Interesting Trend

[jlw]

I recently watched a Clint Smith video where he discourages topping off your magazine. His reasoning is that you should carry the same number of rounds in every magazine and topping off gives you one extra round and can throw off your round count.

Counting rounds may work in practice or in a gun sport, but it doesn't work under real life conditions. In shooting investigations, it is extremely common, almost to the point of being a rule, that people under count the number of rounds they fired in an actual shooting incident. This is why one should never answer the question of "How many rounds did you fire?" If you say three, but you fired seven, you've made a statement that is at best inaccurate and at worst could be spun that you are lying about the incident.

Tom Givens will sometimes have the students gather around after a drill and ask them how many rounds are in their mag. I've rarely seen people get the number correct.

The reason for the top off is so that the firearm is at full capacity. Rounds equal time. The number of people who have successfully reloaded in the midst of a close range gunfight is extremely low.

 

[2A_Tom]

(I do not expect to do this in a gun fight)

Counting rounds may work in practice or in a gun sport, but it doesn't work under real life conditions. In shooting investigations, it is extremely common, almost to the point of being a rule, that people under count the number of rounds they fired in an actual shooting incident. This is why one should never answer the question of "How many rounds did you fire?" If you say three, but you fired seven, you've made a statement that is at best inaccurate and at worst could be spun that you are lying about the incident.

Tom Givens will sometimes have the students gather around after a drill and ask them how many rounds are in their mag. I've rarely seen people get the number correct.

The reason for the top off is so that the firearm is at full capacity. Rounds equal time. The number of people who have successfully reloaded in the midst of a close range gunfight is extremely low.

Thanks a lot, I didn't realize that.

 

[cedartop]

Thanks a lot, I didn't realize that.

Chief Weems meant well and is very qualified to give out advice here. If INGO had SME's he would definitely be one. Just in case you are anyone else wonders about his bona fides https://firstpersonsafety.com/about/

 

[Trapper Jim]

Cold range. Bring two shooters to the line for a training exercise and they prefer to top off. At command to make ready Shooter #1 presents, inserts a loaded mag, racks, chamber checks,applies any safeties, removes mag, inserts fresh mag and holsters securely. During this time his firearm has been in his workspace with his full attention. Shooter #2 presents, inserts a loaded mag, racks, chamber checks, applies any safeties, holsters securely, tries to release mag button to remove partial magazine from a loaded cocked holstered firearm pointed down his leg or worse if appendix carry, barneys said magazine or grabs a full one, tries to install into butt of gun which is difficult to see and can be awkward to manipulate.

When I run a hot range the process of make ready on the line varies in the sense that the firearm is already loaded but under no circumstance is any off the line gun handling allowed and I have plenty of extra help to watch the shooters at all times. I too have removed those students.

Thank you for your opinions on this matter and our differences generate a think tank for all of us to use to improve our services.

 

[Twangbanger]

...As a matter of fact 18 years ago I tried to get IDPA to deal with this in the rulebook and they declined to take a position...

Amazing, we finally found where they draw the line.

I would have thought they'd put you on the Board of Directors for this request...

 

[Trapper Jim]

Just as good. My number is IDPA # is 12

 

[Twangbanger]

Just as good. My number is IDPA # is 12

Ah! So.