Mitch Daniels to run for President? - Gingrich thinks so.

[melensdad]

Do you want simple math? Mitch leased the toll road for 75 years for the sum of 3.9 billion dollars. He put $500 million in a trust and spent the rest, mostly in Marion County and along the toll road corridor. That means he spent 87.2% of the money and saved 12.8% of it. THAT is the simple math.

So what? The toll road cost money which means that we SPENT money just to support it. This way we got INCOME that could be spent. We still gain.

As for "money-losing toll road," how come the Aussies/Spanish consortium could figure out a way to turn a profit on a 3.9 billion investment, and good old Hoosier ingenuity can't?

That is a silly question, just like if the Catholic schools can teach kids better than the public school, using non-union teachers, paying low salaries, at a cost that is roughly 1/2 the cost of public edu-ma-cation then why do we even have public education?



Sometimes the system is so corrupt that its best to throw it out. Daniels my not have succeeded in every attempt at reform or repair, but overall he's done this state well.

We have greater job growth in Indiana than the national average, in fact its double. The jobs are also generally higher wage jobs than most being created nationally so while we are gaining jobs we are gaining them at higher wages too.

Perfect? No Daniels is not perfect. He could be more libertarian and get more non-essential services privatized. He could do more to downsize government and eliminate more programs and spending that are not mandated by our constitution (BTW in Indiana public education can't be eliminated because it is a constitutional mandate).

By dang near doubling our sales tax? 4% to 7%?

I don't like that either but honestly I'd rather he raise sales tax than income tax or excise taxes. At least the sales tax is applied to everyone across the board, short of a FLAT TAX it is about as close to a 'fair tax' as is possible. But while he has raised our income taxes we have also seen lower property taxes (my taxes dropped 30% on my property) and overall the property taxes in this state have dropped, even if only by a few % on average.

Nobody likes taxes, but if you are going to have a tax, the best taxes are those that that are not hidden, are evenly applied to all, and that allow for consumers to choose not to pay them by not using/buying the good/service. Our Indiana sales tax hits those points pretty well.

 

[CarmelHP]

I lived in this state for 21 years and the sales tax has never been lower than 5%, it rose to 6% under Mitch's predecessor, and is now 7%. If that's a doubling, you need a math course.

Also, the consortium may not be able to make money. The WSJ reported that the projected revenue the purchase was based on was overinflated, and they overpaid by as much as 50%. But who cares if they make money, the fact is the state didn't make money on it before. We got their money, we took them good, the road ain't going anywhere and the consortium still has to pick up the expenses. When I hear arguments about how this was such a bad deal I begin to wonder if this state really is full of morons. That, and the 2008 election results.

 

[AELLIS]

Mitch Daniels is definitely the fiscal conservative we need in the White House. Some people say that he is doesn't show much enthusiasm, but I have personally been around him during some of his speeches and I can tell he truly cares about Hoosiers. He is one of the few governors in the Union that is actively bringing business into the states.

My Man Mitch 2012!

 

[Prometheus]

I don't like that either but honestly I'd rather he raise sales tax than income tax or excise taxes. At least the sales tax is applied to everyone across the board, short of a FLAT TAX it is about as close to a 'fair tax' as is possible. But while he has raised our income taxes we have also seen lower property taxes (my taxes dropped 30% on my property) and overall the property taxes in this state have dropped, even if only by a few % on average.

Nobody likes taxes, but if you are going to have a tax, the best taxes are those that that are not hidden, are evenly applied to all, and that allow for consumers to choose not to pay them by not using/buying the good/service. Our Indiana sales tax hits those points pretty well.

I think a sales tax is the only way a State should be getting revenue from it's Citizens.

Property taxes should be abolished.

I don't know how long you've been in your house, but my old house saw an increase of 100% over 6 years and then a drop of maybe 30%. It's still up about 25% of what it was when I moved in.

Mitch needs to be cutting spending. Not raising our taxes.

I would have completely supported the near doubling of our sales tax ONLY if property taxes were abolished in the process.

It wasn't and thus mitch is a douche. That is as kind as I can be to someone who fully doubled my taxes (when you take into account property tax increases).

The productive portion of society is over taxed. We're tired of paying for everyone else. Slash and burn our taxes or I'm seriously considering "going galt".

 

[Prometheus]

I lived in this state for 21 years and the sales tax has never been lower than 5%, it rose to 6% under Mitch's predecessor, and is now 7%. If that's a doubling, you need a math course.

I said "near doubling". In 2002 the sales tax was 4% not 5. I'm guessing you are 21 and didn't pay attention to the sales tax until you were 18~.

