Military BS Stories or the last liar wins.

[actaeon277]

Well, not a story...

In other threads there were derails where we talked about the mk.14 torpedo and it's problems.
Here is a 30 minute discussion on them.
This channel has a lot of good historical stuff.

The mk.14 was one of the WORST weapons inflicted upon its own side


[video=youtube_share;eQ5Ru7Zu_1I]https://youtu.be/eQ5Ru7Zu_1I[/video]

 

[actaeon277]

 

[Burchamj]

Back when I was in the Army at JBLM, Washington, we had an instance where they had found a couple of pieces of brass in one of the dumpsters in the motor pool. Our CSM decided to make the decision to have a truck dump every bit of garbage out and have all of us soldiers dig through it to fins any more brass that may have been in the dumpsters. Was a great time to be alive.

 

[maxwelhse]

Well, not a story...

In other threads there were derails where we talked about the mk.14 torpedo and it's problems.
Here is a 30 minute discussion on them.
This channel has a lot of good historical stuff.

The mk.14 was one of the WORST weapons inflicted upon its own side

Well, that explains something I was confused about after watching the movie Midway (what was alright). There's a scene where some commander makes a decision to go with dive bombers instead of torpedoes because "I don't trust those damn things". Seems like that was accurate!

Also... Didn't the Germans have some hydrogen propulsion system that was notorious for killing tons of their own crew? Something about rough handling or maybe a little bit of sea water starting a chemical reaction that would just gas everybody to death? Not sure about that one...

 

[actaeon277]

Well, that explains something I was confused about after watching the movie Midway (what was alright). There's a scene where some commander makes a decision to go with dive bombers instead of torpedoes because "I don't trust those damn things". Seems like that was accurate!

Also... Didn't the Germans have some hydrogen propulsion system that was notorious for killing tons of their own crew? Something about rough handling or maybe a little bit of sea water starting a chemical reaction that would just gas everybody to death? Not sure about that one...

Probably thinking of hydrogen peroxide (High Test Peroxide)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-test_peroxide

Some dangerous stuff. If you want an example, one that pops in my mind is the Russian submarine Kursk
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kursk_submarine_disaster

The Brits also lost a sub to it.



Then again, the US alternative is also pretty nasty.
Otto fuel
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_fuel_II
Though it doesn't have the nasty reaction HTP has with some metals.

 

[actaeon277]

It wasn't all danger and excitement.
Okay, it rarely is. Mostly boring... which is good. Danger and excitement means bad things are happening.

But some good times were had in the Caribbean.
One example is St. Croix, US Virgin Islands.

Here's one of the sunrises that I managed to get a half way decent photo of.

 

[actaeon277]

That pier was the deep water pier on one side of the island. Ships or subs would pull in there.
Other side of the island had a small boat marina.
This pier was actually removed by a hurricane near the end of my enlistment and we couldn't pull in.
We did a periscope view then.
No shore visit. We pulled outside a tourist beach, and everyone got some time on the periscope.
Kinda funny, a bunch of pervs, and no one on the beach knew.

 

[actaeon277]

Also, we pulled in one time, and a cruise ship pulled in.
It was a sister ship to the one in the TV show "Love Boat".
The TV show was the Sea Princess. This one was the Sky Princess.
So it pulled in, tied up, gang plank run over, and all the bubbleheads were anxiously awaiting all the beautiful women. We saw the TV show.
Turns out, it was mostly retired couples.



Anyway, I had come off watch, ate my breakfast, and decided to stretch the legs.
So I made my way to the cockpit on the bridge.
An older couple was talking to the topside watch, asking what those big things were on the deck.
(You can see them on the pic).
What they were, was DDS, Dry Deck Shelters.
At the time, they were classified.
The watch stander told them so.
But the couple told him, please, we're Americans.
I thought, right. Cause classified means just don't tell foreigners, just Americans.
Well, NOFORN means not to be released to foreign nationals.
Anyway, the watch stander made up a story about us using a lot of milk underwater on extended operations, and they were refrigerated storage tanks.

I laughed to myself. The watchstander basically gave us boobs.

 

[maxwelhse]

Probably thinking of hydrogen peroxide (High Test Peroxide)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-test_peroxide

Some dangerous stuff. If you want an example, one that pops in my mind is the Russian submarine Kursk
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kursk_submarine_disaster

The Brits also lost a sub to it.



Then again, the US alternative is also pretty nasty.
Otto fuel
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_fuel_II
Though it doesn't have the nasty reaction HTP has with some metals.

Yep. Kursk was what I was thinking of. Thanks!

