My wife leases vehicles and had a Honda CR-V on her last one. Part of the deal was free oil changes for the life of the lease. Dealer botched an oil change and it was leaking badly when she got home but no warning lights had lit up. I called them and, sounding like he was in a panic, the service manager said don't start it, we'll have a flatbed there shortly. Don't know if there was any long term damage as it went back a few months later but they were less than happy with some alleged mechanic, I'm sure.
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oil change, no oil....wtf?
- Thread starter CHCRandy
- Start date
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4651feeder
Expert
As does mine, but at this point the extent has not been determined. Why would someone lawyer up now without knowing what the Oil Change Co is willing to do ?
thunderchicken
Grandmaster
This type of stuff shouldn't happen, but it does.
I could probably write a book about some of the stupid stuff I have seen working in shops over the years.
IMHO all too often dumb stuff like this happens either because it is so repetitive people get complacent and stuff gets over looked. Or people get interrupted in the middle of a job and when they come back to it they overlook something. Usually it isn't because they don't care. To guys in most shops (maybe not so much quick lube shops) this isn't just a job, it's their career. They care much more than a typical kid working at the fast food places. Again it shouldn't happen but it does sometimes. The engine in this case will probably be fine and will most likely last just as long as any other with similar miles on it.
I wouldn't be looking for a replacement at this point but would be in contact and keep it documented should a problem arise in the next 3-4k miles. I mean it's a Kia with almost 80k miles on it. Unless it was bought new, there is no way to know how it was taken care of or driven before. I would just drive it and keep an eye out for the next month or two.
I could probably write a book about some of the stupid stuff I have seen working in shops over the years.
IMHO all too often dumb stuff like this happens either because it is so repetitive people get complacent and stuff gets over looked. Or people get interrupted in the middle of a job and when they come back to it they overlook something. Usually it isn't because they don't care. To guys in most shops (maybe not so much quick lube shops) this isn't just a job, it's their career. They care much more than a typical kid working at the fast food places. Again it shouldn't happen but it does sometimes. The engine in this case will probably be fine and will most likely last just as long as any other with similar miles on it.
I wouldn't be looking for a replacement at this point but would be in contact and keep it documented should a problem arise in the next 3-4k miles. I mean it's a Kia with almost 80k miles on it. Unless it was bought new, there is no way to know how it was taken care of or driven before. I would just drive it and keep an eye out for the next month or two.
This just keeps getting weirder. The store manager got with us and said he reviewed video and they most certainly forgot to add oil......we had not even asked about video I decided to wait to drain oil until I speak with district manager tomorrow.....in case he wants it to go to Kia for them to do inspection.
Are you near Fort Wayne? I would have oc shop pull sample. With you present to maintain integrity the send it off to Blackstone Labs for analyst. They will be able to test for presence of wear metal in the oil. Could tell you a whole lot.
Just my .02
Lack of oil in a running engine is like a brain without oxygen. The longer it goes the more damage is done. In both cases there WILL be long term damage. The only question is "how much?". In both cases it can be hard to quantify. There is zero chance that zero damage was done. Thats a given.
No sir....I am just West of Indianapolis, in Danville/Avon area. I like your idea, kind of fair to us both. And I guess any metal is too much metal? I know if I take it to Kia and tell them what happened and I need an inspection, they are gonna say it needs an engine whether it does or not, and it will kill my trade in value to them if they know. If this engine stalled from no oil, I am sure it has to be damaged, like CM and Cameramonkey and others said though......how much damage? I am assuming any damage, is enough damage.
Jaybird1980
Grandmaster
Polaris Laboratories is in Indy, there may be others as well
Years ago my grandfather had his oil changed at a stiff you lube. They forgot the oil and his car died.
They tried to refund his bill.
He was a lawyer. They ended up paying for replacement engine.
After that. I always check my oil level after a change.
They tried to refund his bill.
He was a lawyer. They ended up paying for replacement engine.
After that. I always check my oil level after a change.
Years ago (about 20), a friend of mine bought a new Saturn L200. He had about 10,000 miles on it and was getting, I think, his 3rd change (he was meticulous and most people didn't use synthetic back then), and they somehow got the wrong oil filter on it. On the way home, he lost oil pressure and the engine seized. He ended up getting a brand new engine installed by the Saturn dealer and the oil place paid for a warranty that would match the original (with the new engine, Saturn would only warranty the engine for 12 months/12,000 miles).
While I agree that it looks like they owe her an engine, they would owe her an engine equivalent to what was destroyed, not necessarily a new one.
While I agree that it looks like they owe her an engine, they would owe her an engine equivalent to what was destroyed, not necessarily a new one.
Just like running a 1911 dry. Not usually a good idea. Most times the Stealership will recommend a new engine for liability purposes. In all probability there is damage, the Open item is time, how long before it becomes obvious?
Hopefully they will do right by you.
