Journey to 2019 USPSA Nationals

[parkerj112]

Either way definitly a learning experience that I -> EARNED <- . I started DF training on the exact issue this morning. I'll get another video up soon talking about how it happened in more detail. And the training steps I'm taking to make sure that it never happens again, Lord willing and the creeks don't rise.

Parker

 

[Tanfodude]

You should watch the video again....
Watch where the gun is when the slide is back. Looks like a good call.

I did watched it over and over before I posted my thoughts. Not a DQ IMO.

 

[Tanfodude]

 

[Bosshoss]

A example of why we don't use video for calls. Different people see different things even with video.
The RO had a completely different view/angle than the video.

IMO it was close to hitting 10 feet away and way to close to make a call DQ or NO DQ based on this video.

 

[Tanfodude]

Well, in real time, you can see the bullet impact on the ground and use that as a basis. That angle is way more than 10 feet.

 

[Grelber]

Well, in real time, you can see the bullet impact on the ground and use that as a basis. That angle is way more than 10 feet.

R.O. had eyes on gun, shooter had eyes on target.

 

[Bosshoss]

Watching on my computer I have no view of bullet impact.
The freeze frame you posted above was in full recoil before his grip was fully established during a quick moving draw stroke and was not pointed at where bullet impacted.

I'm not saying if it was a DQ or not, just saying that I can't tell from what I see on the screen of my computer from my warm house watching it over and over again from a different angle than the RO who had a better real time view than I do and only 1 quick chance to make a decision.

 

[downrange72]

We can argue it until we are blue in the face but it sure looked like it was about 3 feet to me

with that being said, kudos for posting and taking your lumps.

 

[parkerj112]

Yep hopefully this stuff helps someone else. Lumps are for learning. Anyone that doesn't like to take lumps, doesn't like to learn.

Parker

 

[downrange72]

Yep hopefully this stuff helps someone else. Lumps are for learning. Anyone that doesn't like to take lumps, doesn't like to learn.

Parker

I've seen GMs post their DQs. It is a learning point for everyone.

Thanks again

 

[romack991]

Definitely not good and something to correct. However in that situation, I'd keep shooting until the RO tells me to stop. IF you get stopped, then you can determine if it was 10 ft away or close to a target.

I DQed a shooter at a state match for something similar but they fired the shot as their hands were coming together after the reload. It was obvious the shooter didn't mean to fire the shot. I stopped him. But after the MD came over, we determined the reload was complete and he was just re-establishing his grip and was getting ready to engage a target. The shot was past 10 ft into the berm so the DQ was overturned and shooter got a reshoot.

 

[downrange72]

Definitely not good and something to correct. However in that situation, I'd keep shooting until the RO tells me to stop. IF you get stopped, then you can determine if it was 10 ft away or close to a target.

I DQed a shooter at a state match for something similar but they fired the shot as their hands were coming together after the reload. It was obvious the shooter didn't mean to fire the shot. I stopped him. But after the MD came over, we determined the reload was complete and he was just re-establishing his grip and was getting ready to engage a target. The shot was past 10 ft into the berm so the DQ was overturned and shooter got a reshoot.

I've heard similar stories stories from Nationals. It seems "we" are getting a wee bit liberal with sloppy gun handling and the rules.

 

[parkerj112]

I've heard similar stories stories from Nationals. It seems "we" are getting a wee bit liberal with sloppy gun handling and the rules.

In the RO's defence I stopped unloaded and said, "DQ right?". He was then after the fact trying to figure out which DQ I earned . I've learned a lot since then and really appreciate everyones feedback.

Parker

 

[downrange72]

In the RO's defence I stopped unloaded and said, "DQ right?". He was then after the fact trying to figure out which DQ I earned . I've learned a lot since then and really appreciate everyones feedback.

Parker

Pretend like it didn’t happen until ‘stop’

thats what I did when I broke the ‘320’ once. I knew and just kept going until stop.

I learned that that day to not shoot when I have less than 2 hours sleep. It was dumb, it was obvious and it was extremely dangerous.

