I want a mill & lathe

[Frank_N_Stein]

Do you have a "Maker" Co-Op around there? One here in Ft Wayne has Machine Shop, Wood Working etc. Small Fee to join and lots of folks to answer Questions.

RUCKUS

 

[CountryBoy19]

Learning to operate manual machines has more draw to me than CNC. I just don't think I'd get the sense of pride having a computer control everything for me. I'm pretty handy with Google Sketchup and my Son tells me that if I can swing that I wouldn't have an issue learning a CAD program.

I'd like to have both eventually but a lathe would be my first purchase if I end up going down this road. I know the benchtop models aren't going to hold tolerances to ten thousandths but they'll certainly do better than I can with a drill press and hand tools and its just for tinkering so I don't think I'd be disappointed in their abilities.

CAD is one thing, CAM (the program that generates the G-code to actually run the machine) is a world of it's own...

I would also recommend a lathe as the first purchase.

 

[lovemachine]

CAD is one thing, CAM (the program that generates the G-code to actually run the machine) is a world of it's own...

I would also recommend a lathe as the first purchase.

I've been writing G-code programs without any type of software . It sucks!!

I've been a machinist for 21 years now. And all we use are Bridgeport mills, minus the 3-CNC mills we have.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

You want a lathe? You know I have a direct line to the Allison Retiree Mafia.

Tell me what you want (mill, lathe, press brake, grinder, inter alia) and 3 of them will fall off the back of a truck . . . er, become available at reasonable pricing immediately.

Oh, tell me the quality you want too. The high end stuff for aero-space work is off the charts.

 

[ruger1800]

You want a lathe? You know I have a direct line to the Allison Retiree Mafia.

Tell me what you want (mill, lathe, press brake, grinder, inter alia) and 3 of them will fall off the back of a truck . . . er, become available at reasonable pricing immediately.

Oh, tell me the quality you want too. The high end stuff for aero-space work is off the charts.

okuma, mori seki, haas, makino, dual colum, 12 axis mean green metal eating machines.

 

[junk]

contact new CNC machine dealers . they take trade ins and also know every shop in town . They might point you to a shop that has some older machines that they no longer use or need .

 

[CountryBoy19]

I've been writing G-code programs without any type of software . It sucks!!

I've been a machinist for 21 years now. And all we use are Bridgeport mills, minus the 3-CNC mills we have.

Conversational programming or straight up, typing out the g-code manually?

If the latter you're a brave, patient, and knowledgeable man.

FWIW, I've had g-code programs that went over 200,000 lines of code, I would HATE to program that manually.

 

[Ballistix]

With some of the software available today, one no longer needs to write code. Use a post processor and it generates the code and tool paths. Most people that write code, are using coolant, air, ATC, 5 axis, auto feed type equipment. A small machine for a bench won't require all of that.
I believe the most lines I've machined, was somewhere around 20,000. That was a small 2.5D design. I would never be able to write the code for something like that.
With the larger 2D designs, I get around 12,000 lines.
There are a lot of options for design software also. Most under $3,000 for 3D and under $1,000 for 2.5D, with there even being some for free, so a hobbyist doesn't have to spend the big money for features that they will never use. Something as simple as AI or Corel will generate the vectors and Mach 3 can use it directly, even though I haven't tried it.

From talking to some programmers, they use block templates for the code. A lot of movements are replicated, so they just insert the blocks and do some fill-in on the custom work.

Someone should have a cnc meet. I would like to learn more about it from professionals.
Cheeseburgers are on CM...

 

[churchmouse]

With some of the software available today, one no longer needs to write code. Use a post processor and it generates the code and tool paths. Most people that write code, are using coolant, air, ATC, 5 axis, auto feed type equipment. A small machine for a bench won't require all of that.
I believe the most lines I've machined, was somewhere around 20,000. That was a small 2.5D design. I would never be able to write the code for something like that.
With the larger 2D designs, I get around 12,000 lines.
There are a lot of options for design software also. Most under $3,000 for 3D and under $1,000 for 2.5D, with there even being some for free, so a hobbyist doesn't have to spend the big money for features that they will never use. Something as simple as AI or Corel will generate the vectors and Mach 3 can use it directly, even though I haven't tried it.

From talking to some programmers, they use block templates for the code. A lot of movements are replicated, so they just insert the blocks and do some fill-in on the custom work.

Someone should have a cnc meet. I would like to learn more about it from professionals.
Cheeseburgers are on CM...

Heck I am in but I need to start claiming all this dead cow on my taxes.....

 

[RobbyMaQ]

I'm in...

Group buy?

 

[MontereyC6]

Conversational programming or straight up, typing out the g-code manually?

If the latter you're a brave, patient, and knowledgeable man.

FWIW, I've had g-code programs that went over 200,000 lines of code, I would HATE to program that manually.

