How does this happen? Buys stolen gun from retailer?

[BehindBlueI's]

Few things:

FFLs don't have access to NCIC data in the stolen database.

There is no federal registry of stolen guns. There are multiple local repositories for stolen guns (and other stolen items) information and a federal system that lets you query all those various databases simultaneously. This is an important distinction, as no one entity controls the entry of information.

Being handcuffed is not being arrested. "Knowingly and intentionally" still applies, and 8 years later proving the guy knew it was stolen is probably impossible UNLESS he was named as a suspect originally, it was stolen from his ex-wife or someone he had an existing relationship with, etc.

 

[Gravyman]

Like the others said the guy has nothing to worry about. I'm more impressed with the balls on the guy that sold a stolen gun to an FFL. Can't be that hard to track it back down to him

 

[bwframe]

Like the others said the guy has nothing to worry about. I'm more impressed with the balls on the guy that sold a stolen gun to an FFL. Can't be that hard to track it back down to him

What if the seller to the FFL didn't know? I know a lot of folks who trade a bit, who are solid good folks that might never know that their private sale acquired guns were stolen.


.

 

[HoughMade]

The first and only criminal case I tried was a "receiving stolen property case". You have to have actual knowledge it was stolen. It's not a crime to merely possess something that was stolen without knowledge that it is stolen.

The state has to prove knowledge. The defendant doesn't have to disprove it.

 

[DadSmith]

Few things:

FFLs don't have access to NCIC data in the stolen database.

There is no federal registry of stolen guns. There are multiple local repositories for stolen guns (and other stolen items) information and a federal system that lets you query all those various databases simultaneously. This is an important distinction, as no one entity controls the entry of information.

Being handcuffed is not being arrested. "Knowingly and intentionally" still applies, and 8 years later proving the guy knew it was stolen is probably impossible UNLESS he was named as a suspect originally, it was stolen from his ex-wife or someone he had an existing relationship with, etc.

You are wrong I watched CSI Miami, and they can access everything in just a few minutes time.

 

[DadSmith]

The first and only criminal case I tried was a "receiving stolen property case". You have to have actual knowledge it was stolen. It's not a crime to merely possess something that was stolen without knowledge that it is stolen.

The state has to prove knowledge. The defendant doesn't have to disprove it.

I know a guy that bought a chainsaw from a man who later was sent up for dozens of theft charges from dozens of peoples homes.
He called the local Sheriff's department and gave them the serial number from the saw and ask if it was a stolen item. They told him it had not been reported.
So does that clear him if anything happens to come back on him?

 

[HoughMade]

I know a guy that bought a chainsaw from a man who later was sent up for dozens of theft charges from dozens of peoples homes.
He called the local Sheriff's department and gave them the serial number from the saw and ask if it was a stolen item. They told him it had not been reported.
So does that clear him if anything happens to come back on him?

I wouldn't use the term "clear". I would say that his action in checking and him being told it's not on a list is very good evidence that he does not believe (know) it to be stolen.

 

[DadSmith]

I wouldn't use the term "clear". I would say that his action in checking and him being told it's not on a list is very good evidence that he does not believe (know) it to be stolen.

If it comes up later, at least they know where to recover the stolen property. I think he did the right thing.

 

[Hookeye]

To declare an item stolen one must have identification (serial number).

If you dont know what that is, the cops aint gonna know either.

Keep an up to date list in your safe.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

To declare an item stolen one must have identification (serial number).

If you dont know what that is, the cops aint gonna know either.

Keep an up to date list in your safe.

Respectfully, keeping it in the safe is likely counterproductive as if your guns are stolen the safe probably was as well (unless you're a 'truck gun' kind of guy).

I keep mine electronically. I use an Excel spreadsheet which I update and then email myself as needed, so I always have access to it even without reliance on any physical thing. Prior to technology being so easy to access I used notecards in a bank safety deposit box, but that's as quaint as clay tablets now...

 

[VostocK]

Respectfully, keeping it in the safe is likely counterproductive as if your guns are stolen the safe probably was as well (unless you're a 'truck gun' kind of guy).

I keep mine electronically. I use an Excel spreadsheet which I update and then email myself as needed, so I always have access to it even without reliance on any physical thing. Prior to technology being so easy to access I used notecards in a bank safety deposit box, but that's as quaint as clay tablets now...