 

[NordicHeathenVinlander]

America doesnt need a Mitch type republican, we need a Traditional American conservative like Buchanan; And if not him, someone obviously in line with his beliefs. A Jan Brewer or dear I say someone more akin to my own beliefs.

Dem/Republican.... Can someone really show me the differences between the party elites???

America needs to undue everything that has been ruining this Nation, and that wont happen as long as we keep electing the same people, and keep tolerating this red vs blue drama agenda soap opera.

Again, I suppose any good canidate wont run, nor would he or SHE get elected. Neocons (RINOS) and Liberals-Communist have a firm deathgrip on the American pysche and will not let go with out a hard fight.

 

[melensdad]

I think a sales tax is the only way a State should be getting revenue from it's Citizens.

Property taxes should be abolished.

I don't know how long you've been in your house, but my old house saw an increase of 100% over 6 years and then a drop of maybe 30%. It's still up about 25% of what it was when I moved in.

Pro, you are looking at the very small picture, not the whole state or even similar properties.

When I lived in Highland (purchased 26 years ago) I got my first property tax bill and it was $500. I was shocked. How could it be so low? $500 won't pay for the school, the sidewalk, or the police patrol.

Then I bought a building in Highland (purchased 21 years ago) it was a commercial property. The tax bill was $77,000. I was shocked. How could it be so high?

Then I built a new home outside of Lowell (16 years ago) on rural property. The tax bill was almost $9000. I was shocked. How could it be so high? Heck it was built adjacent to a dirt road!

Then the folks in St John sued the state over property taxes. Our Supreme Court ruled that taxes were unfair. They stabilized the taxes and industrial/commercial properties, which were paying an unfair burden, came down. New homes were taxed higher than old homes even if old homes were valued/worth more than new homes?

So the court fixed it. Now a $100,000 home is taxed just like the $100,000 down the street, even if one is 30 years old and the other one is brand new. Now a commercial/industrial property cannot be taxed at 5x, 10x or 20x the rate of another property that is worth the same amount of money but in a different tax category.

You are ONLY looking at YOUR 'old' home and YOUR 'new' home and making an overly simplistic comparison. You can't look at your drop of 30% in any way other than as it relates to all the other properties in your entire township/taxing area. If you got a drop its because you were OVERPAYING up to that point and many of your neighbors were UNDERPAYING. Your taxes would go up more than theirs because your home was a few years newer or you had some remodeling done (maybe before you got there) on your home that got it reassessed at a higher value than your neighbors, or the folks down the block, or a 1/2 mile away.

The tax system was broken badly. I'm not saying it is fixed now, but it is a whole hell of a lot more equal today than it was.

The old system was simple redistribution. Heck something like 50% of the properties in Hammond, Gary and East Chicago were paying something like $100 or less. So what if they got hit with a 500% increase and now pay $500 per year? That just brings them up to the level of barely covering basic services. On the other hand, someone paying $3000 gets a 50% drop and is still paying $1500, but at least the properties are now closer to parity.

I agree Mitch needs to cut spending. He did that. There is more to cut. There is more to fix. But we started out in bad shape, now we are in pretty good shape. Still have to fix the public employee pension fund, but he's got some more time in office and other problems to fix.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

The same property tax situation hit a lot of older areas of Marion County, where property taxes had been kept artificially low - for various reasons. It certainly caused a lot of pain and suffering to some homeowners. We came out just about even, perhaps because we have a newer home. I don't see how anyone can _logically_ blame Daniels for property taxes; although his office had input into negotiations, it was the State Legislature that wrote the tax laws.

Mitch Daniels won my admiration when he didn't follow the conventions of his neighbors, but mandated spending cuts every time revenue projections fell. Not popular choices, perhaps, but principled. I can appreciate a principled politician, whether I agree with him or not on every issue. Of course, a principled politician is kind of like a snark...really hard to find.

 

[CarmelHP]

I said "near doubling". In 2002 the sales tax was 4% not 5. I'm guessing you are 21 and didn't pay attention to the sales tax until you were 18~.

The sales tax hasn't been 4% since 1982. I think you don't know what you're talking about. You're the one not paying attention, or acting like it.

Oct. 24, 1963* 2% May 1, 1973 4% Jan. 1, 1983 5% Dec. 1, 2002 thru March 31, 2008 6% April 1, 2008 thru present 7%
*Sales tax first adopted.

