HR.1565 - billed as HOUSE version of SA.715 Toomey-Schumer-Manchin ...

[brotherbill3]

From Pop Vox Main "Firearms and Gun Control" page list:

The POPVOX Blog
Issue Spotlight: Firearms and Gun Controlby rachna on May 5, 2013

Issue Spotlight: Firearms and Gun Control
5/5/13: Last month, the Senate shelved its planned for a vote on Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid's Safe Communities, Safe Schools Act, which would ensure that all individuals who should be prohibited from buying a firearm are listed in the national instant criminal background check system and require a background check for every firearm sale. As part of this, the Senate had also considered the bipartisan compromise known as the Toomey-Manchin Amendment, which was opposed by 45 Senators.

Senator Manchin, however, is now working to make changes to his Amendment to garner the support of additional Senators -- and to beat a filibuster. And meanwhile, the House version of this compromise has more than 100 cosponsors.

The "house version" on the site is a LINK to HR.1565 - which is relatively NEW - and I started reviewing ... more on it later.
LINK is: https://www.popvox.com/bills/us/113/hr1565

My guess is:
1) It is sponsored by Rep. Peter King - R.ino-NY (2 - Long Island) and 6 other D's including McCarthy (NY) ...
2) It is either straight up SA715 (T-S-M) amendment (BAD) ... or even closer to raw S.649 (WORSE)

It is being "pushed" currently by the MDA4GS / MAIG groups - so that tell me "BAD" all around.

Time to start pushing the House side of things more. ...

More complete review to follow later, (unless someone else wants to help w/ the leg work) I was gonna start w/ a line-by-line compare of T-S-M vs. HR.1565 (just to be sure of what it says). While I am sure it is bad - I want solid factual arguing points. not speculation and tin-foil-hat stuff. (In addition to swaying Politicians, I want to sway and engage more 'fence sitters').


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[jkfletcher]

Maybe I am not understanding correctly, but how is something that didn't make it out of the Senate suddenly in the House?

 

[Mango]

Maybe I am not understanding correctly, but how is something that didn't make it out of the Senate suddenly in the House?

That's how bills are supposed to start. House the Senate then President.

 

[sharkey]

Maybe I am not understanding correctly, but how is something that didn't make it out of the Senate suddenly in the House?

To quote Albus Dumbledore: "It is important to fight, and fight again, and keep fighting, for only then can evil be kept at bay, though never quite eradicated."

The enemies of Liberty will never stop, but will return day after day in furious assault on our People, Country and Constitution. The groups conspiring to overturn the Republic will not allow failures to deter them from trying to get what they want.

 

[Hoosier8]

Sent my letter but it goes to Andre Carson so that is like sending extra toilet paper.

 

[Smokepole]

That's how bills are supposed to start. House the Senate then President.

Only Bills that deal with raising Revenue (taxes or otherwise) are required to first be introduced in the House of Representatives. Bills addressing anything else may be introduced in either House. Article 1 section 7.

 

[KG1]

Sent my letter but it goes to Andre Carson so that is like sending extra toilet paper.

Yeah. You should've just wrote it on toilet paper because you know it's gonna get flushed.

 

[Mango]

Only Bills that deal with raising Revenue (taxes or otherwise) are required to first be introduced in the House of Representatives. Bills addressing anything else may be introduced in either House. Article 1 section 7.

I understand that, but the way it is supposed to work is that bills originate in the house. Schoolhouse Rock, March 27th 1973


Implied purple

 

[brotherbill3]

... ok firstly ... there are duplicate / companion bills for virtually every piece of gun legislation in both chambers of congress (i.e. 1 in senate, 1 in house) ... and several have died and have been duplicated and reintroduced with some minor revisions to start the process over ... so fighting for gun rights will probably never end at this point. I think the SHES murders in December ended any illusion of a 'break' you'll ever get from fighting this again. ...

Now on to the more important stuff:

OK ...

I used PopVox (which give the option to download a PDF of the bills) and scrolled thru HR.1565, and HR.1605, and the T-S-M Amendment (SA.715 to S.649) ...

Summary: after the opening pre-amble and addition of an Index - HR.1565 is "IDENTICAL" - verbatim (no not memorex)
to HR.1605 ...

There are 3 Sections (Titles) in HR.1565 (which seems to be the promoted version of the two HR versions)
Title (section) I - has to do with NICS incentives and 'protecting' veterans on the list or from being added ... and making sure the rest of us don't get the same protections (HIPPA doesn't prevent Dr. from sending info to NICS) ...

I feel like I've read this some where before; but it could be a compilation of other things

Kirk? BoR? Sgt.P? Anybody?

