NWI INGO General Post - Part 10

[gunbunnies]

My customers pay for results.... If I want to work then I have to supply those results.

I don't have a union or any mcse qualifications, I do have 30 years of working with computer equipment and customers that want their computers to do a job.

I have customers that want it done right and those that want another bandage put on it to get them through another day, I do what the customer wants. Am I considered educated or qualified by some big companies standards, nope..... Do I put the world back together for a small business that is in dire straights when they call me at midnight, yes...

Again my only problem in this whole day to day thing is the price of gas....

 

[sadclownwp]

I guess you must of skipped over the duties involved. Till you become a journeyman its 8 weeks schooling and on the job training and even after that you still are learning. In our Dept you never know what you may see you have to be able to problem solve and that takes skill especially when your the one which will decide how long that train carrying your precious goods sits on the main. So yes it is in fact skilled labor. If you have a problem with unions take it up with the leadership not the rank and file. We work just as hard if not harder than in the past because its a sour economy and we were lucky to snag a job that pays extremely well for our families to be taken care of. The leadership has mostly leaned demo till these past elections. To me sounds like you want all us union guys to give up our pay and struggle like you. Sorry buddy if your jealous of the pay and benefits or couldn't pass a test to move up that's your problem not mine. We need manufacturing jobs in this country and the skilled labor. To bad the demos are against it since we could pump so much oil out and export to the world. This not unions is why our gas prices are going back up. Middle class jobs are union jobs.

Now personally attacking me I see, could not get your jollies any other way? I did not skip over what was involved. But 8 weeks of training plus on the job training is still not to be considered skilled labor. Brain surgery is skilled labor, electrical engineering is skilled labor. Piloting a space shuttle is skilled labor. You hide behind phrases like doing it for your family, how is that different than socialists saying lets do (insert horrible socialist idea) for the country. I would respect it more if union members would stop hiding behind the phrase family and said, they just do it for themselves.

By the way, I am not anti union. I actually hate the use of Illegal Aliens much much more. And you can't be truly anti union and anti illegal immigration. The two just don't jive together well. I am simply saying that if someone else can do, or can be trained to the job for cheaper, than as a capitalist, I support that. As for you quoting me and calling me out saying I can't pass some test... You have made a mistake. I now challenge you to get me a copy of this test you speak of. I will answer the questions on it. If I don't pass it, I'll spew pro union worlds on ingo. If I pass it, you buy me a 100 round of 9mm.

 

[gunbunnies]

OK wait I got three problems with world...

Cost of gas, availability of ammo, and the cost of insulin..... or lack of a cure to let me not mind the cost of insulin...

rant done... back to filming...

 

[bradmedic04]

Wow, you anti union guys sound like you want a race to the bottom. Would you really want someone with 8 weeks of training to build you a new home? Carpenters, electricians, plumbers, ect? Or better yet, let them assemble and repair your car that transports your wife and kids? Or maybe build and repair commercial aircraft? Sounds like a GREAT idea to me. SHM...

Proud Member of IAM&AW Mechanics Local 701

Free market would weed out those unable to do quality work. Companies that under-trained would go under, and the ones that did jobs correctly would thrive.

Don't get me wrong...I don't really care if one is in a union or not, but I do know that the politicians who support unions tend to also support things that I don't agree with----perpetuating the welfare state, chipping away at our 2A rights, bankrupting our country, etc.

There's a billboard in Chicago I've driven by several times, proclaiming a particular union pipefitter's support for Rahm Emmanuel. That guy has a national stage he uses to denigrate us 2A supporters in general, and us Indiana gun owners in particular for flooding Chicago streets with illegal guns. This is horse****, and I can't support it.

 

[1775usmarine]

Now personally attacking me I see, could not get your jollies any other way? I did not skip over what was involved. But 8 weeks of training plus on the job training is still not to be considered skilled labor. Brain surgery is skilled labor, electrical engineering is skilled labor. Piloting a space shuttle is skilled labor. You hide behind phrases like doing it for your family, how is that different than socialists saying lets do (insert horrible socialist idea) for the country. I would respect it more if union members would stop hiding behind the phrase family and said, they just do it for themselves.

By the way, I am not anti union. I actually hate the use of Illegal Aliens much much more. And you can't be truly anti union and anti illegal immigration. The two just don't jive together well. I am simply saying that if someone else can do, or can be trained to the job for cheaper, than as a capitalist, I support that. As for you quoting me and calling me out saying I can't pass some test... You have made a mistake. I now challenge you to get me a copy of this test you speak of. I will answer the questions on it. If I don't pass it, I'll spew pro union worlds on ingo. If I pass it, you buy me a 100 round of 9mm.

