If you carry, do you have a lawyer at the ready should you have a need?

[88GT]

Having a lawyer is a good idea. I didn't give a statement until my FOP attorney was there. However, don't get into the paranoia of thinking we're out to get you and you'll be arrested if you don't have one. I was more worried about my own chain of command than the prosecutor's office, quite frankly. We've had a multitude of folks involved in self defense come through the office, give a statement without a lawyer present, and then be released and no charges filed. At least in Marion County, the prosecutor isn't looking to file on good shoots. Now if you do something stupid like shoot at a car full of kids because they bought the last strawberry milkshake or something, that's different, but good shoots are just that and are treated as such in my experience.

That's my general thought. I think it's a great idea (translated: wise) to have an attorney to call. I'm just not convinced that it has to be RFN emergency status.

 

[yote hunter]

I have Guy Relford and Kirk Freeman both listed in my phone. Neither of them know it though.

LOL +1 Same here too.... Just in case you never know, I even told my wife they are in my phone if needed.....

 

[Erich]

I'm a criminal defense lawyer in another state, and I certainly have the numbers of several competent colleagues in my phone in case of such need. And I have Kirk's number in there, too, for when I visit back home in Indiana . . .

 

[Kirk Freeman]

And I have Kirk's number in there, too, for when I visit back home in Indiana . . .

May the record reflect that counsel from a foreign jurisdiction never calls to offer to buy the first round.

Please read that back . . .

 

[ModernGunner]

Criminal lawyers, civil lawyers, real estate lawyers, investment lawyers, insurance lawyers. Need lots of lawyers, nowadays.

The current legal system is set up BY lawyers FOR lawyers. The Defendant's counsel is a lawyer, the Plaintiff's counsel is a lawyer, the Prosecutor is a lawyer. The Judge IS a lawyer! EVERYBODY'S a lawyer, EXCEPT you!

IF ya actually get criminally prosecuted, there's a good chance you're gonna end up in 'financial ruin', even IF you were completely justified and are 100% exonerated, if ya don't already have tons of money. SOME lawyers will bill ya for A paper clip or A stamp. Find all that out beforehand. The legal bill is gonna be BIG, count on it. How ya gonna pay for all that, if ya don't have big $$$ in the bank? Sell whatever ya have at 'fire sale' prices? Put up your home? Liens on your home for years?

That said, I agree it's a good idea to have those contact numbers on your phone and on the back of your LTCH. BUT, you STILL need to make sure your wife (significant other, buddy, whoever) has those numbers. IF you're booked, you'll NOT be keeping your cell phone and wallet. If you're arrested, call them and do NOT mention names. Just tell them where you are, to "call the numbers on the card immediately", and get the 'wheels in motion right away. And leave it at that.

Make sure you have a lawyer that has practical experience in what you need. Has that 'gun lawyer' actually been through criminal and/or civil trials on the matter? Were their clients exonerated each time? Remember, on a daily basis, 50% of the lawyers 'lose' in court, LOL. Well, THEY don't 'lose', their clients lose. But, that 'losing' lawyer STILL gets paid.

How 'aggressive' is that lawyer in defending YOUR best interests? Had a well-respected lawyer tell me "Lawyers want to 'negotiate' and come to a settlement". Is that 'preferable' to having a lawyer that's going to 'fight tooth & nail' for your interests? You decide.

It's a good to have a clear idea on what you're trying to accomplish. "Get me out of this" isn't much of a 'description'. ARE you going to actually press charges against the person(s) who attacked you, who you were forced to defend yourself against? Gonna sue him civilly, as well? Have a plan of action now, so you and your attorney can pursue that plan as closely as possible later, as circumstances allow.

The Police are NOT 'the enemy'. NOR are they 'your friend'. Even IF it's your best friend that responds to that call. They're sworn to do their job, and they ALSO have a life and family, so they're NOT 'sticking their neck out' for your butt, bet on it.

And for gawd's sake, IF (god forbid) you're involved in such a situation, do NOT get on INGO, your local bar, your coffee shop, your Dentist's office, etc. and blather away about it! Shut the heck UP. There'll be plenty of time and opportunity to 'tell your side of the story'.

Ask questions, get a GOOD lawyer that fits YOUR needs (I would HIGHLY recommend calling the lawyers on INGO first), and let the counselor do their job. And then maintain regular contact to make SURE they're doing their job. Remember, YOUR case likely isn't their ONLY case.

