Imagine a gun with teeth and its own brain

[IndyBeldar]

I saw a news story on the proposed city ordinance in Indy to restrict ownership of Pit Bulls including requiring spay/neuter of ALL such dogs in the city/county limits.

Can't help but see a "blame the gun" mentality at work here. I know of quite a few pibble fans who assert that it's not bad dogs but bad owners who are at fault, and that's where the law enforcement should fall.

Instead we have to crack down on assault weapons and big dogs and scissors (because someone might run with them) so that no one will get hurt.

 

[jeremy]

The sad thing is that dogs are not to blame in this it is the owners. So why not spay/neuter the owners whose dogs are a problem. It will actually probably more productive in the end

 

[bigg cheese]

The sad thing is that dogs are not to blame in this it is the owners. So why not spay/neuter the owners whose dogs are a problem. It will actually probably more productive in the end

I would agree somewhat, but anything that is alive can turn on you. My dog is not a gun. He thinks, has the ability to attack something with instinctive tactics. He's also a better judge of character than me. My dog broke out of his cage before he was six months old. He doesn't have a mean bone in his body and is great with my sister's kids, 3, 4, and 8 years of age, but I can only control his actions and behavior so much. However, I do trust him with the kids than I do my gun with the kids.

Some dogs have a higher propensity for aggression than others in their personality, similar to man. It may also take the right stimulus to trigger it. It's just genetics. Not the same as people mind you. We have free will that can overcome instincts.

I will never own a rottweiler, pit bull, or chihuahua for exactly those reasons. Nothing inherently bad about those breeds, but they had purposes when they were bred.

Heck, they just had on the news this morning a pet Australian Shepherd (part of the mutt in my dog) that got lost on some boating trip in Australia and they found it after four months. It swam to an uninhabited island and fed on baby goats. it just takes the right stimulus to get a dog to act instinctively.

Treating an animal well will go a long way toward minimizing his propensity toward aggression, but nothing is 100%.

 

[USMC_0311]

The sad thing is that dogs are not to blame in this it is the owners. So why not spay/neuter the owners whose dogs are a problem. It will actually probably more productive in the end

I think you might be on to someting here.

 

[jennybird]

Treating an animal well will go a long way toward minimizing his propensity toward aggression, but nothing is 100%.

This is so true. With EVERY breed. Dogs need training and attention. Some more than others. Banning a specific breed is ridiculous imo.

When my daughter was 10, she was attacked by a German Shepard. 5 years later she still has the scars to prove it. Animal Control was called, but did anything happen to the dog? No. However, if it had been a pibby I suspect it would have not only been in the papers, but things would have ended much differently for the pooch.

The only reason pibby's get a bad rap is because of the PEOPLE that used to breed them for fighting. Interesting fact: Pit bull terriers were chosen for fighting mainly for two reasons. 1. Their high tolerance for pain (for obvious reasons)... 2. Their LOVE and RESPECT for people (so handlers wouldn't get bit when separating them). Hmmm, that last one doesn't quite fit the bill for their reputation of attacking humans does it? You can teach poodles to fight too ya know, but of course there's no money in that.

I have a Staffordshire Terrier. She is a "cousin" to the pit bull, but is always mistaken for a pibby by other people. I am a concerned and aware dog owner so I treat her and train her as if she is a pibby because she is strong and intimidating in appearance. Of course there is a possibility that she could attack someone some day… but with her training and respect for what I teach her, the chances of that are slim.

Just because she has pibby blood in her veins, doesn’t make her a fighter, just like the German blood running through my veins doesn't make me a nazi.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

I will never own a rottweiler, pit bull, or chihuahua for exactly those reasons. Nothing inherently bad about those breeds, but they had purposes when they were bred.

Not sure on chihuahuas since I never took a interest in them. But do you know the original purpose of Rottweilers? They were originally a working dog used for herding and cart hauling. They were commonly known in Germany as butcher dogs, the butchers would go out and buy cattle on the hoof and use the dogs to herd them back to town. Then after the cattle was processed they were hooked up to a cart and the butcher would go around town to sell the meat. After the advent of modern refrigeration and transportation they faced dying out as a breed because there wasn't much use for them. What saved them as a breed is because of their size and drive they proved well suited for police and military applications.