I've taken photos of all my guns and corresponding serial numbers and upload them to the cloud into a folder just for my guns. I'm too lazy to update a spreadsheet. Now when I buy new guns I just snap a couple pics of the gun and then take a picture of the tag that comes on the box. Your post made me think I should also upload that same index of photos to a separate email account in case I ever lose access to the main storage account.

 

[duanewade]

I've taken photos of all my guns and corresponding serial numbers and upload them to the cloud into a folder just for my guns. I'm too lazy to update a spreadsheet. Now when I buy new guns I just snap a couple pics of the gun and then take a picture of the tag that comes on the box. Your post made me think I should also upload that same index of photos to a separate email account in case I ever lose access to the main storage account.

This ^^^^ is what I do for every gun I own. If I trade or sell a gun I still keep the pictures and numbers of that gun.

If I'm buying a gun from a private party I run the serial number here https://www.hotgunz.com/search.php to give me a little sanity in me knowing that at the time of purchase that the gun is not stolen.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[grillak]

This ^^^^ is what I do for every gun I own. If I trade or sell a gun I still keep the pictures and numbers of that gun.

If I'm buying a gun from a private party I run the serial number here https://www.hotgunz.com/search.php to give me a little sanity in me knowing that at the time of purchase that the gun is not stolen.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

thanks for that link. i have never heard of that site.

 

[Hookeye]

FWIW I keep electonic and hard copies of my serial numbers. As for theft of my safe......could happen.

Believe most stuff that goes missing hasnt been secured.

Opportunists, not targeted.

But yeah, theres an E copy of my stuff just in case.

Having been around this culture- shops, shows shoots....the avg gun owner doesnt have a list

 

[DadSmith]

Respectfully, keeping it in the safe is likely counterproductive as if your guns are stolen the safe probably was as well (unless you're a 'truck gun' kind of guy).

I keep mine electronically. I use an Excel spreadsheet which I update and then email myself as needed, so I always have access to it even without reliance on any physical thing. Prior to technology being so easy to access I used notecards in a bank safety deposit box, but that's as quaint as clay tablets now...

My insurance agent told me many years ago to take a picture of the firearm and serial number, along with scope and other attachment information, and store it online, and on a thumb drive in a high heat rated fireproof box.
That way the adjuster can easily see the rifle and serial number, as well as accessories.

 

[BE Mike]

Unfortunately, AFAIK, FFL's don't have access to the FBI's stolen firearm's database, so this is bound to happen. I sure wouldn't want to have a hot gun in my possession and for a number of reasons have the serial number checked by a law enforcement officer. I would think it would be a big can of worms, and a headache even if everything turned out ok for me in the end.

 

[Farmerjon]

This ^^^^ is what I do for every gun I own. If I trade or sell a gun I still keep the pictures and numbers of that gun.

If I'm buying a gun from a private party I run the serial number here https://www.hotgunz.com/search.php to give me a little sanity in me knowing that at the time of purchase that the gun is not stolen.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

Did not know this existed. Thank you!

 

[Leo]

I bought a stolen pistol at a legitimate gun store.

We did not know it was stolen, I shot it and carried it around the country for a couple years, and traded it back to the same dealer. He then sold it again and the new owner somehow found that it was stolen.

The County deputies investigated the store, who showed he got it from me. Then I got a knock on the door. Luckily, I still had the receipt that showed I bought it from the store. The shop was then able to back up in his bound book to where he got it to start with. It was originally traded in by the brother of the man who reported it as stolen. The shop owner was very apologetic that he had forgotten that he was the one that originally sold it to me.

 

[Route 45]

It was my assumption that when you went thru an FFL it was to make sure the fire arm was not stolen.

So a private seller/buyer insisting it goes thru an FFL has no additional info on if the gun is stolen or not. Kind of puts shade on some one insisting on it for a private sale.

Don

The background check is for the buyer, not for the gun.

 

[Ingomike]

You are wrong I watched CSI Miami, and they can access everything in just a few minutes time.

May be purple but for many is true...

7 Ways the CSI Effect is Altering Our Courtrooms (For Better and For Worse)

What is the CSI effect and how is it changing the legal system? Click to learn the pros and cons.

www.rasmussen.edu