Gcode isn't that bad, I can write/read it just like writing/reading a book. The complicated stuff is when you get into the 5 and 6 axises!

 

[ghuns]

FWIW, I've had g-code programs that went over 200,000 lines of code, I would HATE to program that manually.

We gave up on line numbers, just adds bulk to file sizes. We generate lots of programs over 50mb, and a fair amount over 100mb. Nine decimal places and 5 axis generate lots of data.

Gcode isn't that bad, I can write/read it just like writing/reading a book. The complicated stuff is when you get into the 5 and 6 axises!

It's not that complicated, it's just more ways to crash.

Here's what I program for most days...

[video=youtube;PG0li2T1ZUo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PG0li2T1ZUo[/video]

 

[AllenM]

Learning to operate manual machines has more draw to me than CNC. I just don't think I'd get the sense of pride having a computer control everything for me. I'm pretty handy with Google Sketchup and my Son tells me that if I can swing that I wouldn't have an issue learning a CAD program.

I'd like to have both eventually but a lathe would be my first purchase if I end up going down this road. I know the benchtop models aren't going to hold tolerances to ten thousandths but they'll certainly do better than I can with a drill press and hand tools and its just for tinkering so I don't think I'd be disappointed in their abilities.

I bought a combo mill lathe to start out with and I learned a little but soon out grew it, Now that I have a regular mill I don't think I will ever not have one as long as I live and it gets used a lot more then the lathe
Also I think you have the wrong impression of CNC. It is a tool just like the mill itself. My mill can be used with CNC or without it. the cool thing about CNC is it allows me to do things I would never be able to do manually.

I bought a used one and learned a valuable lesson. I used it for a year but I did not know how to tell good from bad when I bought it and it was pretty wore out. I had to have a complete rebuild done to it which was quite costly along with retrofitting a new CNC controller. But since then it has paid for itself and then some.

Percentage wise I use the CNC very little but it is sure great when I do need it. I love learning how to machine, it's not easy and I learn things all the time but I have come a long way too.

After getting semi burned on the used mill I struggled with the question "is used american better then new Chinese"? I bought a new Grizzly gunsmith lathe (Chinese) and have been happy with it and it has done everything I need. I know a nice US built one would be better but I can cut excellent threads, precision chamber barrels and turn metal just fine. If I had the cash I would go american every time. But now I am looking at a surface grinder and I am afraid to buy used because I just don't know enough about the machines to tell what condition they are in.

The combo lathe mill is ok. that is what I had first but I out grew it quickly. having to change gears for different thread pitches was a pain in the rear. Being able to use controls on the front of the machine to change thread pitch is worth the money alone.

 

[phylodog]

Thanks Allen, I enjoyed watching you work when I had the opportunity to stop in awhile back.

 

[ghuns]

But now I am looking at a surface grinder and I am afraid to buy used because I just don't know enough about the machines to tell what condition they are in.

Used surface grinders are dicey. If the spindle is quiet and smooth, that part is probably fine. If the table travels back and forth smoothly, it could still be junk. Some tables roll on ball bearings. The contact point of the balls wear a groove in the flat ways they are sandwiched between. That groove isn't always consistent. They tend to get worn most in the middle of the table travel. A badly worn grinder with ball bearing ways will grind with a very rippled finish. I would want a grinder with traditional ways, one flat and one V. These too will wear most in the middle, but they can be hand scraped back in. The one used grinder to avoid like the plague is an old Harig that has some weird, blue teflon/plastic coated ways. When those are worn out, they are scrap.

This is a good test for any surface grinder...

If making onesie/twosie gun parts are your thing, if these 5 blocks all checked within .001", I'd call it close enough. If you want to cover that chuck with 250, 1911 hammers and hold less than .001", it's not close enough.

 

[Gabriel]

But now I am looking at a surface grinder and I am afraid to buy used because I just don't know enough about the machines to tell what condition they are in.

I have one I've never used. I thought I would use it, but it's a 610 and I really need a 618. I'm pretty sure it's worn out and I wasted my money, but the magnetic chuck is probably worth close to what I paid for it. It's been easier for me to take my hatchets and knives to a local machine shop and have them do it, especially since it is done after heat treat and they can do it right and keep the metal cool.

I was a pattern maker for about a decade and we had a small machine shop in back that we used a lot. I've wanted a mill and a lathe ever since I left there, but am always afraid of getting burned on worn out equipment. I almost bought a SB Heavy 10 a few years ago that came out of the local high school machine shop. The deal was struck. They were going to deliver it to me and I'd pay them for it. They never delivered it for some reason. I have much more use for a mill anyway.

 

[AllenM]

This is a good thread

 

[lovemachine]

I want Gibbscam.

 

[ghuns]

I want Gibbscam.

Why?

 

[lovemachine]

Why?

Have you used it? It's neat!