I've only owned one (so far) and she was the sweetest dog I have ever owned. I won't say totally non-aggressive but nearly so. The most aggressive I had ever seen her was around small children. And she wasn't aggressive towards them. She would watch adults she didn't know around them very intently. My neighbors 7 yr old daughter would come over and ask if my dog could come out and play. Yes I have known some overly aggresive rotts. Along with just about every other breed of dog I've ran across.

 

[jennybird]

Another common misconception...

Usually, dog aggressiveness towards children is mis-interpreted by humans. Dogs have a natural instinct to correct those who they view rank lower in the "pack" (aka small children). So a dog nipping at a child is nearly always stemming from "correction" not "aggression" instincts. Many times a dogs natural instinctive actions are simply interpreted incorrectly. Too bad more of us don't speak dog.

 

[bigg cheese]

I'm not saying they can't be great pets, but I have a rule I live by.

I will not own any animal that I cannot "take" in the event of aggression.

My Aussie/Catahoula mix dog is a fantastic pet. However, he is 73 pounds of muscle -- no fat at all . Back to the great judge of character part, though.

Buddy, in the 2 years since I got him, has NEVER barked at anyone. He is most definitely a people-dog, but a little high-strung. Not 3 days ago, Buddy barked to be let out, and as soon as I did, he took off to the fence adjacent my neighbor's yard, and scared the living hell out of some nut-job wandering around the yard. I normally have to have a treat in hand, tell him to speak, and then wait 30-60 seconds before he can work himself up enough to bark like the big dog he is . Like I said, he never does this, so I take it under advisement, and try to help the guy. Ended up, he only spoke when spoken to and refused to show me his face and kept turning away from me when I walked up to him, so I "escorted" him from her property and sent him on his way.

I let the dog back in, and he continued playing with his six-week old kitten , Wally. As cute as that is, dogs can go from gentle to kill in an instant much more easily and quickly than we can, and we have to be wary of it, even if they are good dogs.

 

[jennybird]

I'm not saying they can't be great pets, but I have a rule I live by.

I will not own any animal that I cannot "take" in the event of aggression.

My Aussie/Catahoula mix dog is a fantastic pet. However, he is 73 pounds of muscle -- no fat at all . Back to the great judge of character part, though.

Buddy, in the 2 years since I got him, has NEVER barked at anyone. He is most definitely a people-dog, but a little high-strung. Not 3 days ago, Buddy barked to be let out, and as soon as I did, he took off to the fence adjacent my neighbor's yard, and scared the living hell out of some nut-job wandering around the yard. I normally have to have a treat in hand, tell him to speak, and then wait 30-60 seconds before he can work himself up enough to bark like the big dog he is . Like I said, he never does this, so I take it under advisement, and try to help the guy. Ended up, he only spoke when spoken to and refused to show me his face and kept turning away from me when I walked up to him, so I "escorted" him from her property and sent him on his way.

I let the dog back in, and he continued playing with his six-week old kitten , Wally. As cute as that is, dogs can go from gentle to kill in an instant much more easily and quickly than we can, and we have to be wary of it, even if they are good dogs.

By not owning a dog you don't trust, you ARE a responsible pet owner. That is to be commended.

If you ever are attacked, a punch to the nose is always a good bet (just like sharks). And if you ever have to break up a fight or get an attacking dog off of someone, grab the dog's back legs and drag them away... don't ever get in the middle.

 

[bigg cheese]

I hear you.

I had to break up a fight between two other dogs I had as a child. One was getting old and feeble, but didn't want to lose the Alpha status, so he kept picking losing fights over and over.

They only had one big knock-down drag-out fight, and I wasn't even a teenager yet. I made the mistake of trying to grab the younger dog off of the other one and was growled and nipped at. I learned my lesson .

