Paul Markel - The Truth About Posers

[esrice]

While I realize the internet is rife with misinformation and bad advice, I noticed that many of the things the author takes to task aren't often regurgitated here on INGO. Perhaps our posters are a bit more sage?

The Truth About Posers | Shooting Wire

 

[Manatee]

I read the piece. It seemed to me he was pretty arrogant talking about the arrogance of others.

yawn

 

[Popeye81]

Paul Markel speaks a lot of truth in what he say's. I follow his podcast Student Of The Gun. He can come across as kind of forward or "matter of fact" at first read or listen but once an individual removes his or her emotion from listening to what he's saying he makes a whole lot of sense. "Posers", "know it alls" and "Ex-Navy Seal" types are a major factor in why I stay the hell away from most gun shops and ranges. Guys that are behind the counters at most gun shops are WAAAAAY to pushy and offer advice that either isn't asked for or necessary.The "know it all" types probably do more harm than good when it comes to attracting and retaining new enthusiast to the firearm community.

 

[LEaSH]

I liked the article. I don't know if the writer is intending to talk down to a certain demographic or eben if hisopinions are even something he's guilty of. But it's nice to see it addressed.

There is so much BS swagger in gunshops anything firearm related.

 

[Spike_351]

the only fault I can find in the article is the part about liability for helping an injured person. I'm not sure how far it could be taken but isn't there a good Samaritan law helping prevent someone from being sued if they help save a life?

 

[actaeon277]

... isn't there a good Samaritan law helping prevent someone from being sued if they help save a life?

Indiana Code 16-31-6

 

[HoughMade]

Indiana Code 16-31-6

Those are great laws.....for certified paramedic and EMTs.

I think what most of us want to know is this:

Indiana Code 34-30-12

 

[actaeon277]

Indiana Code 16-31-6

Those are great laws.....for certified paramedic and EMTs.

I think what most of us want to know is this:

Indiana Code 34-30-12

Thanks. The one I quoted was all I could find. My search skills have been one upped by HoughMade....

 

[Lucas156]

He makes some great points. There is all kinds of bad information regarding guns floating around. People need to start verifying what they hear but I doubt that will happen. I was told yesterday in a FTf transaction that you have to be 21 to buy a rifle private party. Couple weeks before that was told that the lifetime ltch was being eliminated. When asked to back this info up with evidence I just get shrugged shoulders. Dumbasses need to stop spreading misinformation; it just makes it harder for new shooters to understand the laws.

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

The part about the gun shop guy advising the woman on which gun she needs is a good point, but I'm not sure he made it completely.

I'm sure there are great guys at some gun shops, and who have forgotten more about guns than I'll ever know.

But, if you don't know which gun you need before you go into the shop, then you are not ready to buy one yet and you would do yourself a favor to learn a lot more before you do. Maybe it's just me, but the questions I ask about guns pertain to which models are available, barrel lengths, calibers, stuff like that. Not "which gun is best for home defense?" or "which gun would you recommend for a woman?"

I wouldn't ask the dude at Lowe's whether or not I can span a 20 foot building roof with my 2X6's on 24 inch centers, I just ask him to point me toward the lumber.

 

[92ThoStro]

the only fault I can find in the article is the part about liability for helping an injured person. I'm not sure how far it could be taken but isn't there a good Samaritan law helping prevent someone from being sued if they help save a life?

The author was FOR helping people, and said it was stupid that people worry about liability, but at the same time spout off about shooting them twice in the chest and once in the face for good measure.
We must have read different articles.....


I got the impression the author was anti-45 though

I do like the part where he talked about over-penetration.
When I shot a groundhog in the head with 12'00 buck shot, I found the pellets stuck in his head when I skinned it. And people say if you shoot someone with buckshot it will go through them, through the wall, through the neighbors house, and kill their sleeping child.

 

[GeneralCarver]

I read the piece. It seemed to me he was pretty arrogant talking about the arrogance of others.

yawn

I felt the same way. And I have seen this trend with A LOT of the so called "professionals" in the firearms training industry.

I am especially sick of these professionals knocking on people that carry sub compact firearms (.25 autos, .32 acp, .380s. etc.) and also on people who buy firearms which are easy for them to manipulate (i.e., tiny woman who hates autos but likes revolvers). They act like everyone and their grandma can work a Glock 19 perfectly if they just "really try". (and that's coming from someone who carries a Glock 17 every day!)

 

[GeneralCarver]

.... Couple weeks before that was told that the lifetime ltch was being eliminated. When asked to back this info up with evidence I just get shrugged shoulders......

I work at a gun store and I am FLOORED at the number of people who come in and I hear make this comment. Some jackass a long time ago must have started this rumor and its been floating around in the midwest shooting culture around Indiana for years.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I felt the same way. And I have seen this trend with A LOT of the so called "professionals" in the firearms training industry.

I am especially sick of these professionals knocking on people that carry sub compact firearms (.25 autos, .32 acp, .380s. etc.) and also on people who buy firearms which are easy for them to manipulate (i.e., tiny woman who hates autos but likes revolvers). They act like everyone and their grandma can work a Glock 19 perfectly if they just "really try". (and that's coming from someone who carries a Glock 17 every day!)

