Hogsett Administration is Closing Eagle Creek Pistol Range in Indy

[IndyGunFreak]

Next, MCFG.

Sadly... I'd bet you're right.

Elections have consequences. You put a Liberal in office, they're going to do Liberal things. I'd only been to Eagle Creek a couple of times, but I'm still sad to hear this happened.

 

[actaeon277]

I remember years ago on this very forum, people ranting that public libraries were a form of socialism and needed shut down.

Judging all of INGO by Hornydl?

It's on Fox News right now..
I believe they stated citizen attendance is down 80%

2012-2015 down 80% sure didn't seem like it

I haven't been there, but every other range I've been seems more crowded, not less.

Nor do I. I know its a wild concept, but politicians should be doing everything for the people's benefit, but it is always for their own.

Truth

 

[cbhausen]

I can guarantee a real SHTF situation if somehow the Hog**** Administration found a way to shut down MCF&G but I don't see that happening. Maybe someone with knowledge of MCF&G's risk could weigh in here...

 

[Vigilant]

I've used Eagle Creek, exactly ONE time, but that is because I needed to meet Phylodog to complete a sale! Mayor Hogwild is there, because democrats vote even after death, and Repugnants won't vote if they don't like their candidates' shoes! Add to that the "third" party folks, who do nothing but assure dead Democrats' votes are counted thrice, instead of twice. Guy is a lawyer, and known for taking up 2nd cases, so, if he isn't planning to sue for breach of contract, or terminal stupid(if you can sue for that), it's the fault of the Repugnant voters, and the Libertarian/3rd party dreamers, that this has happened. Hopefully, there is some arcane, obscure, never used Federal Code attached to the funding of this range that will give Huganut pause enough to reopen the range to the public! That will probably involve a 2nd friendly para-legal to do the research, and bring it up. But, I digress, those who want things given vote for those who give, those who want to use what they paid for, choose not to vote!

 

[Dim Mak]

Hogsett is such a douche.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I remember years ago on this very forum, people ranting that public libraries were a form of socialism and needed shut down.

A banned former member was ranting.

They aren't shutting down the range, the City is prohibiting the owners from using it but letting itself full access.

 

[MemphisR32]

According to the segment on Fox last night there is a fed code this move is in breach of. Something about federal funds were used for improvements or something.

 

[eldirector]

According to the segment on Fox last night there is a fed code this move is in breach of. Something about federal funds were used for improvements or something.

Correct. Info posted up-thread a bit.

My contact at IndyParks said:

Sounds like the range was losing money. Attendance was down from 5,000 to 700 in the past 4 years. So, it was totally a budget/economical decision.

I wonder how much income other city parks bring in, vs. the expense of running them?

 

[ajeandy]

 

[Kutnupe14]

Guy just tweeted the letter earlier today. Apparently the excuse was the Controller "forgot" to sign the contract for the 2017 extension. Contracts are not binding without that signature. So instead of fixing the problem by signing it, (or having everybody resign a new contract) they used that excuse to simply drop it.

As one person commented "I wonder how many other contracts are out there that the Controller "forgot" to sign as an escape clause in case they get buyers remorse?"

Its not the parks dept after all if that is the case. Its the administration/city deciding they dont agree with the prior administration's contract, and are using this error to weasel out of it.

https://twitter.com/guyrelford?ref_src=twsrc^google|twcamp^serp|twgr^author

There's one glaring issue here... do I need to say it?

 

[T.Lex]

There's one glaring issue here... do I need to say it?

Not sure if this is the one you're mentioning, but they second reason is the real reason: they just didn't want to have TFT run it. They may be closing it off from the public (likely in violation of the fed grant and perhaps an ordinance from back in the day), or there may be a Dem organization interested in "running" it, and this is just low level back-scratching.

The controller thing is both a smoke screen and a dig at the prior administration for doing it "wrong." They are giving the 10 day notice under the contract, which is apparently (I haven't seen the contract) all they have to do. Of course, I feel bad that Guy and TFT is losing the contract, but I also have to wonder if working for this administration may have ended up being more of a PITA than it was worth.

 

[T.Lex]

By the way, in terms of the federal grant, they could keep the "land" open to the public for tours of the IMPD facility or something, and probably satisfy the requirement. I don't believe there was a requirement that it was an obligation to operate the range as a range for the public.

Yeah yeah yeah, lawyers suck.

 

[GuyRelford]

From 39 CFR Sec. 59.3 (interpreting the Land and Water Conservation Fund Act, under which Indy received the grant for ECPR):

Section 6(f)(3) of the L&WCF Act is the cornerstone of Federal compliance efforts to ensure that the Federal investments in L&WCF assistance are being maintained in public outdoor recreation use. This section of the Act assures that once an area has been funded with L&WCF assistance, it is continually maintained in public recreation use unless NPS approves substitution property of reasonably equivalent usefulness and location and of at least equal fair market value.

Key terms: "public recreation use" and "equivalent usefulness."

Guy

 

[HoughMade]

...Yeah yeah yeah, lawyers suck.

Yeah, but my kids need to go to college too.....private colleges.

 

[1775usmarine]

I guess the city hates getting some tax money who would of thought.

 

[LeeStreet]

The proper spelling of the Mayor's name is Hogshett.

 

[T.Lex]

From 39 CFR Sec. 59.3 (interpreting the Land and Water Conservation Fund Act, under which Indy received the grant for ECPR):

Key terms: "public recreation use" and "equivalent usefulness."

Guy

Right. Other guidelines talk about "public recreation values" and "access to the public."

According to articles from newspapers.com, the land was originally park land that was converted to city use. (Indy Star, August 13, 1978.) The State withheld funds unless the city either replaced the park land with comparable or opened the range for public use. At the time of the original grant, though, it was a park. The problem then was "No trespassing" signs that had been put up around the range.

Later that year, IPD actually moved to Franklin Township for a pistol range.

In 1981, the discussion was that the range would have to be open to the public 50% of the time. Seems like the City backed off of that "requirement" a LONG time ago.

Still seems like lots of gray area for Hogsett to come up with some "public access" and "public recreation value" that still isn't a firearm range.

Plus, who's going to litigate this? The state administrator of the LWCF money? Better hope Gregg doesn't get elected.

 

[Denny347]

From 39 CFR Sec. 59.3 (interpreting the Land and Water Conservation Fund Act, under which Indy received the grant for ECPR):



Key terms: "public recreation use" and "equivalent usefulness."

Guy

So would opening it up to public access Sundays 4pm to 6pm satisfy that? Just an example for arguments sake.

 

[halfmileharry]

The proper spelling of the Mayor's name is Hogshett.

"I" see what you did there

 

[bgcatty]

This is what happens gun owners do not go out and vote for friendly 2A candidates. By that I mean non-democrats! Pretty soon IN will look like IL vis-a-vis 2A restrictions.