LTCH Loophole??

[edsinger]

Was reading and came across something, basically if your gun was made before 1899, then no federal laws are applicable to it as it is an antique.

Do I understand this correctly?

 

[CarmelHP]

Correct, as long as it does not also qualify as an NFA firearm that has not been exempted from the NFA (e.g., SBR "Trapper" rifles made in the 19th century that were previously NFA are now exempted by ATF, but Colt-Browning Model 1895 machineguns are not). Title I antiques are not subject to FFL transfer or any other requirement in GCA '68 though some states may impose regulation. Indiana does not.

 

[rambone]

So the feds can't touch me when I'm carrying my antique cowboy gun! yeehaw!!

 

[INGunGuy]

You still cant carry your pistol that was manufactured before 1889 in Indiana without a LTCH, state law still applies.

INGunGuy

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Was reading and came across something, basically if your gun was made before 1899, then no federal laws are applicable to it as it is an antique.

Do I understand this correctly?

Not really.

Remember, there is federal law and then there is state law and the operation of the two together.

Look at Indiana Code 35-47-1-6 and report back.

 

[rkba_net]

IC 35-47-2-19
Application of chapter
Sec. 19. This chapter does not apply to any firearm not designed to use fixed cartridges or fixed ammunition, or any firearm made before January 1, 1899.
As added by P.L.311-1983, SEC.32.

 

[INGunGuy]

IC 35-47-2-19
Application of chapter
Sec. 19. This chapter does not apply to any firearm not designed to use fixed cartridges or fixed ammunition, or any firearm made before January 1, 1899.
As added by P.L.311-1983, SEC.32.

I have to say to be caught with a pistol manufactured before 1899 and NOT having a LTCH would be nothing more than a major headache. I dont care how old your pistol is, IMHO, and IANAL, but you better have your LTCH if you wanna carry it in Indiana.

INGunGuy

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I dont care how old your pistol is, IMHO, and IANAL, but you better have your LTCH if you wanna carry it in Indiana.

Maybe, but he is asking about the LTCH which exempts pre-1899 pistols. However, you have the interplay of two Indiana statutes, Indiana Code 35-47-2-19 and Indiana Code 35-47-1-6.

The prosecution will claim "any handgun" requires a license. Your attorney will say that it is exempted by §19 and that it should be construed against the State.

I would only carry pre-1899 that I, 1) can prove made before 1899, 2) don't mind losing to the property room for a few months, 3) can replace it, 4) on a temporary basis until I am waiting for the pink card to arrive in the mail and did not leave my property or shop.

Now, go read post #25 of this thread. In summary, get the license.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

then no federal laws are applicable to it as it is an antique.

Since I have been asked to clarify my "not really" in my first post, I shall do so now.

Outside of federal property there is no federal carry statute. In this case you would be governed by state law.

Look at what state law has to say about pre-1899 handguns. (Note, I would not do it unless you followed the four pre-conditions that I list, but that's just me). See the Gibbs case in post #25.

 

[edsinger]

OK I guess I misunderstood it then,

hypothetical situation then,

those convicted of certain crimes can not own guns, I have been told that they can own 'black powder' guns though.


I have my LTCH, but I was thinking, I know of a person that wants a gun for protection but can not buy one by law, (Not Indiana). I will not sell them mine for said reason. So I was thinking that they have the right to self protection, so the question is could they buy a say 1989 pistol that was made for black powder? Could they buy one at a gun show and keep in on their possession or just at home. Could they do it legally?

The only reason I ask is I have one and came across this law and thought they might be able to buy their own..

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I know of a person that wants a gun for protection but can not buy one by law, (Not Indiana). I will not sell them mine for said reason.

Look at how his state defines firearm. Then look to how his state defines those disqualified.

 

[public servant]

Silly me. I googled for a picture about "beating around the bush". Do NOT do that with the safe filter turned off. Holy moly!!!

 

[Scout]

Do you really want to carry a 110 year old pistol?

 

[edsinger]

Well I just find it interesting, even if not a 100 years old, someone can buy a lack powder pistol maybe. Can a felon own a black powder rifle?

 

[paddling_man]

Silly me. I googled for a picture about "beating around the bush". Do NOT do that with the safe filter turned off. Holy moly!!!

+1. Cool link.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Can a felon own a black powder rifle?

What flavor of felon? Regular felon vs. Serious Violent Felon. Indiana Code 35-47-4-5.

Are they on probation/parole? A condition of probation and parole is that the individual not own deadly weapons.

 

[edsinger]

Well let me ask this, if someone is buying a black powder pistol, does the yellow form get filled out? Is there a background check?

Plus I asked and found out the person I was asking about is not a felon but had been in trouble for domestic violence (deep southern US) and was turned down on a handgin purchase. BTW its a she.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

ed, now, now, what have we learned?

Right, first we look at how that state defines firearm and how it defines those disqualified from owning firearms. Then one looks at federal law and the Lautenberg Amendment.

Under federal law blackpowder firearms (with rare exceptions) can be purchased without a 4473 or, if one wants, via mail order.

 

[edsinger]

I guess they can buy it, but can they legally posses it? I would think so but am not sure.

Its a moot point I guess because the person I had in mind will NOT do the research and stuff, so she carries a knife for protection. It is just the laws that have me confused.

 

[Jack Ryan]

Was reading and came across something, basically if your gun was made before 1899, then no federal laws are applicable to it as it is an antique.

Do I understand this correctly?

Yes. Buy one that is stainless steel if you plan to use it this way. Save your self a lot of trouble.