Just a little update. The owner of the franchised store called me today. He has 5 stores in Indianapolis area. Super nice guy. Wasn't real helpful as far as telling me what to do, because he had never been thru this....but he told me to do whatever I needed to do to have it checked and he will pay whatever the dealer says to make it right. He apologized many times and I assured him I know we are all humans, mistakes happen. I just dropped it off at an automotive repair shop I have used before. They are going to do an inspection tomorrow, compression and bore scope...and an oil sample. I guess worse case scenario they can buy the car from me, since the book value is about the same, or less, than an engine. These little engines are outrageous. Used engine with same mileage around $1500-1800 plus labor, new one with labor is 3600-4800, depending where they source the engine. I am not going to put 3000-5000 in this car, it is not worth it. I can buy a 2018 with 20K for 10,000. The book value is around $5000.
Kia said they can take top end off and check cams, rockers and whatever else is in there....for $300-400. But they cant inspect the main bearings without disassembly, and I didn't even get a price on that. The car does not have oil pressure shut off, so I have no idea why it stalled, unless it seized and freed up when it cooled.
I am really most frustrated because she just put $1000 in this engine on all new AC system and $300+ on new tires.....not even 2 months ago, and she still owes $2000 on the car loan, so even if they would total and give blue book, she would just be back to even and no car. I am very pleased with management though, they are stand up people and are not trying to dodge blame. I feel bad for them, almost like I am taking advantage of them....but I just don't want to be stuck with this headache later.
Kia said they can take top end off and check cams, rockers and whatever else is in there....for $300-400. But they cant inspect the main bearings without disassembly, and I didn't even get a price on that. The car does not have oil pressure shut off, so I have no idea why it stalled, unless it seized and freed up when it cooled.
I am really most frustrated because she just put $1000 in this engine on all new AC system and $300+ on new tires.....not even 2 months ago, and she still owes $2000 on the car loan, so even if they would total and give blue book, she would just be back to even and no car. I am very pleased with management though, they are stand up people and are not trying to dodge blame. I feel bad for them, almost like I am taking advantage of them....but I just don't want to be stuck with this headache later.
Jaybird1980
Grandmaster
Don't feel bad for them, S*** happens. That's why they have insurance.
Randy repair money spent is just that.....money spent. It really adds no value over what the cars is worth with working AC and fair tires. All part of using a car. You need to get past that. No recoup on this money. Still sucks but that is the reality of it.
Maybe its time to let that one go and move on to the next. I do not want to sound harsh but its a KIA. You drive them until they are worn out or just stop. Wash rinse repeat.
Yeah, I can dig that man. I aint claiming it to be a show car. But whether it is a Kia or a Chevy.....they all turn to junk some day, or in a Chevy and Ford's case, rust away(not no more thankfully). I will say, this has been one of the most reliable vehicles I have seen.....and not sure how many vehicles period can run with no oil, be it a Lambo, Kia, Honda or Chevy. I mean, if the car gets totaled in a wreck you gonna say "Ah, it's just a $5000 Kia that will die someday, don't worry about it" or are you gonna say "Pay me book value" or "fix my car so I can drive it until it dies"? I mean other than the AC, which was caused by hitting a limb in the road...this car has been fine for 30-40K miles. I hate all foreign cars myself, but I got to admit.....it has had less repairs than my 2018 Malibu, that has had 3 issues since bought new and 30,000 miles on it. A brake rotor failed, air in the water system....and I can't remember the 3rd one, something that kept making check engine light come on, a sensor.
But on another note, the big wig from Corporate that oversees all franchises contacted me earlier. I told him what was up and that the franchise owner told me to take to the shop. He said if engine is wasted, they will pay for engine or buy the car for book value, or whatever I think is fair. I thought that was pretty good of them.
Tonight when we took to shop, it sounded to me like it is rattling in the head. I am no mechanic, but I think it left a mark. This to shall pass. If it don't kill you it will make you stronger, lol. So they say.
But on another note, the big wig from Corporate that oversees all franchises contacted me earlier. I told him what was up and that the franchise owner told me to take to the shop. He said if engine is wasted, they will pay for engine or buy the car for book value, or whatever I think is fair. I thought that was pretty good of them.
Tonight when we took to shop, it sounded to me like it is rattling in the head. I am no mechanic, but I think it left a mark. This to shall pass. If it don't kill you it will make you stronger, lol. So they say.
This is likely what happened.
An oil sample analyzed will provide some insight to the damage. Sending a sample to Blackstone Labs is worthwhile ($30?)
They will send free sample containers, just add postage & payment. Add a note that tells them the basics of the story.
While every engine will have some level of metal wear and historical values are always best to compare against, Blackstone will be able to compare with similar samples from other similar engines / mileage to show serious anomalies.
The filter that came off the car when it went back to the shop after the incident would tell the story. Probably long gone but if you could locate it just cut it open and look for what racers call “fools gold” (bearing material) in the pleats of the filter element. Don’t use a saw to cut it open. Poke a hole in it with a big screwdriver and cut ii with snips or use a big pipe cutter or dedicated cutting tool to open it.
