Is a properly holstered handgun considered "safe"?

[Kirk Freeman]

Everyone wants to take off their holster and wave it around.

It is part of the self-verification process of gun owners. They look for reasons to play with their guns. Just look at the bathroom threads. Rather than simply leave it in their holsters, they want to play with the gun like a raccoon washing an apple.

I figured it would be more cut and dry.

It is. Leave it in the holster and stop touching it.

Standing in line behind someone with a shoulder holster would either be OK, or it wouldn't.

As long as the dude with the shoulder holster does not touch it. It is OK.

 

[KG1]

IDK about anyone else but I like to play catch with my holstered firearm and throw it like a nerf football. Seriously though. Why are we trying to make this into such a complicated issue?

 

[ckcollins2003]

Awhile ago in the handguns section, someone posted a picture of their new pistol - resting on his thigh, in a holster, clearly pointing directly at his crotch. Would you call this "safe"?

I would. Would you?

Seriously though. Why are we trying to make this into such a complicated issue?

No kidding... it's about like the whole, "the gun is always loaded!" crap. No it's not...

 

[Kirk Freeman]

No kidding... it's about like the whole, "the gun is always loaded!" crap. No it's not...

People want to play games. Part of it is what I discussed earlier, self-verification, one matters because he argues points for which one has no education or background in.

The silly kid argument of "No, it ain't low-dead" is why "All guns are always loaded" became "treat all guns as loaded."

 

[nakinate]

If a holstered gun isn't "safe" then what the hell are we all doing?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

The silly kid argument of "No, it ain't low-dead" is why "All guns are always loaded" became "treat all guns as loaded."

Or, the first one is obvious BS statement that is not instructive and that leads to a "well, if it isn't loaded then..." mentality and the second is an instruction that, if followed, results in safe gun handling.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Or, the first one is obvious BS statement that is not instructive and that leads to a "well, if it isn't loaded then..." mentality and the second is an instruction that, if followed, results in safe gun handling.

At first there was only one rule: "All guns are always loaded." The other three were added after the kid argument "no, it ain't low-dead" lead to scary behavior at API and the inclusion of the other 3.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

At first there was only one rule: "All guns are always loaded." The other three were added after the kid argument "no, it ain't low-dead" lead to scary behavior at API and the inclusion of the other 3.

Or, the first one is obvious BS statement that is not instructive and that leads to a "well, if it isn't loaded then..." mentality

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Just adding to your insightful answer.

The little kids' argument that "THAT gun ain't low-dead" necessitated the codification of the other three.

 

[Ricnzak]

When is it acceptable to stick your hand into a running table saw?

When you own a Flesh Detecting Table Saw: Bosch Releases a Flesh Detecting Tablesaw - Fine Woodworking

 

[BugI02]

My . I would think of a holstered firearm as not 'safe' but less deadly. Like a knife in a sheath or a sword in a scabard, it is still a deadly weapon. It is in a retention system usually specifically engineered to enhance rapid use or deployment. I don't think it's a good habit to treat the weapon with too much 'familiarity' ( of the kind that breeds contempt ) simply because it is contained in a carry system. If you carelessly sheath a long sword you could be minus a thumb.

 

[LP1]

I would. Would you?

Maybe it is safe, maybe not, but it's a sloppy violation of the 4 rules, so I would err on the side of caution.

 

[Simple Ed]

When the weapon is on my person, secured, and not in my hand, it ,and I, are most "safe." It is under my direct supervision, not relying on some locked storage for its security.

That said, the prerequisite is sober judgement. My "safe" ain't necessarily YOUR "safe."

 

[ckcollins2003]

Maybe it is safe, maybe not, but it's a sloppy violation of the 4 rules, so I would err on the side of caution.

Carrying a gun in any way, shape, or form, violates the "4 rules". This is why I don't live by the "4 rules".

Once you are no longer an idiot in the gun world, you realize the 4 rules are only there as something to learn by.

The real fact is... the gun is not always loaded and the muzzle will sweep you or someone else if you choose to carry. The only way it won't is if you are carrying a long gun and it is slung over your shoulder pointing up... which in turn violates the 4 rules... so yeah, there's just no possible way to not violate those civilian world rules. This is why people need training and why common sense should be a requirement for life.

 

[IndyGlockMan]

if you're on a "Cold Range", it's not considered safe.
Other than that, I would consider it safe.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Carrying a gun in any way, shape, or form, violates the "4 rules". This is why I don't live by the "4 rules".

I understand the need to rationalize, but why do you say that carrying a gun violates the Four Rules and why do you put them in quotation marks?

Do you mean like appendix carry where you are violating the Four Rules? Carrying a gun does not have to violate the Four Rules, I am confused as to why you say it does? Is this like the copper argument "oh, we are so professional that the Four Rules do not apply to us"???

Help me here.

 

[indyrun]

Yes, the GUN is SAFE.

"Safety" is the condition of the holster wearer. I don't know where you are going with this poll, but as a side note, I believe most criminals don't use holsters.

 

[indyrun]

On this topic, the basic 4 Rules, I saw a T-shirt the other day that kind of sums it up:

"Gun Safety Rule #1 - Carry One"

 

[ckcollins2003]

I understand the need to rationalize, but why do you say that carrying a gun violates the Four Rules and why do you put them in quotation marks?

Do you mean like appendix carry where you are violating the Four Rules? Carrying a gun does not have to violate the Four Rules, I am confused as to why you say it does? Is this like the copper argument "oh, we are so professional that the Four Rules do not apply to us"???

Help me here.

One of the "Four Rules" (see those quotations, because they aren't actually rules, just something someone made up because of some negligent people) is, "Do not point the gun at anything you do not intend to shoot". It doesn't matter where you put the holstered gun on your body, it will point at your own body or someone else's at some point in time.

Whether you appendix, pocket, OWB, IWB, Drop leg, Six o' clock, shoulder holster, heck I could go on and on with different ways to carry.... but the muzzle will point in an "unsafe" (according to those "rules") direction throughout the day. The thing that makes a holstered handgun safe is the holster. As you said earlier, people just need to stop playing with it and treat it for what it really is.

And yes, in a way it is the whole, "we are so professional that the "Four Rules" do not apply to us" thing. Because in some situations there is no other choice but to accidentally sweep someone. Think about clearing a building or house... or maybe you've never done it.

Our opinions obviously differ based on what training each of us has had. I'm not condemning anyone who practices those "rules" religiously, but I believe using common sense and safe gun handling is much better. Since I've been on INGO I've noticed the differences of opinion between people who have been trained in the military compared to civilians and what their beliefs on these "rules" are. You can always tell based on the "muzzle sweep" threads and how worked up civilians get when an obviously cleared gun muzzle sweeps them. Whereas the military crowd doesn't really care, because they know it's clear and not going to cause any harm.

All of this is not to say that I don't teach these rules to people who come to me to learn to shoot. Since they are new to it and haven't had any training, I teach them those rules and others that we learned in boot camp. As I stated earlier, IMO they are for new shooters so that they will always practice safe gun handling.

 

[MohawkSlim]

^What he said.