Titles (sections) II and III appear to be directly word for work the T-S-M amendment - This was harder to check as I had to copy to a word doc and the format made scanning for alterations a lot tougher.

you can look up all the reasons it is bad in the thread(s) related to the activity on the TSM stuff already created. (I'm not even going to attempt to link all of these)

I don't know that anyone in the house has attempted to get SA.725 into a format there (that was the Grassley Cruz version of the "Compromise") which helped kill the worse stuff in the Senate.

So anyway: Get busy busy send send - and if you want to - vote 2x via pop vox - vote on HR.1565 and HR.1605 ...

 

[T2D4]

i want all mentally-handicapped or otherwise ill people to be able to own guns. it's good for society.

 

[The Bubba Effect]

i want all mentally-handicapped or otherwise ill people to be able to own guns. it's good for society.

No way! I want to be able to decide who is fit to own guns. I know what's best for everyone.

 

[pokersamurai]

i want all mentally-handicapped or otherwise ill people to be able to own guns. it's good for society.

OK Mr.smartguy, you tell me, who in this country deserves to have their constitutionally protected rights to protect themselves and their families stripped away for societies benefit?

* You already mentioned mentally-handicapped and "ill" people, but why stop there? Anyone ever sent to jail should have their rights stripped, they are to unstable. How about all Black people, after all they are all just scarry gang-bangers right? We can't forget about the Jews, I don't know what the deal is with them, but if you ask me they are definitely up to something. And Women! We can't forget the women. They are to emotional to own guns, when it's that-time-of-the-month there will not be a man in the country safe from their hail of bullets?

So how about it T2D4, did I miss anyone else? After all, it should be up the the few "educated, civilized, elite" to determine what rights we give to which peasants.







*disclaimer: In case anyone couldn't tell, this post is dripping with sarcasm.

 

[Hoosier8]

Here is the real deal. Everything that people want to stop is already illegal.

 

[24Carat]

i want all mentally-handicapped or otherwise ill people to be able to own guns. it's good for society.

Bloomberg shill warning !!

 

[Two-Tornadoes]

Email sent to rep.

Thanks for keeping us up to date on the 2A issues.

 

[brotherbill3]

OK everyone - the push has begun on this. - so here is the "BUMP" ... get on it if you aren't.

I found that the MDA4GS is pushing this / getting signatures this weekend locally.
Also - I was checking Rep. Brooks FB Page - she had at least 4 - 6 messages on there to support this. - IF you are on Facebook - make sure to push opposing this to (all of?) the representatives.

I've used PopVox and sent letters - as follows - and I will continue. ... if you live in Dist 7 (carson) feel free to send messages to S.Brooks (dist 5) as well as others. E-mail may NOT be possible on this one - Reps e-mails seem to be more protected by their districts ... If I figure a way out around it (like a reply address) - I'll let you know.

But we need to be heard - the HOUSE (BEENIE Dunce) Leader - may decide to 'do something' ... instead of 'letting it go' ...

Letter I sent today (based on my fast read before):


I oppose H.R. 1565: Public Safety and Second Amendment Rights Protection Act of 2013. This is virtually identical legislation to the Toomey-Schumer-Manchin Amendment (SA.715 to S.649). There are number of reasons to oppose this.
First, while the newly added title adds some level of due process for veterans, the remaining legislation leaves "Loop-holes" for citizens. All who are placed on the prohibited list deserve the protection of due process under the law. This is a fundamental principal of our country.
Similarly, the technicalities for which such background checks are required under this legislation, creates 'traps' (loopholes in reverse) for law abiding citizens. This is evident by the misstatements of Sen. Manchin in "selling" his proposal, where he was corrected in the legal application by Sen. Cruz.
Also, while the current form prohibits a registry, this can easily be revised by the 'future' legislation; as every concession made in the past, on gun ownership, has become the 'loop-hole' for the next cause or step toward disarmament of America.
I urge your strongest opposition to this measure, and all similar infringements.
Thank you,
Your Constituent

 

[SERparacord]

i want all mentally-handicapped or otherwise ill people to be able to own guns. it's good for society.

Good job, stick up for yourself.

 

[CathyInBlue]

Letting criminals and the criminally insane have guns in a nation full of law abiding gun owners is the surest way to thin out the population of criminals and the criminally insane.

 

[sharkey]

Letting criminals and the criminally insane have guns in a nation full of law abiding gun owners is the surest way to thin out the population of criminals and the criminally insane.

Which is a much better idea than the Obama-Feinstein-Kelly plan of letting criminals and the criminally insane have guns in a nation full of unarmed and helpless law abiding subjects.