I have better things to do than get in a pissing match online especially when you attack my profession. I'm the primary worker in my house so yes I am doing it for my wife and future kids as well. But I choose if I will take the OT call and 90% of the time I do take it. Even after telling you all my job description you fail to do your own research on it to see it is skilled labor and as stated several times above is ongoing learning any job is. You contradict yourself in your 2 paragraphs you hate when we say family yet are not anti union. You want others to do it for half the wage yet say your not anti union. Sounds pretty anti union to me. And yes you can be anti union and immigration if you so chose to believe that. You can also make the argument that you can pull some guy off the street and train them cheaper and pay less to do any of the jobs you say are skilled labor. Everyone wants to be wealthy. Union jobs provide a way for that to happen. The slim chance of being middle class without student debt is through the unions not the redistribution of wealth or making a union worker make half pay so they can hire someone else as well to make up the other half. As for your test I will let you know when the next hiring session is and you can show up and take the test. This way you can the amount of people vying for 12 high paying jobs.

 

[1775usmarine]

Free market would weed out those unable to do quality work. Companies that under-trained would go under, and the ones that did jobs correctly would thrive.

Don't get me wrong...I don't really care if one is in a union or not, but I do know that the politicians who support unions tend to also support things that I don't agree with----perpetuating the welfare state, chipping away at our 2A rights, bankrupting our country, etc.

There's a billboard in Chicago I've driven by several times, proclaiming a particular union pipefitter's support for Rahm Emmanuel. That guy has a national stage he uses to denigrate us 2A supporters in general, and us Indiana gun owners in particular for flooding Chicago streets with illegal guns. This is horse****, and I can't support it.

The rahm thing is from the leadership of the union not the rank and file. Democrats are turning their backs on the manufacturing secttor as they don't want to create any high paying jobs. Some of the unions have seen this and are backing republicans who are for drill baby drill and other manufacturing jobs.

 

[lonehoosier]

Lone, it never does.

At least so far it's been a pretty easy job. The only issue I had was getting the gearbox housing off of the shaft due to the sheer pins wobble out the holes, all it took was a little filing. So far I'm only in the hole for about 112 bucks in parts.

 

[bradmedic04]

Lone, I got a shovel you can borrow anytime.

 

[CTC B4Z]

its funny, I jump down one particular unions contract and ALL the OTHER unions boys jump out and defend them...

Do you REALLY think the contract that PARTICULAR USW crew is fair? what is it, like a $7500/ per head sign on and 6% raise every year IIRC....?

THAT is rediculous.

I never attacked all unions, I have been trying to actually land a union job for quite some time until recently decided I dont want anything to do with it. This was a particular stab at the refinery guys that are calling for that rediculous contract when big oil is at an all time low.

I have no issue with the railroad guys, I myself have been applying and testing for years until I finally realized how much of your life it takes over and it wasnt for me

 

[Bill B]

Sadclown; "skilled labor" has a specific meaning and you know it. I, too, work for a railroad and in my company a shop laborer goes through 4-6 weeks of training before being allowed to step foot on the shop floor. This ain't retail where you can be taught the basics of the job and left on your own after a week. The car side can be much more difficult than the locomotive side as there are many different types of cars and they all have their own set of acceptable inspection parameters, not to mention owner-specific requirements. On the locomotive side we don't have as many different models to deal with, but they are much more technically advanced. Todays' locomotive has more computers running it than the space shuttle had flight computers. If you think that RR's aren't "skilled labor" ask around on INGO, I know of several people with years of experience in the automotive, heavy truck, and construction equipment repair fields that cannot get into the RR because of lack of qualifications.
Don't denigrate that which you have zero knowledge of.

 

[baddyna96]

its funny, I jump down one particular unions contract and ALL the OTHER unions boys jump out and defend them...

Do you REALLY think the contract that PARTICULAR USW crew is fair? what is it, like a $7500/ per head sign on and 6% raise every year IIRC....?

THAT is rediculous.

I never attacked all unions, I have been trying to actually land a union job for quite some time until recently decided I dont want anything to do with it. This was a particular stab at the refinery guys that are calling for that rediculous contract when big oil is at an all time low.

I have no issue with the railroad guys, I myself have been applying and testing for years until I finally realized how much of your life it takes over and it wasnt for me

I can't respond to whether or not the offer to the USW is fair or not, without seeing the entire offer. I'm sure it has to be more than just monetary.

If you don't mind me asking, what trade do you work in?

 

[bradmedic04]

I can't respond to whether or not the offer to the USW is fair or not, without seeing the entire offer. I'm sure it has to be more than just monetary.

If you don't mind me asking, what trade do you work in?

Pimpin' hoes and clockin' the grip, if I remember correctly.