 

[riverman67]

I just watched it
Good on parker for posting this up.
As for the discussion
If our rules ever get so ****ed up that this is not a dq. It's time to wipe the rule book and start over.
Letting this stuff go eventually leads to holes in people.

 

[rvb]

I stopped a guy a couple years ago at one of the 400s. His gun went off on the draw before he got it extended or both hands on, and it was pointed VERY high. He jumped; it very much surprised him. Sellersburg had new berms that year.... before the match started they were all raked and looked like some giant's zen garden, and this was day 1 of the match. Behind the target was a big divot from all the other shooters. About 6' up the berm (and about 6" from the top) was a small dent from that one round. The rest of the berm was smooth as a beach. I told him sorry for stopping him, to get ready and we'd start him over when he was ready. If he had been 6" farther back from the berm (start position was only 1-2 yards from the berm) or had he been a taller guy (he came up about to my shoulder), he'd have been done for the day. If all I had to go on was gun angle, he'd have been done for the day.

I've had AD's argued, and overturned, when they were obviously surprised the gun went off (even shooting props in the process). Thanks for "owning" it, and recognizing it as an event you don't want turning into a pattern...

-rvb

 

[parkerj112]

I just watched it
Good on parker for posting this up.
As for the discussion
If our rules ever get so ****ed up that this is not a dq. It's time to wipe the rule book and start over.
Letting this stuff go eventually leads to holes in people.

Thanks, I hope that this discussion will help someone.

As for the RVB, "Thanks for "owning" it, and recognizing it as an event you don't want turning into a pattern..."

This will not become a pattern. I know what causes it and what I need to do to ensure that it can't happen. I get a chance this week/weekend and I'll put up a video going over the steps I'm taking. Currently I have built barricades in the DF area and every morning since the "incedent" I've been drilling starting from the same or similar positions with the new mitigation steps being used. I'd give more details but it would just confuse things. Video will be better.

I'll take my lumps I earned them.

Parker
Instagram: @USPSAspiderman

 

[downrange72]

Thanks, I hope that this discussion will help someone.

As for the RVB, "Thanks for "owning" it, and recognizing it as an event you don't want turning into a pattern..."

This will not become a pattern. I know what causes it and what I need to do to ensure that it can't happen. I get a chance this week/weekend and I'll put up a video going over the steps I'm taking. Currently I have built barricades in the DF area and every morning since the "incedent" I've been drilling starting from the same or similar positions with the new mitigation steps being used. I'd give more details but it would just confuse things. Video will be better.

I'll take my lumps I earned them.

Parker
Instagram: @USPSAspiderman

Don’t forget to show stages you ‘smoked’ too

of course someone will tell you they could do it better

 

[riverman67]

The discussion is always helpful
My comments were geared toward the recent tendency for some range masters to come up with ways to overturn obvious safety dqs.
I've dqd a couple of times.
Once was a dropped gun, shirt was stuck in the holster and I twisted, it popped out on the ground.
The other I touched one off on a reload.
That one scared the **** out of me
I obviously didn't have what it took that day.
Remediate and move on, things happen when you're attempting to go as fast as possible.

 

[riverman67]

I stopped a guy a couple years ago at one of the 400s. His gun went off on the draw before he got it extended or both hands on, and it was pointed VERY high. He jumped; it very much surprised him. Sellersburg had new berms that year.... before the match started they were all raked and looked like some giant's zen garden, and this was day 1 of the match. Behind the target was a big divot from all the other shooters. About 6' up the berm (and about 6" from the top) was a small dent from that one round. The rest of the berm was smooth as a beach. I told him sorry for stopping him, to get ready and we'd start him over when he was ready. If he had been 6" farther back from the berm (start position was only 1-2 yards from the berm) or had he been a taller guy (he came up about to my shoulder), he'd have been done for the day. If all I had to go on was gun angle, he'd have been done for the day.

I've had AD's argued, and overturned, when they were obviously surprised the gun went off (even shooting props in the process). Thanks for "owning" it, and recognizing it as an event you don't want turning into a pattern...

-rvb

If it's me
Just dq me
If I'm doing that **** I shouldn't be shooting that day
I wont argue it