Local highschool starts classes earlier...

[Brandon]

Warren Central moves start time up 15 minutes | The Indianapolis Star | indystar.com

I like the line that the principal used about students being awake earlier in the day. Something tells me that the kids would rather be there later then earlier.

Wonder what the teachers think.

 

[kamum76]

I'm in Greenfield and the Elementary goes early and the High School students go later.

 

[Brandon]

I'm in Greenfield and the Elementary goes early and the High School students go later.

That is how it should be if you ask me. The younger kids get on my bus all nice and awake. The older (middle school and up) are hardly awake.

 

[kevinj110]

That is how it was when I was a kid we started at the elementary school at 7:45 and the junior and senior high started at 8:15 this was because how the buses ran though.

 

[thej27]

So they ignore the multiple studies that show later start times to be better for students and that teenagers have a later sleep cycle.
Do Later School Start Times Really Help High School Students? | Psychology Today

Later Start Times for High School Students | CEHD | U of M
Kind of sounds like its someone in the administration that wants a earlier schedule.

 

[Brandon]

I don't see how this all got approved.

 

[Principal Skinr]

So they ignore the multiple studies that show later start times to be better for students and that teenagers have a later sleep cycle.
Do Later School Start Times Really Help High School Students? | Psychology Today

Later Start Times for High School Students | CEHD | U of M
Kind of sounds like its someone in the administration that wants a earlier schedule.

+1!!

All the research I've seen supports this.

I wouldn't get my panties in a bunch, though. We're only talking 15 minutes and other variables make a bigger difference in student achievement, anyway.

 

[Brandon]

+1!!

All the research I've seen supports this.

I wouldn't get my panties in a bunch, though. We're only talking 15 minutes and other variables make a bigger difference in student achievement, anyway.

I know what you are saying, but I am surprised the township is allowing this for a couple of other reasons such as kids that ride the bus. The schools all want their buses to be there at a certain time, if they are starting earlier, that means the drivers are going to be payed more since their second routes won't start until 745ish.

 

[Bapak2ja]

Folks, we do not need government studies to resolve this. From earliest recorded history human beings have organized their day by the sun. Get up with the sun, do a day's work, go to bed when the sun goes down. People learn when to get up and when to go to bed. It is learned behavior! Teens want to stay up late at night and hang with their friends. They go to bed at 0100 and cannot get up at 0600 for class at 0800 because they stay up too late. End of story.

The farmers and businessmen in the first 200 years of American history raised their kids in the traditional way. Those kids got up with the sun, did a day's work before going to school, learned their subjects, excelled in every academic field of endeavor and built the greatest nation the world has ever seen. They did not do this by being allowed to sleep later because studies showed they had later sleep cycles. They did it because they learned to work instead of hanging out, wasting time on useless social media, TV, dance contests and electronic games.

The issue is not sleep cycle. It is lack of discipline and unwillingness to work, to achieve, to be something better, to build something better than what their fathers built.

Children in Mongolia, Indonesia, China, Myanmar, Malaysia, and Nepal start classes at 0700. They are building powerful nations, achieving great things in spite of amazing obstacles like political oppression; ethnic cleansing; lack of electricity, refrigeration, air conditioning or central heating; lack of computers, TVs, DVD, overheads and PowerPoints; lack of food, clean water, basic medical care, modern sanitation. I have seen it with my own eyes and lived with it for thirteen years in Indonesia and six years in Jamaica. I raised two kids in Indonesia and one in Jamaica. I know these truths from personal experience as well as extensive academic study.

The kids learn when to go to bed and when to get up. It is learned behavior. Neither the business world nor the industrial world will change their schedules to accommodate the preferred sleep cycles of their employees. If the man wants the job, be on the line at 06:48 when the whistle blows. If you won't be there, they will find someone who will. The stock market opens at 09:30. If the broker wants to make a profit, he will be there at 06:30 getting his ducks in a row so that when opening bell rings the deals are posted. If he (or she) can't get there because it does not fit his/her sleep cycle, the deals fall through, profits are lost and the poor gentleman whose sleep cycle does not fit the market schedule is looking for a new job.

Tell the kids school starts at 08:00. It is their job to be there or fail the course. Grades are based on achievement. Master the material and you get a good grade and are promoted to the next level. Fail to master the material and you will not be promoted, but will be given the opportunity to try again. Want to quit school? Fine, hit the road. Let me know how well you like washing dishes and flipping burgers when you are 29 and have a wife or partner screaming at you about paying the rent or buying clothes for the kids.

For at least 4,000 years kids have been puling this on their parents. Only in this generation were the parents stupid enough to believe it.

Wait a minute . . . ok, got the flame suit on . . . fire away. INCOMING!!!!

 

[Brandon]

I have several friends who did not go to college doing way better in life financially then myself. I did go to college.

Most high school students I would guess, would love to go to school at 8 in the morning and stay until 4. That after all would fall into your post about rising with the sun for the most part..

 

[Principal Skinr]

Folks, we do not need government studies to resolve this. From earliest recorded history human beings have organized their day by the sun. Get up with the sun, do a day's work, go to bed when the sun goes down. People learn when to get up and when to go to bed. It is learned behavior! Teens want to stay up late at night and hang with their friends. They go to bed at 0100 and cannot get up at 0600 for class at 0800 because they stay up too late. End of story.

The farmers and businessmen in the first 200 years of American history raised their kids in the traditional way. Those kids got up with the sun, did a day's work before going to school, learned their subjects, excelled in every academic field of endeavor and built the greatest nation the world has ever seen. They did not do this by being allowed to sleep later because studies showed they had later sleep cycles. They did it because they learned to work instead of hanging out, wasting time on useless social media, TV, dance contests and electronic games.