 

[Andy219]

Most rail jobs have pay that reflect the "skilled" part. In the first year most crafts receive 75% pay! followed by a 5% increase per year. Until you reach 100%. I can assure you that not every Tom, Dick, and Harry can continue to be employed by a railroad. As others stated there is classroom involved for 4-12 weeks before being allowed to actually work in that field. Most of the classroom is rules based with slight information on the actual job. Then after classroom there's another several weeks to several months, depending on the craft, of on the job training. On the job training is basically shadowing a more experienced/skilled member of the craft.

Whether it be track, car, locomotive, dispatchers, or train service I can guarantee that rail jobs are filled by skilled laborers. And when it comes to some of the crap we haul in the numbers we haul them, the public should require no less. I'm not anti-union, I'm not pro-union. I do believe there are certain occupations where unions are a necessary evil, and there are certain occupations where unions have no place.

Now if anyone believes that railroad jobs aren't skilled labor, then I guess that's your opinion. But in my 17 years as a rail employee, I've seen a lot of folks, bright-eyed and bushy tailed get hired, only to be fired a short time later. I've seen my fair share of injuries of myself and others. Some minor and some serious. I've seen people loose body parts, people become disabled, and one die. And those experiences don't include the things I seen done to the "general public", those were done to some damn good railroaders. So I do take slight offense when I see people say the railroad crafts aren't a "skilled" labor.

_________________

Back to your regularly scheduled break room chat.

 

[bradmedic04]

Andy....you guys hiring? RR sounds like the place to be...though I've always been white collar so I'd probably have to do something nerdy or be a project manager again.

 

[sadclownwp]

I have better things to do than get in a pissing match online especially when you attack my profession. I'm the primary worker in my house so yes I am doing it for my wife and future kids as well. But I choose if I will take the OT call and 90% of the time I do take it. Even after telling you all my job description you fail to do your own research on it to see it is skilled labor and as stated several times above is ongoing learning any job is. You contradict yourself in your 2 paragraphs you hate when we say family yet are not anti union. You want others to do it for half the wage yet say your not anti union. Sounds pretty anti union to me. And yes you can be anti union and immigration if you so chose to believe that. You can also make the argument that you can pull some guy off the street and train them cheaper and pay less to do any of the jobs you say are skilled labor. Everyone wants to be wealthy. Union jobs provide a way for that to happen. The slim chance of being middle class without student debt is through the unions not the redistribution of wealth or making a union worker make half pay so they can hire someone else as well to make up the other half. As for your test I will let you know when the next hiring session is and you can show up and take the test. This way you can the amount of people vying for 12 high paying jobs.

I understand, I have stated a simple request and you can't comply. I get it, not everyone is up the the challenge in front of them, it's ok. You talk of contradiction and then speak of union members as wealthy. If they are wealthy, they are not in the middle class.

I did my research. Still seems like a fresh out of high school job to me. I know you may consider it to be skilled labor. I have seen truly skilled labor. Anything that you can start off doing with 8 weeks of training is not skilled labor. Even if it requires that you continue to learn on the job. I know it might be skilled labor to you. No one is contesting that. But if it only takes 8 weeks of training to start off, then it is just entry level. In all honesty though, it seems to take as much skill as playing world of warcraft and being in a top 100 progression guild.

 

[Snapdragon]

[video=youtube;vnmyNOkqN6g]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnmyNOkqN6g[/video]

 

[Andy219]

The CN is hiring, I'm not sure what positions they're hiring for right now. But I know they'll be hiring throughout the year for most crafts.

Http://www.cn.ca

Look for the career section and don't narrow down your location, just choose US. You'll have to scroll through more jobs, but I've heard from some if you choose a specific location, you're likely to miss a couple.

 

[baddyna96]

I understand, I have stated a simple request and you can't comply. I get it, not everyone is up the the challenge in front of them, it's ok. You talk of contradiction and then speak of union members as wealthy. If they are wealthy, they are not in the middle class.

I did my research. Still seems like a fresh out of high school job to me. I know you may consider it to be skilled labor. I have seen truly skilled labor. Anything that you can start off doing with 8 weeks of training is not skilled labor. Even if it requires that you continue to learn on the job. I know it might be skilled labor to you. No one is contesting that. But if it only takes 8 weeks of training to start off, then it is just entry level. In all honesty though, it seems to take as much skill as playing world of warcraft and being in a top 100 progression guild.

Starting a job with minimum skills and learning as you go is called an apprenticeship. Nothing new here. At least in a union setting, covered by a collective bargaining agreement.

 

[lonehoosier]

My baby is back up and running again

 

[baddyna96]

My baby is back up and running again

That was fast!