 

[ModernGunner]

May the record reflect that counsel from a foreign jurisdiction never calls to offer to buy the first round.

Please read that back . . .

NEITHER do litigators offer to buy the first round for their clients!

 

[Erich]

May the record reflect that counsel from a foreign jurisdiction never calls to offer to buy the first round.

Please read that back . . .

I haven't been back since the last time I saw you, my learned brother.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I haven't been back since the last time I saw you, my learned brother.

Unlawful flight to avoid having to buy Kirk beer and sushi?

I object.

 

[Erich]

Avoiding ragweed and humidity are more my speed.

 

[IN_Sheepdog]

Criminal lawyers, civil lawyers, real estate lawyers, investment lawyers, insurance lawyers. Need lots of lawyers, nowadays.

The current legal system is set up BY lawyers FOR lawyers. The Defendant's counsel is a lawyer, the Plaintiff's counsel is a lawyer, the Prosecutor is a lawyer. The Judge IS a lawyer! EVERYBODY'S a lawyer, EXCEPT you!......................

.

You make some good points although you have to realize also that most SD attorney's (fortunately...) do not make their livings at defending innocent gun owners... In fact, most of the Crim lawyers regularly deal with guys that are NOT innocent and therefore, they get into the negotiating and plea bargaining mode... That is hopefully not the case when it involves a justifiable homicide, (either armed citizen or LEO...). You are not defending a criminal and therefore sometimes the Criminal Defense Attorney is at a slight disadvantage...

The other advantage of having an attorney (Kirk, Guy,.... or myself for that matter...) is that they are still "students of the gun", and know what is involved in an SD shooting... Many Crim lawyers frankly dont have a clue... The most important aspect of choosing representation is finding a lawyer who is familiar with and studies Self Defense law, even though the opportunities for actual cases in this area are few and far between... (again... fortunately...)

As to costs, I think it is self evident that if you are going to accept the grave responsibility for carrying a gun for self protection, you MUST have some means of protecting your financial future in the case of this terrible event happening. I am affiliated with both Armed Citizens Legal Defense Network, ACLDN (membership driven) as well as USCCA Us Concealed Carry (insurance Driven) and the comparatively minimal annual costs of 100-150 bucks a year is necessary and essential... There are also other programs through the NRA, or CCW-Safe which also provide coverage in regard to a SD case. You DO have fire insurance on your home dont you... just in case? You dont plan on your house burning to the ground but it DOES happen...

While the emotional trauma and experience will likely haunt you the rest of your life, it should not also put you in financial ruin at the same time...

Just my 2 cents...

 

[st33da]

No but to be honest I never really gave it much though. After reading this thread, I am definitely going to add a few numbers to my phone and probably even on a card in my wallet.

 

[IN_Sheepdog]

No but to be honest I never really gave it much though. After reading this thread, I am definitely going to add a few numbers to my phone and probably even on a card in my wallet.

For the comments made above, the best place for the card is probably with someone else who would be the first point of contact, wife, or adult child. They can make a lot more phone calls and contacts than you can if you are involved...(ie. booking/arrest etc)

Just remember that ALL phone calls are recorded, so you dont want to be making any 'statements' that could come back to haunt you later... leave it as
1. Honey, Im ok. I was attacked and you need to make the phone call to .....
2. Give them the location of where you are being held...
3. Say nothing more than that...

Along with number one, it is my recommendation that a crime victim should always request medical treatment or at least be thoroughly checked out at a medical facility ... It not only makes sure that you are not injured and not know it...(yes it happens) but also gives you time to collect yourself and start recovering from any physiological issues. (adrenalin dump, tunnel vision, etc.) It would also allow more time to get in contact with your legal assistance.

 

[st33da]

For the comments made above, the best place for the card is probably with someone else who would be the first point of contact, wife, or adult child. They can make a lot more phone calls and contacts than you can if you are involved...(ie. booking/arrest etc)

Just remember that ALL phone calls are recorded, so you dont want to be making any 'statements' that could come back to haunt you later... leave it as
1. Honey, Im ok. I was attacked and you need to make the phone call to .....
2. Give them the location of where you are being held...
3. Say nothing more than that...

Along with number one, it is my recommendation that a crime victim should always request medical treatment or at least be thoroughly checked out at a medical facility ... It not only makes sure that you are not injured and not know it...(yes it happens) but also gives you time to collect yourself and start recovering from any physiological issues. (adrenalin dump, tunnel vision, etc.) It would also allow more time to get in contact with your legal assistance.

good advice, thanks