 

[melensdad]

Oct. 24, 1963* 2%
May 1, 1973 4%
Jan. 1, 1983 5%
Dec. 1, 2002 thru March 31, 2008 6%
April 1, 2008 thru present 7%

*Sales tax first adopted.​

For those who do not know, Mitch Daniels began service as our Governor in January 2005. Which means he came into office and the sales tax was already 6%. It did go up 1% during his tenure and is now 7%.

 

[$mooth]

Property taxes should be abolished.

I agree with this mainly because if I pay cash for a house, then lose my job/retire, the state shouldn't be able to take it away from me because of taxes.

I know, in the US i'm never really a land owner as the state can take property way for a multitude of reasons; but i've got a problem with that.

 

[Expat]

I said "near doubling". In 2002 the sales tax was 4% not 5. I'm guessing you are 21 and didn't pay attention to the sales tax until you were 18~.

The sales tax hasn't been 4% since 1982. I think you don't know what you're talking about. You're the one not paying attention, or acting like it.

Oct. 24, 1963* 2% May 1, 1973 4% Jan. 1, 1983 5% Dec. 1, 2002 thru March 31, 2008 6% April 1, 2008 thru present 7%
*Sales tax first adopted.

For those who do not know, Mitch Daniels began service as our Governor in January 2005. Which means he came into office and the sales tax was already 6%. It did go up 1% during his tenure and is now 7%.

So it went up almost 17%... that's kinda sorta like 100%... right?

 

[CarmelHP]

Property taxes should be abolished.

I don't know how long you've been in your house, but my old house saw an increase of 100% over 6 years and then a drop of maybe 30%. It's still up about 25% of what it was when I moved in.

Mitch needs to be cutting spending. Not raising our taxes.

I would have completely supported the near doubling of our sales tax ONLY if property taxes were abolished in the process.

It wasn't and thus mitch is a douche. That is as kind as I can be to someone who fully doubled my taxes (when you take into account property tax increases).

The productive portion of society is over taxed. We're tired of paying for everyone else. Slash and burn our taxes or I'm seriously considering "going galt".

You know that property taxes are set at the local level, not state, right? The only part of the equation that the state gets involved with is in limiting the increases. Aren't you a public employee, which tax pays your salary?

Why do people keep announcing that they're "going Galt" instead of just doing it?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

The sales tax hasn't been 4% since 1982.

For those who do not know, Mitch Daniels began service as our Governor in January 2005. Which means he came into office and the sales tax was already 6%. It did go up 1% during his tenure and is now 7%

Carmel and mel, this is where you are both wrong. Mitch Daniels has access to the Haliburton/NRA time machine and teleported back to 1982 (Terminator style) to unilaterally raise the sales tax to 7%. He then teleported back to 2005, cloned himself to replaced the entire Indiana General Assembly to prevent the abolition of property taxes.

I don't see how anyone can _logically_ blame Daniels for property taxes; although his office had input into negotiations, it was the State Legislature that wrote the tax laws.

Black, because of the time travel and the cloning. Duh!

 

[melensdad]

Carmel and mel, this is where you are both wrong. Mitch Daniels has access to the Haliburton/NRA time machine and teleported back to 1982 . . . He then teleported back to 2005, cloned himself . . . the time travel and the cloning. Duh!

But SPOCK and the Vulcan High Council have indicated that time travel is illogical and cannot be done

 

[Prometheus]

The sales tax hasn't been 4% since 1982. I think you don't know what you're talking about. You're the one not paying attention, or acting like it.

Oct. 24, 1963* 2% May 1, 1973 4% Jan. 1, 1983 5% Dec. 1, 2002 thru March 31, 2008 6% April 1, 2008 thru present 7%
*Sales tax first adopted.

I'm the one not paying attention? Did you even read your copy paste?

By your figures, on November 30th 2002 the sales tax was 4%.

Let me rephrase, for the first 11 months of 2002 the sales tax was 4% in Indiana.

Melensdad, good point on daniels election date. He still sucks wind though, maybe not as much as his predecessor, but sucking is sucking.

 

[CarmelHP]

I'm the one not paying attention? Did you even read your copy paste?

By your figures, on November 30th 2002 the sales tax was 4%.

Let me rephrase, for the first 11 months of 2002 the sales tax was 4% in Indiana.

Melensdad, good point on daniels election date. He still sucks wind though, maybe not as much as his predecessor, but sucking is sucking.

You need a math AND reading course. The sales tax became 5% on January 1, 1983 where it stayed until December 1, 2002 when it became 6%; and on April 1, 2008, it became 7%. Unbelievable you could misread this abjectly. is right.