I ended it by picking him up by his tail (25-30 lb mutt) and tossed him a good ten feet away so I could separate them and tend to the other dog (who was a tad bloodied).

 

[bigg cheese]

Another common misconception...

Usually, dog aggressiveness towards children is mis-interpreted by humans. Dogs have a natural instinct to correct those who they view rank lower in the "pack" (aka small children). So a dog nipping at a child is nearly always stemming from "correction" not "aggression" instincts. Many times a dogs natural instinctive actions are simply interpreted incorrectly. Too bad more of us don't speak dog.

This behavior is unacceptable in my book.. While my dog is a valuable member of my family, my neice and nephews rank higher. Thankfully, I have a very submissive dog, but I made sure to teach him that they rank above him by having them get Buddy to do tricks with treats. Once that has been established, he (mostly ) obeys all other commands he knows.

No, Sit, Stay, Lay, Roll, Go Get (insert name of toy), "Go lay down" (specifically his bed), go to your cage, back up (that was fun to teach ), speak, shake, high five, run, walk, ride (truck ride ), etc.

 

[dburkhead]

This behavior is unacceptable in my book.. While my dog is a valuable member of my family, my neice and nephews rank higher. Thankfully, I have a very submissive dog, but I made sure to teach him that they rank above him by having them get Buddy to do tricks with treats. Once that has been established, he (mostly ) obeys all other commands he knows.

No, Sit, Stay, Lay, Roll, Go Get (insert name of toy), "Go lay down" (specifically his bed), go to your cage, back up (that was fun to teach ), speak, shake, high five, run, walk, ride (truck ride ), etc.

That behavior is unacceptable, but it's also trainable. One of the main reasons that it's unacceptable is that dogs' hide and fur is tougher than human skin (particularly a child) so the interpack "corrections" or even simple play that is OK dog to dog is potentially injurious to humans.

One of the most useful tools in the dog owners kit is the "down" command (dog laying down, chest and stomach on the floor, head down between his paws). Since the "down" position, is inherently submissive (in doggie language) putting a dog into the down position is a very useful correction for unacceptable behavior.

Persistence and consistency are the keys.

We had one dog--a little beagle mix of about 25 lbs--who was about as "alpha" as it gets, dominating dogs five times her size through sheer attitude. Never got in a fight, but there was never any question about her being "boss dog." However, we never had a bit of trouble with her and people. Early socialization, early (from about 6 weeks) obedience training, and requiring that she obey a command (it might be "sit" or "down" or "beg" or what have you) before getting any treats, were the key.

 

[clt46910]

Training is the only answer. Reguardless how safe you feel your dog is to your family, does not mean it will be to others. Your safe friendly dog might be the killer that is doing in your neighbors pets.

 

[5.56'aholic]

The sad thing is that dogs are not to blame in this it is the owners. So why not spay/neuter the owners whose dogs are a problem. It will actually probably more productive in the end

it would swiftly end most of the entitlement mentality as well, talk about a bonus.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Another common misconception...

If that was in reply to my post, I stated she was not aggressive towards the children. She would watch very intently any unknown adult around them. Case in point shortly after my son was born a friend of his mothers that hadn't been around my dog before came over. Dog was friendly to her, until she sat down and started holding my son. At that point the dog walked up and sat down about 3-4 ft away and never took her eyes of the lady. Didn't growl or lift her hackles just watched, well more like stared to be exact. Which for some reason it scared the crap out of the friend Another instance which I can recall was when his mother and I were taking him for a walk in the stroller and I had the dog on a leash, a neighbor came up to talk and see my son, the dog immediately got between the guy and the stroller before he got within 10 ft never growled etc but stayed between the guy and the stroller until I called her and told her it was okay. Afterwhich she just stared at him the entire time. Until he left the stroller. And actually I take it back there was one time she showed more aggression than that. When my gf moved out and her brother came to pick up her stuff, my dog did bark aggressively and kept trying to get between us. If that wasn't in reply to my post please ignore this.