+11!!

 

[92ThoStro]

It's your life, if you trust your life on a .25 or .32 ACP then go ahead. I carried a .32 S&W LONG, before I carried my .45ACP, but only because it was the only handgun I had. You should carry the best, biggest, and baddest weapon you can shoot.

Why would you carry a Glock 36 with a 6 round mag when you can carry a 21 with a 13 round mag? Why carry .380 instead of 9mm? Why carry single stack instead of double stack? And I too firmly believe that almost everyone can operate a 9mm Glock. Women only act like they are too weak to rack the slide. I remember last time I brought up jars. When a man is around a lot of women will ask them to open a jar. They are perfectly able to open that jar on their own. What do you think single women do when they need something opened? Oh, that's right, they don't buy anything with a lid from the store! LOL
Women are not weak, they can rack a slide.

There ARE legitimate reasons to not carry a semi-auto. Like having bad arthritis, or a missing hand, or other health issues that prevent you from racking a slide.

But just being "generally weak" or assuming others are, is ridiculous.

But if your preference is for revolvers, because you believe they are more reliable, you like the revolver calibers more, etc, then go ahead. As long as you admit it's for preference, and not because you are too weak. I carry one as a backup, and felt safe carrying one as my primary. I like revolvers, but I do think that the capacity of modern semi autos, and the improved self defense rounds available in .45 and 9mm make them essential. One problem I see is that many people don't carry spare mags or speed loaders.

 

[GeneralCarver]

...Why would you carry a Glock 36 with a 6 round mag when you can carry a 21 with a 13 round mag?....

Why carry a small gun in a small caliber? When concealment is most important to you. That's it. No other reason. yeah man, I'd rather carry my Glock 17. But there are many times I carry the G26 to conceal better.

Continuing.. in general.. the average person will not adjust their lifestyle or dress to carry a gun. You and I will because we're gun love'n freaks. But for the average person, if they don't buy a gun that fits their lifestyle/dress, they usually end up not carrying anything a majority of the time... when they may need a gun. Any gun is better than no gun.

And why is any gun better than no gun? Because I say play the odds. More than likely if you need to use a firearms in defense, most people experience pulling the gun, shooting it, or hitting the person and that attacker flees. Its rare for the attacker to be so motivated that they sustain multiple hits and continue the attack. So from that stand point, any gun will do you for most situations.

There ARE legitimate reasons to not carry a semi-auto. Like having bad arthritis, or a missing hand, or other health issues that prevent you from racking a slide.

But just being "generally weak" or assuming others are, is ridiculous.

Work at a gun store for a year, and you will quickly lose this perspective after you meet people (mostly elderly or small in statue women) who have a lot of trouble manipulating slides on a vast majority of semi automatic pistols on the market.

Yes, many of them might do some squeeze ball exercises with their hands and develop more strength for using a particular gun. But most people won't do that. They WANT to carry a gun, but its not something they feel they NEED every day, so they won't put work like that into it. So you have to get them a firearm they can operate at their normal level of strength.

 

[BugI02]

Semi-auto or wheel gun, single stack or 16+1, light fast round or slower and heavier - "De gustibus non est disputandem" (In matters of taste there can be no dispute). Wisdom so ancient the romans knew it.

But even the praetorian guard was helpless before the cult of the MCMXI

 

[Double T]

I've felt some of the "trauma" BS on here. I'm not an EMT but I am a medical professional. I know how to stop bleeding as well as other trauma. I've gotten the idea that because I'm not "out there" my opinion is irrelevant, so I typically have quit posting in medical question threads.

 

[Dirtball]

Back when I had a utube account, probably about 6 yrs ago I got into an argument over my Bond Arms Texas Ranger in .410. I was told how this pistol would get me killed because the short barrels lost all velocity and that the buckshot would "bounce off" the bad guy. There was no talking about the idiocy he was preaching because he just knew better. There is truth in this article, albeit in a smug tone.

 

[shooter521]

But, if you don't know which gun you need before you go into the shop, then you are not ready to buy one yet

The majority of customers I see in the shop daily do not know which gun they "need" (want) before they show up. And, I believe, they don't really care. As long as the gun fits their hand and feels good, has the features they want, and is in a price range they are comfortable with, it doesn't matter to them whether it's a Springfield, Taurus, Ruger, S&W, Glock, etc. That is, they're not "gun people".

Add to that the fact that researching online or in magazines only goes so far; I've had many, MANY customers come in with a particular gun in mind, only to change their mind once they'd actually gotten their "ideal" gun in hand. Trying different things and asking questions to a real human person is an important part of the selection process.

"which gun would you recommend for a woman?"

I hate that question; my response is always "depends on the woman." I had a lady in the other day who prefaced her question with "now don't treat me like a woman, give me your honest opinion". I said "how 'bout I treat you like a customer, because that's what you are?" The light came on in her mind just then, and we had a pleasant transaction.