If anybody doesn't want to read through the links to follow along (from Wiki):

HTP is normally stable until it comes in contact with a catalyst. It then expands 5,000 times in volume extremely rapidly, acting as an oxidiser, generating large volumes of steam and oxygen.[SUP][10][/SUP][SUP][72][/SUP] Ordinarily, the oxygen combines with kerosene fuel in the torpedo engine to propel the missile at higher speed and greater range than conventional torpedoes.[SUP][16][/SUP][SUP]:34[/SUP] Investigators concluded that the leaking HTP had catalytically decomposed when it came in contact with copper commonly found in the bronze and brass used to manufacture Kursk's torpedo tubes.[SUP][67][/SUP] The resulting overpressure ruptured the torpedo's kerosene fuel tank and caused an explosion that was registered as a weak seismic event on detectors hundreds of kilometres away.[SUP][73][/SUP] Once HTP begins oxidising, it is impossible to stop until the fuel is exhausted.[SUP][10][/SUP]
Analysis revealed that when the 1,000 kilograms (2,200 lb) of concentrated high-test peroxide and 500 kilograms (1,100 lb) of kerosene exploded, the internal torpedo tube cover and the external tube door were blown off, opening the torpedo room to the sea. Salvage crews located a piece of the number four torpedo hatch on the seabed 50 metres (160 ft) behind the main wreckage. Its position, distance, and direction relative to the rest of the submarine indicated that it was deposited there as a result of the first explosion in that tube.

 

[Hawkeye]

Well, that explains something I was confused about after watching the movie Midway (what was alright). There's a scene where some commander makes a decision to go with dive bombers instead of torpedoes because "I don't trust those damn things". Seems like that was accurate!
...

Nope. The US aircraft delivered torpedo was the Mk-13. Its not the MK-14. The problem with torpedo planes was their low and slow attack profile. the delivery system was getting shot down before it got to the launch point.

 

[nonobaddog]

Wow! A 26 inch thick piece of armor from a Japanese Yamamoto class battleship pierced by a U.S. 15 inch shell.

 

[maxwelhse]

Nope. The US aircraft delivered torpedo was the Mk-13. Its not the MK-14. The problem with torpedo planes was their low and slow attack profile. the delivery system was getting shot down before it got to the launch point.

Hummm... Unless I didn't follow along, the vid that ace linked says that all types used the same detonation device (from memory now... The Mark VI exploder?) and it was flawed for most of the war. Possibly both problems?

 

[Hawkeye]

Hummm... Unless I didn't follow along, the vid that ace linked says that all types used the same detonation device (from memory now... The Mark VI exploder?) and it was flawed for most of the war. Possibly both problems?

Thats ok. If you want to beleive what you saw in a Hollywood movie have at it.

 

[Hawkeye]

Not aware of the USN havign any 15" naval rifles. 16", 14" and 12" but 15"?

Wow! A 26 inch thick piece of armor from a Japanese Yamamoto class battleship pierced by a U.S. 15 inch shell.

 

[maxwelhse]

Thats ok. If you want to beleive what you saw in a Hollywood movie have at it.

The link he provided was a documentary about the torpedoes used in WW2. Not a Hollywood movie. It might be wrong, or I might have misunderstood it, but it was a good watch.

 

[nonobaddog]

Not aware of the USN havign any 15" naval rifles. 16", 14" and 12" but 15"?

That 15 inch number was in an email - don't take it as gospel. For all I know it could be any of the real sizes you mentioned.

Here is a clip I found about it - says it was a 16 inch shell.
==================
[h=4]WAR ARCHEOLOGY - thick armor from Japanese Yamato class battleship, pierced by a US Navy gun. The armor is on display at the US Navy Museum.[/h][h=4]What a 16 inch naval shell can do to a battleships armor as thick as the Yamato's was.[/h]==================
[h=4]It is not clear to me if this was from a shot at the real IJN Shinano or from a ballistics test done in 1987 using a piece of armor from IJN Shinano. Anyhow this chunk is supposedly on display at a Naval Museum.[/h]

 

[actaeon277]

Most torpedoes of the day had some problems.
The Mk.14 just happened to be the worst, have EVERY problem instead of A problem, and had a weapons department that refused to acknowledge it.

 

[actaeon277]

https://www.uboat.net/technical/torpedoes.htm
Germans had problems

 

[actaeon277]

https://ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/Admin-Hist/BuOrd/BuOrd-6.html

Mk.15 problems

 

[actaeon277]

https://www.pearlharboraviationmuseum.org/pearl-harbor-blog/pearl-harbor-thunderfish-in-the-sky/
Details about the Japanese torps.
Includes discussion on other navies