but for dealing with some other types of critters those things can be a major factor.

 

[snapping turtle]

If you decide to go full 357 in revolver shoot it at night in the dark. shot a skunk in my mother in law trash can. (She liked to feed the neighbor hood cats) flash was very bright and I could not see for a good few second after the flash. In my ten inch barreled contender no issues. No cylinder gap long enough barrel to burn much more powder. In the 2 1/2 in model 66 the flash was excessive but they did shoot very well accuracy wise. The flash at the range was no issue. At night it was very bright