The issue is not sleep cycle. It is lack of discipline and unwillingness to work, to achieve, to be something better, to build something better than what their fathers built.

Children in Mongolia, Indonesia, China, Myanmar, Malaysia, and Nepal start classes at 0700. They are building powerful nations, achieving great things in spite of amazing obstacles like political oppression; ethnic cleansing; lack of electricity, refrigeration, air conditioning or central heating; lack of computers, TVs, DVD, overheads and PowerPoints; lack of food, clean water, basic medical care, modern sanitation. I have seen it with my own eyes and lived with it for thirteen years in Indonesia and six years in Jamaica. I raised two kids in Indonesia and one in Jamaica. I know these truths from personal experience as well as extensive academic study.

The kids learn when to go to bed and when to get up. It is learned behavior. Neither the business world nor the industrial world will change their schedules to accommodate the preferred sleep cycles of their employees. If the man wants the job, be on the line at 06:48 when the whistle blows. If you won't be there, they will find someone who will. The stock market opens at 09:30. If the broker wants to make a profit, he will be there at 06:30 getting his ducks in a row so that when opening bell rings the deals are posted. If he (or she) can't get there because it does not fit his/her sleep cycle, the deals fall through, profits are lost and the poor gentleman whose sleep cycle does not fit the market schedule is looking for a new job.

Tell the kids school starts at 08:00. It is their job to be there or fail the course. Grades are based on achievement. Master the material and you get a good grade and are promoted to the next level. Fail to master the material and you will not be promoted, but will be given the opportunity to try again. Want to quit school? Fine, hit the road. Let me know how well you like washing dishes and flipping burgers when you are 29 and have a wife or partner screaming at you about paying the rent or buying clothes for the kids.

For at least 4,000 years kids have been puling this on their parents. Only in this generation were the parents stupid enough to believe it.

Wait a minute . . . ok, got the flame suit on . . . fire away. INCOMING!!!!

I don't know about the others, but the Chinese middle schools I visited varied from starting at 7:30 to 9:00 am. You also left out one other thing. Kid fails, I am held accountable. There's no "Fine, hit the road" to it, until I'm fired because the kids didn't care. My job is to get them to learn, even when they don't want to. (I knew that going in, and I actually enjoy the challenge).

Things are never so simple as we'd like to think they are, could be, or should be.

 

[96firephoenix]

hey, cuz educating kids should be all about passing the standardized tests!

I would posit that my learning has actually been hindered by these tests. Many times I have asked a teacher about a topic and had to learn it on my own because "we won't get into that in class. Its not on the test."

Homeschooling sounds more and more attractive.

 

[ATM]

The success of Chinese schools can probably be traced back to not observing daylight savings time.

The Chinese are very wise.

 

[tyler34]

satupid monroe county changes their elementary times this year and I probably wouldn't mind as much uf it was the same everyday but m,t,th,f they now go 8:35 to 3:50(stupid) and wednesday they go 9:35 to 3:50(stupid)

 

[Indy317]

I don't see how this all got approved.

The K-12 industrial complex seems to only care about two things: The administrators of the district and the teachers of the district. Everything else comes second.

For at least 4,000 years kids have been puling this on their parents. Only in this generation were the parents stupid enough to believe it.

Wait a minute . . . ok, got the flame suit on . . . fire away. INCOMING!!!!

The world has changed over 4,000 years. I agree with you on some of your points, but all the examples you gave are completely different now than in the past. For example, when the NYSE came into being, and for decades after that, I would agree that the broker who was up early likely did well than the one who wasn't. But look at how the world has changed over just the last 200 or so years. For starters, "back in the day" we were mostly an agricultural society outside of a few population centers on the east coast.

The NYSE was started in 1811. In 1850, NY state had a population of around 3M people. California had just 92,000 people. By 1910, NY had 9.1M, Calif. 2.3M. It wasn't till the late 1900s that California started really taking on more people than NY state. Even then, California is a lot bigger than NY, almost three times as big.

Over those same years, technology has changed tremendously. We also saw the destruction of the one-parent working household. The same broker who wanted to stay up late may not have lasted in NYC in the 1960s. With the world as inter connected as it is today, that same broker could specialize in Pacific or European stock markets and work more of a second or third shift, watching those markets at the times those markets are open.

I'm not even sure why we are having "school" as we have in the past. With technology, we should be looking at moving away from brick and mortar education and doing more on-line training. Of course this would never work, because now that we have no one in the home to watch the kids, we need K-12 more so as a babysitter than as a place to learn.

Universities are also fighting the change of a 24/7 world economy. They want to constantly build more and more buildings, to push that "college life experience" as a must have in life, or you will be a complete and total failure. All of this comes at a hefty price tag.

I think humans got up with the sun because a long, long time ago, the human species could see better in daylight than at night. As such, the species evolved to work around the sun. Things have changed. We invented ways to light up the world at night. We have decided as a world, that even with all of our differences, we would have global trade for the most part. If living by the sun was really that built into our DNA, we wouldn't need to force millions of people to be "early risers." I'm a natural early riser, though I go to bed early as well. I've always been one who liked getting up early, even when in my younger days I was able to stay up later and get plenty of rest on six-seven hours of sleep. Ten years later and I need seven, though I'm getting around eight now. On the other hand, I know people who need 10 hours of sleep on the weekend because they have all sorts of trouble getting up at sunrise even though they are in bed by 10PM during the work week.