Indy_Guy_77
Grandmaster
- Apr 30, 2008
- 16,576
- 48
As I'm sure many of you may remember, I posted (a few times, actually) about an old shotgun that came to me after my grandfather passed away several years ago.
It's of a vintage and condition to make formal ID quite difficult!
BUT, with the work of some folks across the pond, an ID has been made!
The folks at Photos d'armes de collection, a group of firearms enthusiasts/hobbiests like delving into the older stuff, both to research origins AND in restoration. I think their speciality is Belgian firearms; as we all know Belgium was THE PLACE for the arms manufacturing and trade industries for SEVERAL decades (from the 1800's through WWI).
And since I was able to to determine on my own that my shotgun was of Belgian origin, I thought I'd inquire to the experts for help!
Help me they did!
Below are some photos of my shotgun and the formal ID. Keep in mind that the writer of the ID doesn't speak English as a first language, some of the grammar and syntax reflect that.
***********
It is about a rifle doubles of hunting.
The juxtaposed barrels are smooth, of gauge 18,2 mm.
Locks are of retrograde type “behind” and key of opening between the external dogs.
The stock in wood (walnut tree?) is cut way pistol.
The buttplate seems to be in moulded horn.
The punches are those of the proofhouse of Liege, namely:
ELG on star in an oval: final acceptance, of use of 1846 to 1893.
S under star: countermark of the controller post 1877.
EL in English letters: provisional test, of use of 1852 to our days.
Peron: inspection post 1853.
18, 2: gauge in mm, of use of 1889 to our days. (My note- as near as I can tell, 18.2mm bore diameter is somewhere in the 'hood of 12-13gauge.)
Period of manufacture: between 1889 and 1893.
The other marks are:
NF: it is about the mark of NEUMANN Frères and Co mechanical factories of firearms, registered voters with the proofhouse of 1860 to 1863 follow-ups of NEUMANN Frères registers of 1863 to 1924. The company had its seat in Liege street Saint Remy 15.
In 1924 the company changes corporate name to become NEUMANN & Co registered with the proofhouse of 1924 to 1962. (See our site)
Letters N in a circle, GR. and AD are unknown for me; it probably acts of marks of subcontractors.
The buttplate in moulded horn presents the image of a daguet and again interlaced letters NF of Neumann Frères.
Géo FISHER: is undoubtedly the mark affixed subsequently by a detailing arms manufacturer.
-J-
It's of a vintage and condition to make formal ID quite difficult!
BUT, with the work of some folks across the pond, an ID has been made!
The folks at Photos d'armes de collection, a group of firearms enthusiasts/hobbiests like delving into the older stuff, both to research origins AND in restoration. I think their speciality is Belgian firearms; as we all know Belgium was THE PLACE for the arms manufacturing and trade industries for SEVERAL decades (from the 1800's through WWI).
And since I was able to to determine on my own that my shotgun was of Belgian origin, I thought I'd inquire to the experts for help!
Help me they did!
Below are some photos of my shotgun and the formal ID. Keep in mind that the writer of the ID doesn't speak English as a first language, some of the grammar and syntax reflect that.
***********
It is about a rifle doubles of hunting.
The juxtaposed barrels are smooth, of gauge 18,2 mm.
Locks are of retrograde type “behind” and key of opening between the external dogs.
The stock in wood (walnut tree?) is cut way pistol.
The buttplate seems to be in moulded horn.
The punches are those of the proofhouse of Liege, namely:
ELG on star in an oval: final acceptance, of use of 1846 to 1893.
S under star: countermark of the controller post 1877.
EL in English letters: provisional test, of use of 1852 to our days.
Peron: inspection post 1853.
18, 2: gauge in mm, of use of 1889 to our days. (My note- as near as I can tell, 18.2mm bore diameter is somewhere in the 'hood of 12-13gauge.)
Period of manufacture: between 1889 and 1893.
The other marks are:
NF: it is about the mark of NEUMANN Frères and Co mechanical factories of firearms, registered voters with the proofhouse of 1860 to 1863 follow-ups of NEUMANN Frères registers of 1863 to 1924. The company had its seat in Liege street Saint Remy 15.
In 1924 the company changes corporate name to become NEUMANN & Co registered with the proofhouse of 1924 to 1962. (See our site)
Letters N in a circle, GR. and AD are unknown for me; it probably acts of marks of subcontractors.
The buttplate in moulded horn presents the image of a daguet and again interlaced letters NF of Neumann Frères.
Géo FISHER: is undoubtedly the mark affixed subsequently by a detailing arms manufacturer.
-J-
